comment by KLS - Harry Kane wears Mo Salah pyjamas (U1695)
posted 12 minutes ago
comment by Mr Brightside (U22216)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by KLS - Harry Kane wears Mo Salah pyjamas (U1695)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Mr Brightside (U22216)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by KLS - Harry Kane wears Mo Salah pyjamas (U1695)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Mr Brightside (U22216)
posted 29 seconds ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 23 minutes ago
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 38 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 53 minutes ago
I think it’d hit Liverpool the hardest - take VVD and Salah out for the season and I think they take a big tumble.
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I think we'd be fourth at the very least but likely second.
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I agree you'd be top four, but as I say, I think it'd hit you the hardest.
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How is that hit the hardest then if we'd have achieved the same as everybody expects us to anyhow?

I think hit the hardest needs defined here.
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You dont think there is much difference in finishing where you did last season and scraping 4th?
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Who says we’d be scraping top 4?

If everyone is losing their best 2 players then everyone is dropping points. The you’d be worse of than everyone else is laughable.


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You said probably get top 4
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No i didn’t.
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OK. Where would you finish without VVD and Mane for the season?
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If everyone is losing they’re best 2 players or is this imaginary situation only affecting Liverpool?

Because if everyone is losing they’re best players I think we’d finish in very much the same position as last season, behind City.
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Each club but not at the same time.

comment by Robb - Steve Smith = Legend 🏏🏆 (U21234)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Robb - Steve Smith = Legend 🏏🏆 (U21234)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Mr Brightside (U22216)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Robb - Steve Smith = Legend 🏏🏆 (U21234)
posted 24 minutes ago
If we lost our best two players I doubt we’d make top 6
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Take VVD and Mane out of Liverpools side and they would concede loads more (remember before they signed him?) and lose 30 goals.

None of the others would lose so much influence and not be able to replace ot / some of it.
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Take Pogba out of our side and we have zero creativity and the worst midfield in the top 9/10 sides

Take Maguire out and our defence is worse than a Liverpool side even without VVD
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Do you remember Liverpool pre VVD?

In fact, even with him they tightened up a lot last season. Credit to Klopp there, he abandoned his "Heavy Metal Football" to produce a brilliantly effective side.
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You’re forgetting how good Gomez is and while VVD is hugely important to them they could do well with a defence of Trent, Gomez, Matip and Robertson.

It would be a better defence than what we’d be able to put out with Maguire gone.

And their attack would more than compensate. They were still pretty good without VVD.
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Gomez is talented, but he has started this season badly hence being dropped.

TAA & Robertson hit ridiculously high levels last season and I expect they will struggle to match those standards again this time around.

So far, their defence doesn't look as solid.

comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 9 seconds ago
comment by Robb - Steve Smith = Legend 🏏🏆 (U21234)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Robb - Steve Smith = Legend 🏏🏆 (U21234)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Mr Brightside (U22216)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Robb - Steve Smith = Legend 🏏🏆 (U21234)
posted 24 minutes ago
If we lost our best two players I doubt we’d make top 6
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Take VVD and Mane out of Liverpools side and they would concede loads more (remember before they signed him?) and lose 30 goals.

None of the others would lose so much influence and not be able to replace ot / some of it.
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Take Pogba out of our side and we have zero creativity and the worst midfield in the top 9/10 sides

Take Maguire out and our defence is worse than a Liverpool side even without VVD
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Do you remember Liverpool pre VVD?

In fact, even with him they tightened up a lot last season. Credit to Klopp there, he abandoned his "Heavy Metal Football" to produce a brilliantly effective side.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

You’re forgetting how good Gomez is and while VVD is hugely important to them they could do well with a defence of Trent, Gomez, Matip and Robertson.

It would be a better defence than what we’d be able to put out with Maguire gone.

And their attack would more than compensate. They were still pretty good without VVD.
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Gomez is talented, but he has started this season badly hence being dropped.

TAA & Robertson hit ridiculously high levels last season and I expect they will struggle to match those standards again this time around.

So far, their defence doesn't look as solid.
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That goes for VvD too

The question here is what team would struggle more without their two best players. Liverpool could absorb that blow more than we could.

Gomez is talented, but he has started this season badly hence being dropped.

TAA & Robertson hit ridiculously high levels last season and I expect they will struggle to match those standards again this time around.

So far, their defence doesn't look as solid.
- - - - - - - -

The loss of last seasons best keeper, Gomez returning from being out of action for a large part of last season and I wouldn’t say he’s been dropped, Matip has earned the right to play next to Virgil.

He’s been superb.

Our defence has conceded the same as City at this point.

"Matip has earned the right to play next to Virgil"

Very true, he has. Fair to say that Gomes was given the nod to start the season though but he made a few errors.

Conceding the same as City doesn't mean much, they aren't the best at the back. Their full backs are poor and their centre halves get a lot less protection than Liverpools due to the nature of their game.

If City lost KdB & Aguero for the season they'd be fine. Their squad strength is exceptional.

If Liverpool lost VVD & Mane/Salah (depending on who you see as better) then we'd probably play Gomez and Matip as CBs and bring in either Origi or Ox. We wouldn't challenge for the title but that's still a top 4 team IMO.

Chelsea losing Kante & Rudiger for a whole season would leave them very vulnerable in defence. Could see them conceding a lot of goals. But I'm not sure they'll be getting top 4 anyway so would it massively affect them? Possibly not.

Utd I'm not even sure who their best players are given DDG dip in form and the inconsistency of Pogba, Rashford and Martial (their 3 goal scorers). What I would say is that without 2 of the last 3 players you'd struggle to see where the goals come from.

Ditto Arsenal if they lost Lacazette and PEA - the goals dry up and the defence isn't good enough to compensate.

Spurs; losing Kane and Eriksen would be a problem in terms of both creativity and finishing. But they do have other creative players in Dele (if he recovers form) and Son. Kane's finishing would be a big hole though. I think their defence and midfield (think N'dombele will prove a hit) is still pretty solid though.

Personally I think if either Arsenal or Utd lost the goals from their 2 main scorers then that's top 4 gone.

comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 35 seconds ago
"Matip has earned the right to play next to Virgil"

Very true, he has. Fair to say that Gomes was given the nod to start the season though but he made a few errors.

Conceding the same as City doesn't mean much, they aren't the best at the back. Their full backs are poor and their centre halves get a lot less protection than Liverpools due to the nature of their game.
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They had the second best defensive record last season after us, one worse off.

And Gomez played the first game which we won 4-1 and matip came back in, hardly dropped!

comment by KLS - Harry Kane wears Mo Salah pyjamas (U1695)
posted 23 minutes ago
And Gomez played the first game which we won 4-1 and matip came back in, hardly dropped!
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And you almost conceded two in the first 10. Then Norwich cut you open with ease for the goal.

comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by KLS - Harry Kane wears Mo Salah pyjamas (U1695)
posted 23 minutes ago
And Gomez played the first game which we won 4-1 and matip came back in, hardly dropped!
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And you almost conceded two in the first 10. Then Norwich cut you open with ease for the goal.
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When they were 4-0 down, is any chance now almost conceding?

Norwich will surprise a few this season.

is any chance now almost conceding?

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Yes, of course.

For me it would have to be one of Spurs, Chelsea, United or Arsenal as losing their two best players would likely mean they don't finish top four. Or even City if Liverpool won the league after they lost their two best.

comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 28 minutes ago
For me it would have to be one of Spurs, Chelsea, United or Arsenal as losing their two best players would likely mean they don't finish top four. Or even City if Liverpool won the league after they lost their two best.
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And we'll just ignore the fact that Liverpool losing their two best players may all but end any hope you have of catching City?

comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 1 hour, 56 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 28 minutes ago
For me it would have to be one of Spurs, Chelsea, United or Arsenal as losing their two best players would likely mean they don't finish top four. Or even City if Liverpool won the league after they lost their two best.
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And we'll just ignore the fact that Liverpool losing their two best players may all but end any hope you have of catching City?
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Well yes, fair point. But then you can't judge whether any of these teams were gonna win the title/make top four even with the two players.

comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 38 minutes ago
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 1 hour, 56 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 28 minutes ago
For me it would have to be one of Spurs, Chelsea, United or Arsenal as losing their two best players would likely mean they don't finish top four. Or even City if Liverpool won the league after they lost their two best.
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And we'll just ignore the fact that Liverpool losing their two best players may all but end any hope you have of catching City?
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Well yes, fair point. But then you can't judge whether any of these teams were gonna win the title/make top four even with the two players.
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Of course, which is why I think it's best to consider which team is relatively weaker due to their loss rather than how this loss might affect their league position.

comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 3 hours, 11 minutes ago
For me it would have to be one of Spurs, Chelsea, United or Arsenal as losing their two best players would likely mean they don't finish top four. Or even City if Liverpool won the league after they lost their two best.
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Well they lost KDB last season and still beat yas

comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 3 hours, 11 minutes ago
For me it would have to be one of Spurs, Chelsea, United or Arsenal as losing their two best players would likely mean they don't finish top four. Or even City if Liverpool won the league after they lost their two best.
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Well they lost KDB last season and still beat yas
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Incredible isn't it.

comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 2 hours, 7 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 3 hours, 11 minutes ago
For me it would have to be one of Spurs, Chelsea, United or Arsenal as losing their two best players would likely mean they don't finish top four. Or even City if Liverpool won the league after they lost their two best.
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Well they lost KDB last season and still beat yas
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Yes. If they had also lost Aguero, perhaps they wouldn't have and they you could say they were impacted more than anybody else could have been.

comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 33 minutes ago
comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 2 hours, 7 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 3 hours, 11 minutes ago
For me it would have to be one of Spurs, Chelsea, United or Arsenal as losing their two best players would likely mean they don't finish top four. Or even City if Liverpool won the league after they lost their two best.
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Well they lost KDB last season and still beat yas
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Yes. If they had also lost Aguero, perhaps they wouldn't have and they you could say they were impacted more than anybody else could have been.
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This makes absolutely no sense.

Why do some people seem to take this as a slight against their team?

I wish United had a few players that were good enough to be regarded as a devastating loss.

Bizarre isnt it.

I thought it was a good question that would have threw up lots of.den9ate but instead it's just Liverpool fans (handsome United) arguing they would still finish 2nd without VVD and Mane.

comment by Mr Brightside (U22216)
posted 17 minutes ago
Bizarre isnt it.

I thought it was a good question that would have threw up lots of.den9ate but instead it's just Liverpool fans (handsome United) arguing they would still finish 2nd without VVD and Mane.
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“I'm right though. Our rivals for 4th would feel the loss of.key player.morw than we would”

Are you sure you didn’t just start this thread to prove a point you’d been arguing with Robb on an earlier thread? It wasn’t just a way of making out that United fans who didn’t agree were “whinging”?

My point remains: take VVD and Mane (or Salah) from Liverpool and I reckon they’d still finish third/fourth and certainly above us. Take any two from De Gea, Pogba, Rashford, Martial and Maguire from us and I doubt we’d get sixth. Who’s been more “impacted” is hard to define.

You can’t really say “Gomes for Pogba” and “Greenwood for Rashford” as if they’re ready-made replacements. We have no idea how they’ll do in the first team and this season is a steep learning curve for them. How many youngsters have we brought through in the last 5-10 years who’ve seamlessly slotted in to replace established players?

As I’ve said, I’m very pleased to see young players being given this chance but I’m realistic about where we are.

4th for Liverpool would be a very bad season after last season.

We on the other hand managed to finish 6th last season with a poor DDG, No Maguire, and none of the others playing particularly.well.

comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 4 hours, 16 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 33 minutes ago
comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 2 hours, 7 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 3 hours, 11 minutes ago
For me it would have to be one of Spurs, Chelsea, United or Arsenal as losing their two best players would likely mean they don't finish top four. Or even City if Liverpool won the league after they lost their two best.
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Well they lost KDB last season and still beat yas
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Yes. If they had also lost Aguero, perhaps they wouldn't have and they you could say they were impacted more than anybody else could have been.
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This makes absolutely no sense.
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What is it you don't understand?