the same herrera that got sent off against hazard around the same time?

Scholes is utds best holding midfielder probably when he started to sit back.

You forgot the best and most archetypal one: Michael Carrick

OK, I will sink my teeth into the bait:

Mr Observer, where is Michael Carrick on your list?

comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 36 seconds ago
You forgot the best and most archetypal one: Michael Carrick
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I think we're about to discover that he didn't forget Carrick; he just didn't make the cut.

FFS

comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 1 minute ago
You forgot the best and most archetypal one: Michael Carrick
----------------------------------------------------------------------
yeah

1.scholes
2.carrick

surely the correct order

comment by Nickasaurus (U9257)
posted 30 seconds ago
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 1 minute ago
You forgot the best and most archetypal one: Michael Carrick
----------------------------------------------------------------------
yeah

1.scholes
2.carrick

surely the correct order
----------------------------------------------------------------------
When I say holding midfielder (perhaps I am older than you) I mean a traditional holding player. Someone who gets stuck in, wins the ball back etc.

Carrick and Scholes couldn't do that. They were more technical footballers.

comment by Clockwork Red (U4892)
posted 2 minutes ago
OK, I will sink my teeth into the bait:

Mr Observer, where is Michael Carrick on your list?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Carrick was a quarterback. He wasn't a holding midfielder. A holding midfielder wins back possession, gets stuck in and puts fires out.

What is this mess?

comment by ShamelessObserver (U22372)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Nickasaurus (U9257)
posted 30 seconds ago
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 1 minute ago
You forgot the best and most archetypal one: Michael Carrick
----------------------------------------------------------------------
yeah

1.scholes
2.carrick

surely the correct order
----------------------------------------------------------------------
When I say holding midfielder (perhaps I am older than you) I mean a traditional holding player. Someone who gets stuck in, wins the ball back etc.

Carrick and Scholes couldn't do that. They were more technical footballers.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
but they held. Your confusing player positions for player roles.

For example, leicester winning the league, kante was the one who got stuck in etc but drinkwater was the holding midfielder.

comment by Nickasaurus (U9257)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by ShamelessObserver (U22372)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Nickasaurus (U9257)
posted 30 seconds ago
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 1 minute ago
You forgot the best and most archetypal one: Michael Carrick
----------------------------------------------------------------------
yeah

1.scholes
2.carrick

surely the correct order
----------------------------------------------------------------------
When I say holding midfielder (perhaps I am older than you) I mean a traditional holding player. Someone who gets stuck in, wins the ball back etc.

Carrick and Scholes couldn't do that. They were more technical footballers.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
but they held. Your confusing player positions for player roles.

For example, leicester winning the league, kante was the one who got stuck in etc but drinkwater was the holding midfielder.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You don't understand the traditional meaning of a holding midfielder

Good grief. WTF is this total mess of an article.

Aborticle

comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 1 minute ago
Good grief. WTF is this total mess of an article.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
A United fan requested this article.

For me whoever had play next to Scholes to deal with his defensive shortcomings has to top the list.

I think a ‘holding’ midfielder would be one who holds the team together which was exactly what Carrick did. Matic does pretty much the same role but not to the same standard and you have his first?

comment by ShamelessObserver (U22372)
posted 38 seconds ago
comment by Nickasaurus (U9257)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by ShamelessObserver (U22372)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Nickasaurus (U9257)
posted 30 seconds ago
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 1 minute ago
You forgot the best and most archetypal one: Michael Carrick
----------------------------------------------------------------------
yeah

1.scholes
2.carrick

surely the correct order
----------------------------------------------------------------------
When I say holding midfielder (perhaps I am older than you) I mean a traditional holding player. Someone who gets stuck in, wins the ball back etc.

Carrick and Scholes couldn't do that. They were more technical footballers.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
but they held. Your confusing player positions for player roles.

For example, leicester winning the league, kante was the one who got stuck in etc but drinkwater was the holding midfielder.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You don't understand the traditional meaning of a holding midfielder
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I would say that "holding midfielder" is defined by disciplined positioning more than anything else, such as combativeness or physicality. For instance, Fletcher at his best would get stuck in but he'd do it up and down the pitch, and would chip in with a few goals. I wouldn't call him a holding midfielder: what was he "holding"? Carrick wasn't as physical but would sit just in front of the defence, shield them by making timely interceptions etc, and try to dictate the play from deep.

I wouldn't have Fletcher as a holding midfielder. He used to tear around a bit from what I remember.

comment by ShamelessObserver (U22372)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by Nickasaurus (U9257)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by ShamelessObserver (U22372)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Nickasaurus (U9257)
posted 30 seconds ago
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 1 minute ago
You forgot the best and most archetypal one: Michael Carrick
----------------------------------------------------------------------
yeah

1.scholes
2.carrick

surely the correct order
----------------------------------------------------------------------
When I say holding midfielder (perhaps I am older than you) I mean a traditional holding player. Someone who gets stuck in, wins the ball back etc.

Carrick and Scholes couldn't do that. They were more technical footballers.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
but they held. Your confusing player positions for player roles.

For example, leicester winning the league, kante was the one who got stuck in etc but drinkwater was the holding midfielder.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You don't understand the traditional meaning of a holding midfielder
----------------------------------------------------------------------
yeah the person who watched makelele every week

I think your struggling to get it in all honesty.

"When I say holding midfielder (perhaps I am older than you) I mean a traditional holding player. Someone who gets stuck in, wins the ball back etc."

Then puts matic top who is averaging less than 2 tackles a game.

comment by Barefoot (U19770)
posted 10 minutes ago
I wouldn't have Fletcher as a holding midfielder. He used to tear around a bit from what I remember.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

No United fan would have him as a holding midfielder. Nor Scholes either.

No Carrick or Djemba-Djemba? Sharticle.

And Fletcher wasn't a holding midfield player - he sometimes played on the right of midfield or as a box-to-box player. And Hargreaves also spent much of his limited time on the pitch at RM or even RB on occasion. And Hargreaves biggest weakness was that he wasn't very good or willing to take the ball from his defence and start moves. He much preferred to being chasing the ball down and winning it back or running up and down the line and putting in crosses (he had a very good cross and set piece).

For me, to be classed as a top holding midfielder, you have to be able to do more than just win the ball back. You have to be able to take the ball and get things going, start moves, get the ball between the lines and shape the play. Hargreaves didn't have that in his locker at all.

comment by Nickasaurus (U9257)
posted 30 minutes ago
comment by ShamelessObserver (U22372)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Nickasaurus (U9257)
posted 30 seconds ago
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 1 minute ago
You forgot the best and most archetypal one: Michael Carrick
----------------------------------------------------------------------
yeah

1.scholes
2.carrick

surely the correct order
----------------------------------------------------------------------
When I say holding midfielder (perhaps I am older than you) I mean a traditional holding player. Someone who gets stuck in, wins the ball back etc.

Carrick and Scholes couldn't do that. They were more technical footballers.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
but they held. Your confusing player positions for player roles.

For example, leicester winning the league, kante was the one who got stuck in etc but drinkwater was the holding midfielder.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We could do with loaning Drinkerwater back, he was great at finding Vardy. Not that Vardy is lost or anything.

You've confused holding midfielder with defensive midfielder.

Matic is probably the only one you've had for years who actually fits.

Carrick and Scholes later in his career were holding midfielders.

1. Rooney
2. Scholes
3. Carrick
4. Matic
5. Schneiderlain

comment by Benjamin Kallman (U1734)
posted 1 minute ago
1. Rooney
2. Scholes
3. Carrick
4. Matic
5. Schneiderlain
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm surprised Rooney only made the top five once.