comment by Jinja Ninja (U19849)
posted 23 seconds ago
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 5 seconds ago
comment by Jinja Ninja (U19849)
posted 13 seconds ago
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 13 seconds ago
Theist Religion by definition is believing in baseless nonsense. The danger is if you can believe and ultimately care about one bit of baseless nonsense then you're always ripe/open for something else bend your mind even further into fantasy
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What a load of bol lox
Believing in theistic religion can be as much an informed choice as believing in anything
----------------------------------------------------------------------
How so?
"Theist
a person who believes in the existence of a god or gods, specifically of a creator who intervenes in the universe."
----------------------------------------------------------------------
My own journey is the best example.
I don't necessarily agree with that definition. Especially the last bit. Intervention is a huge issue that's been discussed in detail and first stand up to that definition
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No worries, I think it's best we leave it at that
Writings in a book
Voices in the head
Messages from god
What’s the difference, over the years countless people have used them as excuses for serial killing/mass murder
comment by Geoff Tipps (U1449)
posted 24 minutes ago
Writings in a book
Voices in the head
Messages from god
What’s the difference, over the years countless people have used them as excuses for serial killing/mass murder
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Mao, stalin, tito, pol pot say hello
So the attacker had an austrian and macedonian citizenship
Had served 22 months for trying to travel and join IS
Austrian Chancellor Sebastian Kurz said on Wednesday it was clearly an attack driven by "hatred of our way of life, our democracy".
This is not directly or specifically about God or organised religion as an end... Its about the difference/gap/void/inequality/jealousies... call it what you want... between Western and Middle Eastern/North African culture and economies, of which some people cannot square.
The majority of peaceful, practicing muslims who live in Western European societies choose to happily enjoy the moral freedoms, opportunities, security, education and wealth it creates for themselves and for their families, over a harder and simpler life in their poor, underdeveloped, war torn, and unstable countries of origin, without any question, whatsoever.
Unfortunately it takes just a few dissociated, ill educated, and well groomed and readicalised, nut cases (lets be honest), to created the fear and terror that reactions to these atrocities are designed to create.
There is no real answer except for exclusion (banish them all back to where they came from) and/or division (divide and build a wall). Both totally against the fundamental freedoms that we hold dear.
It's the price we have had to pay in the West for our own liberal development. And it will continue.
But it is not really about God or the 'fairy stories' in Holy Scriptures. Is it.
Plus the fact the West has shiiiiiiiiit all over the Middle East and Africa.
Plus the fact the West has shiiiiiiiiit all over the Middle East and Africa.
++
It has. But you cant turn that clock back. We have to move on. Or else there is no point.
Mandela was right about that.
comment by RB&W (U21434)
posted 1 minute ago
Plus the fact the West has shiiiiiiiiit all over the Middle East and Africa.
++
It has. But you cant turn that clock back. We have to move on. Or else there is no point.
Mandela was right about that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not that simple mate.
I'm from a immigrant background and just because "we" have moved on here doesn't mean people over there have or been allowed to. Just look at the current Kashmir lockdown where Indian army is violating Muslims. All because the initial plan to sort the region wasn't followed and a divide and rule policy has meant years of senseless deaths.
I'm sure if I become PM then I might take mandela's view
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
I'm from a immigrant background and just because "we" have moved on here doesn't mean people over there have or been allowed to. Just look at the current Kashmir lockdown where Indian army is violating Muslims. All because the initial plan to sort the region wasn't followed and a divide and rule policy has meant years of senseless deaths.
++
So what are you are actually saying.
Murdering random Austrians is therefore justified because Indian authorities are violating Kashmir muslims, caused allegedly by a historically bad solution?
comment by RB&W (U21434)
posted 2 minutes ago
I'm from a immigrant background and just because "we" have moved on here doesn't mean people over there have or been allowed to. Just look at the current Kashmir lockdown where Indian army is violating Muslims. All because the initial plan to sort the region wasn't followed and a divide and rule policy has meant years of senseless deaths.
++
So what are you are actually saying.
Murdering random Austrians is therefore justified because Indian authorities are violating Kashmir muslims, caused allegedly by a historically bad solution?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bit of a stretch that
Might not be a popular opinion but every bit of terrorism I've seen in my lifetime, from the RA to Jihad linked, seems a bit like payback.
Our foreign policy seems pretty disgusting and we make an awful lot of money selling guns and much worse.
Stop doing it.
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Jinja Ninja (U19849)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by RB&W (U21434)
posted 1 minute ago
Plus the fact the West has shiiiiiiiiit all over the Middle East and Africa.
++
It has. But you cant turn that clock back. We have to move on. Or else there is no point.
Mandela was right about that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not that simple mate.
I'm from a immigrant background and just because "we" have moved on here doesn't mean people over there have or been allowed to. Just look at the current Kashmir lockdown where Indian army is violating Muslims. All because the initial plan to sort the region wasn't followed and a divide and rule policy has meant years of senseless deaths.
I'm sure if I become PM then I might take mandela's view
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Kashmir is a mess though. From the intial divide. The owner was Hindu and the majority were Muslim iirc. How was that ever going to end well?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bit more to it than that. The K in pakistan was for Kashmir as agreed. The Hindu guy overnight gave rights to the Indians, against what was agreed and it was allowed to happen. Subsequent wars all.lead to that issie
comment by RB&W (U21434)
posted 8 minutes ago
I'm from a immigrant background and just because "we" have moved on here doesn't mean people over there have or been allowed to. Just look at the current Kashmir lockdown where Indian army is violating Muslims. All because the initial plan to sort the region wasn't followed and a divide and rule policy has meant years of senseless deaths.
++
So what are you are actually saying.
Murdering random Austrians is therefore justified because Indian authorities are violating Kashmir muslims, caused allegedly by a historically bad solution?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wow that's a leap innit?
I was responding to the point of moving on.
I agree moving on is something that should happen. However it's not as simple as that for people in other regions and countries etc.
It's easy for me even as someone from Kashmir to move on as I live in england, educated here, house, car etc
Having been to Kashmir in the late 80's and speaking to a man who had seen his wife blown up and daughter raped by what he said was indian forces not so easy to move on from
comment by RB&W (U21434)
posted 1 hour, 18 minutes ago
Plus the fact the West has shiiiiiiiiit all over the Middle East and Africa.
++
It has. But you cant turn that clock back. We have to move on. Or else there is no point.
Mandela was right about that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You don't have to turn back the clock if it's still happening.... which it is.
comment by Kung Fu Cantona 🙏🏼 🇵🇸 (U18082)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by RB&W (U21434)
posted 1 hour, 18 minutes ago
Plus the fact the West has shiiiiiiiiit all over the Middle East and Africa.
++
It has. But you cant turn that clock back. We have to move on. Or else there is no point.
Mandela was right about that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You don't have to turn back the clock if it's still happening.... which it is.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Much more succinctly put than how I did
That was my point.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
Bit of a stretch that
++
Spin it how you want. Why bring it up?
Having been to Kashmir in the late 80's and speaking to a man who had seen his wife blown up and daughter raped by what he said was indian forces not so easy to move on from
+++
I know of people who have seen exactly the same things happen to innocent people in the UK (in NI specifically.)
But we have hopefully moved on from that. It is possible if there is a political will.
I very much doubt that Kashmir is the root of this Vienna atrocity. Unless you know something that the Austrian GVT are not letting on about right now, ....
Then share it!
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 38 seconds ago
comment by Jinja Ninja (U19849)
posted 1 hour, 13 minutes ago
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Jinja Ninja (U19849)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by RB&W (U21434)
posted 1 minute ago
Plus the fact the West has shiiiiiiiiit all over the Middle East and Africa.
++
It has. But you cant turn that clock back. We have to move on. Or else there is no point.
Mandela was right about that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not that simple mate.
I'm from a immigrant background and just because "we" have moved on here doesn't mean people over there have or been allowed to. Just look at the current Kashmir lockdown where Indian army is violating Muslims. All because the initial plan to sort the region wasn't followed and a divide and rule policy has meant years of senseless deaths.
I'm sure if I become PM then I might take mandela's view
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Kashmir is a mess though. From the intial divide. The owner was Hindu and the majority were Muslim iirc. How was that ever going to end well?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bit more to it than that. The K in pakistan was for Kashmir as agreed. The Hindu guy overnight gave rights to the Indians, against what was agreed and it was allowed to happen. Subsequent wars all.lead to that issie
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Against what was agreed? Well obviously not by the person who owned it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The dealing place was to allow people to vote who they wanted to belong to, india or pakistan
The majority of kashmiris were Muslim so the outcome was inevitable.
Lord mountbatten oversaw the accessions by the then maharaja. The accession was part of a hleo olea and the proviso was that a vote would take place once things had settled
Never happened
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
Lord Mountbatten was executed in a terrorist attack.
Isn't that justice enough for you?
History is a gift that we can learn by it's mistakes.
We don't have to live by History's mistakes
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 43 minutes ago
comment by Jinja Ninja (U19849)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 38 seconds ago
comment by Jinja Ninja (U19849)
posted 1 hour, 13 minutes ago
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Jinja Ninja (U19849)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by RB&W (U21434)
posted 1 minute ago
Plus the fact the West has shiiiiiiiiit all over the Middle East and Africa.
++
It has. But you cant turn that clock back. We have to move on. Or else there is no point.
Mandela was right about that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not that simple mate.
I'm from a immigrant background and just because "we" have moved on here doesn't mean people over there have or been allowed to. Just look at the current Kashmir lockdown where Indian army is violating Muslims. All because the initial plan to sort the region wasn't followed and a divide and rule policy has meant years of senseless deaths.
I'm sure if I become PM then I might take mandela's view
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Kashmir is a mess though. From the intial divide. The owner was Hindu and the majority were Muslim iirc. How was that ever going to end well?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bit more to it than that. The K in pakistan was for Kashmir as agreed. The Hindu guy overnight gave rights to the Indians, against what was agreed and it was allowed to happen. Subsequent wars all.lead to that issie
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Against what was agreed? Well obviously not by the person who owned it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The dealing place was to allow people to vote who they wanted to belong to, india or pakistan
The majority of kashmiris were Muslim so the outcome was inevitable.
Lord mountbatten oversaw the accessions by the then maharaja. The accession was part of a hleo olea and the proviso was that a vote would take place once things had settled
Never happened
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From my reading the Hindu prince didn't agree to the vote deciding prior to it because he knew it was majority Muslim. He wanted to stay independent.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Didn't have choice mate. He was sikh but like other regions in the area the Brits dictated what would happen
comment by RB&W (U21434)
posted 43 minutes ago
Lord Mountbatten was executed in a terrorist attack.
Isn't that justice enough for you?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Me personally? Before my time
The people in lockdown and in being murdered currently in Kashmir may disagree
Sign in if you want to comment
Vienna
Page 4 of 5
posted on 3/11/20
Doesn't not first
posted on 3/11/20
comment by Jinja Ninja (U19849)
posted 23 seconds ago
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 5 seconds ago
comment by Jinja Ninja (U19849)
posted 13 seconds ago
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 13 seconds ago
Theist Religion by definition is believing in baseless nonsense. The danger is if you can believe and ultimately care about one bit of baseless nonsense then you're always ripe/open for something else bend your mind even further into fantasy
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What a load of bol lox
Believing in theistic religion can be as much an informed choice as believing in anything
----------------------------------------------------------------------
How so?
"Theist
a person who believes in the existence of a god or gods, specifically of a creator who intervenes in the universe."
----------------------------------------------------------------------
My own journey is the best example.
I don't necessarily agree with that definition. Especially the last bit. Intervention is a huge issue that's been discussed in detail and first stand up to that definition
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No worries, I think it's best we leave it at that
posted on 3/11/20
Writings in a book
Voices in the head
Messages from god
What’s the difference, over the years countless people have used them as excuses for serial killing/mass murder
posted on 3/11/20
comment by Geoff Tipps (U1449)
posted 24 minutes ago
Writings in a book
Voices in the head
Messages from god
What’s the difference, over the years countless people have used them as excuses for serial killing/mass murder
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Mao, stalin, tito, pol pot say hello
posted on 3/11/20
So the attacker had an austrian and macedonian citizenship
Had served 22 months for trying to travel and join IS
posted on 3/11/20
Austrian Chancellor Sebastian Kurz said on Wednesday it was clearly an attack driven by "hatred of our way of life, our democracy".
This is not directly or specifically about God or organised religion as an end... Its about the difference/gap/void/inequality/jealousies... call it what you want... between Western and Middle Eastern/North African culture and economies, of which some people cannot square.
The majority of peaceful, practicing muslims who live in Western European societies choose to happily enjoy the moral freedoms, opportunities, security, education and wealth it creates for themselves and for their families, over a harder and simpler life in their poor, underdeveloped, war torn, and unstable countries of origin, without any question, whatsoever.
Unfortunately it takes just a few dissociated, ill educated, and well groomed and readicalised, nut cases (lets be honest), to created the fear and terror that reactions to these atrocities are designed to create.
There is no real answer except for exclusion (banish them all back to where they came from) and/or division (divide and build a wall). Both totally against the fundamental freedoms that we hold dear.
It's the price we have had to pay in the West for our own liberal development. And it will continue.
But it is not really about God or the 'fairy stories' in Holy Scriptures. Is it.
posted on 3/11/20
Plus the fact the West has shiiiiiiiiit all over the Middle East and Africa.
posted on 3/11/20
Plus the fact the West has shiiiiiiiiit all over the Middle East and Africa.
++
It has. But you cant turn that clock back. We have to move on. Or else there is no point.
Mandela was right about that.
posted on 3/11/20
comment by RB&W (U21434)
posted 1 minute ago
Plus the fact the West has shiiiiiiiiit all over the Middle East and Africa.
++
It has. But you cant turn that clock back. We have to move on. Or else there is no point.
Mandela was right about that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not that simple mate.
I'm from a immigrant background and just because "we" have moved on here doesn't mean people over there have or been allowed to. Just look at the current Kashmir lockdown where Indian army is violating Muslims. All because the initial plan to sort the region wasn't followed and a divide and rule policy has meant years of senseless deaths.
I'm sure if I become PM then I might take mandela's view
posted on 3/11/20
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 3/11/20
I'm from a immigrant background and just because "we" have moved on here doesn't mean people over there have or been allowed to. Just look at the current Kashmir lockdown where Indian army is violating Muslims. All because the initial plan to sort the region wasn't followed and a divide and rule policy has meant years of senseless deaths.
++
So what are you are actually saying.
Murdering random Austrians is therefore justified because Indian authorities are violating Kashmir muslims, caused allegedly by a historically bad solution?
posted on 3/11/20
comment by RB&W (U21434)
posted 2 minutes ago
I'm from a immigrant background and just because "we" have moved on here doesn't mean people over there have or been allowed to. Just look at the current Kashmir lockdown where Indian army is violating Muslims. All because the initial plan to sort the region wasn't followed and a divide and rule policy has meant years of senseless deaths.
++
So what are you are actually saying.
Murdering random Austrians is therefore justified because Indian authorities are violating Kashmir muslims, caused allegedly by a historically bad solution?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bit of a stretch that
posted on 3/11/20
Might not be a popular opinion but every bit of terrorism I've seen in my lifetime, from the RA to Jihad linked, seems a bit like payback.
Our foreign policy seems pretty disgusting and we make an awful lot of money selling guns and much worse.
Stop doing it.
posted on 3/11/20
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Jinja Ninja (U19849)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by RB&W (U21434)
posted 1 minute ago
Plus the fact the West has shiiiiiiiiit all over the Middle East and Africa.
++
It has. But you cant turn that clock back. We have to move on. Or else there is no point.
Mandela was right about that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not that simple mate.
I'm from a immigrant background and just because "we" have moved on here doesn't mean people over there have or been allowed to. Just look at the current Kashmir lockdown where Indian army is violating Muslims. All because the initial plan to sort the region wasn't followed and a divide and rule policy has meant years of senseless deaths.
I'm sure if I become PM then I might take mandela's view
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Kashmir is a mess though. From the intial divide. The owner was Hindu and the majority were Muslim iirc. How was that ever going to end well?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bit more to it than that. The K in pakistan was for Kashmir as agreed. The Hindu guy overnight gave rights to the Indians, against what was agreed and it was allowed to happen. Subsequent wars all.lead to that issie
posted on 3/11/20
comment by RB&W (U21434)
posted 8 minutes ago
I'm from a immigrant background and just because "we" have moved on here doesn't mean people over there have or been allowed to. Just look at the current Kashmir lockdown where Indian army is violating Muslims. All because the initial plan to sort the region wasn't followed and a divide and rule policy has meant years of senseless deaths.
++
So what are you are actually saying.
Murdering random Austrians is therefore justified because Indian authorities are violating Kashmir muslims, caused allegedly by a historically bad solution?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wow that's a leap innit?
I was responding to the point of moving on.
I agree moving on is something that should happen. However it's not as simple as that for people in other regions and countries etc.
It's easy for me even as someone from Kashmir to move on as I live in england, educated here, house, car etc
Having been to Kashmir in the late 80's and speaking to a man who had seen his wife blown up and daughter raped by what he said was indian forces not so easy to move on from
posted on 3/11/20
comment by RB&W (U21434)
posted 1 hour, 18 minutes ago
Plus the fact the West has shiiiiiiiiit all over the Middle East and Africa.
++
It has. But you cant turn that clock back. We have to move on. Or else there is no point.
Mandela was right about that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You don't have to turn back the clock if it's still happening.... which it is.
posted on 3/11/20
comment by Kung Fu Cantona 🙏🏼 🇵🇸 (U18082)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by RB&W (U21434)
posted 1 hour, 18 minutes ago
Plus the fact the West has shiiiiiiiiit all over the Middle East and Africa.
++
It has. But you cant turn that clock back. We have to move on. Or else there is no point.
Mandela was right about that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You don't have to turn back the clock if it's still happening.... which it is.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Much more succinctly put than how I did
That was my point.
posted on 3/11/20
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 3/11/20
Bit of a stretch that
++
Spin it how you want. Why bring it up?
Having been to Kashmir in the late 80's and speaking to a man who had seen his wife blown up and daughter raped by what he said was indian forces not so easy to move on from
+++
I know of people who have seen exactly the same things happen to innocent people in the UK (in NI specifically.)
But we have hopefully moved on from that. It is possible if there is a political will.
I very much doubt that Kashmir is the root of this Vienna atrocity. Unless you know something that the Austrian GVT are not letting on about right now, ....
Then share it!
posted on 3/11/20
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 38 seconds ago
comment by Jinja Ninja (U19849)
posted 1 hour, 13 minutes ago
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Jinja Ninja (U19849)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by RB&W (U21434)
posted 1 minute ago
Plus the fact the West has shiiiiiiiiit all over the Middle East and Africa.
++
It has. But you cant turn that clock back. We have to move on. Or else there is no point.
Mandela was right about that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not that simple mate.
I'm from a immigrant background and just because "we" have moved on here doesn't mean people over there have or been allowed to. Just look at the current Kashmir lockdown where Indian army is violating Muslims. All because the initial plan to sort the region wasn't followed and a divide and rule policy has meant years of senseless deaths.
I'm sure if I become PM then I might take mandela's view
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Kashmir is a mess though. From the intial divide. The owner was Hindu and the majority were Muslim iirc. How was that ever going to end well?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bit more to it than that. The K in pakistan was for Kashmir as agreed. The Hindu guy overnight gave rights to the Indians, against what was agreed and it was allowed to happen. Subsequent wars all.lead to that issie
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Against what was agreed? Well obviously not by the person who owned it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The dealing place was to allow people to vote who they wanted to belong to, india or pakistan
The majority of kashmiris were Muslim so the outcome was inevitable.
Lord mountbatten oversaw the accessions by the then maharaja. The accession was part of a hleo olea and the proviso was that a vote would take place once things had settled
Never happened
posted on 3/11/20
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 3/11/20
Lord Mountbatten was executed in a terrorist attack.
Isn't that justice enough for you?
posted on 3/11/20
History is a gift that we can learn by it's mistakes.
We don't have to live by History's mistakes
posted on 3/11/20
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 43 minutes ago
comment by Jinja Ninja (U19849)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 38 seconds ago
comment by Jinja Ninja (U19849)
posted 1 hour, 13 minutes ago
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Jinja Ninja (U19849)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by RB&W (U21434)
posted 1 minute ago
Plus the fact the West has shiiiiiiiiit all over the Middle East and Africa.
++
It has. But you cant turn that clock back. We have to move on. Or else there is no point.
Mandela was right about that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not that simple mate.
I'm from a immigrant background and just because "we" have moved on here doesn't mean people over there have or been allowed to. Just look at the current Kashmir lockdown where Indian army is violating Muslims. All because the initial plan to sort the region wasn't followed and a divide and rule policy has meant years of senseless deaths.
I'm sure if I become PM then I might take mandela's view
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Kashmir is a mess though. From the intial divide. The owner was Hindu and the majority were Muslim iirc. How was that ever going to end well?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bit more to it than that. The K in pakistan was for Kashmir as agreed. The Hindu guy overnight gave rights to the Indians, against what was agreed and it was allowed to happen. Subsequent wars all.lead to that issie
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Against what was agreed? Well obviously not by the person who owned it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The dealing place was to allow people to vote who they wanted to belong to, india or pakistan
The majority of kashmiris were Muslim so the outcome was inevitable.
Lord mountbatten oversaw the accessions by the then maharaja. The accession was part of a hleo olea and the proviso was that a vote would take place once things had settled
Never happened
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From my reading the Hindu prince didn't agree to the vote deciding prior to it because he knew it was majority Muslim. He wanted to stay independent.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Didn't have choice mate. He was sikh but like other regions in the area the Brits dictated what would happen
posted on 3/11/20
comment by RB&W (U21434)
posted 43 minutes ago
Lord Mountbatten was executed in a terrorist attack.
Isn't that justice enough for you?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Me personally? Before my time
The people in lockdown and in being murdered currently in Kashmir may disagree
Page 4 of 5