comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 56 seconds ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Kobbie The King Mainoo (U10026)
posted 10 minutes ago
Not sure what’s worse, defending Prince Andrew or the Daily Mail.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm not defending either. But when do English national newspapers print fake quotes and attribute them directly to a person?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You can't be this naïve.
The S*n erroneously quoting people at Hillsborough claimimg LFC fans urinated on and pickpocketed the dead victims of a tragedy is one high profile example.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Were they direct quotes attributed to a named person?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not named people no, quoted anonymously from people allegedly at the match under the the infamous headline 'The truth'. Also quotes from police officers re ticket less fans, the opening of gate C etc.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok so not a direct quote then. Try again.
Do you actually think The Mail made. up quotes from person that they had interviewed and who would be reading the article?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sorry what now? Try what again?
Of course they weren't going to name people, doesn't mean the quotes posted weren't lies attributed to people at the match.
Yep, its the modus operandi of tabloid dogshiite rags. You naively think a paper known for printing mis & disinformation, fake news & false facts makes sure it's accurate when quoting people, yeah do one
comment by Elvis (U7425)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Apart from the fact that she did say no to Epstein. She refused to do anything sexual with him. Then at a later date changed her mind because she wanted the money he offered her.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
The relentless coercion from a billionaire grooming ring probably didn't come into it at all yeah. Silly girl.
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 6 minutes ago
The whole argument Elvis and MU52 have, seems to be based on the girls involved not reporting anything at the time. It completely ignores the fact that these girls were either sextrafficked or put in compromised situations by people in a position of power. They were not in a situation where they would have felt comfortable saying no or reporting it at the time. It is completely reasonable that it would have taken them years to have the right situation where they feel comfortable speaking out against people with such power, wealth and influence.
The ignorance to this is actually a bit sad, as it means there are still people out there who will allow abuses of power so long as there is no physical evidence at the time or the victim doesn't immediately accuse. It is this sort of attitude that has allowed the likes of Epstein, Saville, Rolf Harris etc to operate for as long as they did.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What argument? I merely asked the question as to whether she tried to bring charges and notes that from her quotes she didn't seem too bothered by the incident. I dont know how many times I have to say the same thing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think the fact you keep saying the same thing is the point. You keep going back to the fact that you think she wasn't bothered by it and didn't report it at the time.
You keep ignoring the power dynamic and the fact she was groomed. You ignore that the other girl involved was sextrafficked. It even says in your link you posted that she felt she was groomed and is ashamed. It says in the papers today that she believes sexual activity happened between Prince Andrew and the other sextrafficked girl.
As with MU52, I'll leave it there with you. I think the fact you don't understand those things and won't budge on your position makes carrying on pointless.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
She said no to Epstein then changed her mind when she wanted the money. She felt strong enough to knock him back initially. In he own words, she made a deal with the devil. I'm not excusing Epstein or Maxwell. Horrible people. But my thoughts when I read what she said about Prince Andrew were thay she didn't seem upset by the incident or have any I'll feeling towards him.
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 4 minutes ago
Oh and heavy.com as a reliable source that's quoting The Mail second hand FFS
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So which of the quotes that The Mail and heavy.com.used are fake? Just the ones that you don't like? Or are the ones that you do like also fake? Did The Mail even interview her? Or dis they make the whole thing up in your opinion?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You tell me, you posted the quote and link. You seem so certain what you've quoted is factual surely you'd know if The Mail interviewed her.
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 2 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 14 minutes ago
Elvis
Where did you get that quote from if not The Mail?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
https://heavy.com/news/2019/11/johanna-sjoberg/
I wasn't aware of the story back in 2007 when The Mail ran it. I was travelling the world, blissfully unaware.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Conveniently left the rest of the quote where she states;
"was groomed for it,” she said of her experience, “I made a pact with the devil in exchange for excitement and glamour. I was only a college student. I was hard-up and foolish."
Why would you leave this part out I wonder?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because the being groomed part relates to Epstein and Maxwell. Not Prince Andrew, which is who/what we were discussing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So it's OK to grope someone who has been groomed, so long as you don't do the grooming?
Definitely stepping away now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's not what I said at all. You two both have a terrible habbit of misrepresenting what people actually post.
comment by son of quebec (U8127)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 26 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 14 minutes ago
Elvis
Where did you get that quote from if not The Mail?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
https://heavy.com/news/2019/11/johanna-sjoberg/
I wasn't aware of the story back in 2007 when The Mail ran it. I was travelling the world, blissfully unaware.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Conveniently left the rest of the quote where she states;
"was groomed for it,” she said of her experience, “I made a pact with the devil in exchange for excitement and glamour. I was only a college student. I was hard-up and foolish."
Why would you leave this part out I wonder?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because the being groomed part relates to Epstein and Maxwell. Not Prince Andrew, which is who/what we were discussing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
They were being groomed to be shex toys to your prince and his ilk. i.e. sick fvks.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
My Prince? What are you on about?
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 4 minutes ago
Oh and heavy.com as a reliable source that's quoting The Mail second hand FFS
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So which of the quotes that The Mail and heavy.com.used are fake? Just the ones that you don't like? Or are the ones that you do like also fake? Did The Mail even interview her? Or dis they make the whole thing up in your opinion?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You tell me, you posted the quote and link. You seem so certain what you've quoted is factual surely you'd know if The Mail interviewed her.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's you picking and choosing which quotes are real. I'm assuming they all are, as that tends to be the case with direct quotes.
Elvis
https://www.imediaethics.org/the-inquisitr-daily-mail-admit-roger-moore-quotes-fake/
https://www.thejc.com/news/mp-goldsmiths-anger-at-grotesque-mail-quote-p57w03b3?reloadTime=1653868800011
https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/shine-a-light/too-little-too-late-as-daily-mail-corrects-bogus-human-rights-splash/
You poor niave little man.
Elvis
The Mail made up an entire interview with Roger Moore but in your dense head they would never make up a quote.
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 2 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 14 minutes ago
Elvis
Where did you get that quote from if not The Mail?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
https://heavy.com/news/2019/11/johanna-sjoberg/
I wasn't aware of the story back in 2007 when The Mail ran it. I was travelling the world, blissfully unaware.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Conveniently left the rest of the quote where she states;
"was groomed for it,” she said of her experience, “I made a pact with the devil in exchange for excitement and glamour. I was only a college student. I was hard-up and foolish."
Why would you leave this part out I wonder?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because the being groomed part relates to Epstein and Maxwell. Not Prince Andrew, which is who/what we were discussing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So it's OK to grope someone who has been groomed, so long as you don't do the grooming?
Definitely stepping away now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's not what I said at all. You two both have a terrible habbit of misrepresenting what people actually post.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So it's not OK to grope someone who has been groomed by someone else? Surely that makes the fact she said she was being groomed relevant to Prince Andrew then.
I think you need to step away and try to work out what you are arguing.
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 9 minutes ago
-----------------------------
I'm not excusing Epstein or Maxwell. Horrible people. But my thoughts when I read what she said about Prince Andrew were thay she didn't seem upset by the incident or have any I'll feeling towards him.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Your thoughts on a regurgitated quote from the fackin daily mail. From back in 2007 no less which much different times to 2023.
What makes you so sure they didn't direct and present the interview in a misrepresentative way exactly?
How facking ridiculous is this.
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 4 minutes ago
Oh and heavy.com as a reliable source that's quoting The Mail second hand FFS
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So which of the quotes that The Mail and heavy.com.used are fake? Just the ones that you don't like? Or are the ones that you do like also fake? Did The Mail even interview her? Or dis they make the whole thing up in your opinion?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You tell me, you posted the quote and link. You seem so certain what you've quoted is factual surely you'd know if The Mail interviewed her.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's you picking and choosing which quotes are real. I'm assuming they all are, as that tends to be the case with direct quotes.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Didn't claim anything quoted was real. Simply posted the rest of the quote you conveniently left out as it contradicts your claim she didn't seem upset about it.
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 10 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 6 minutes ago
The whole argument Elvis and MU52 have, seems to be based on the girls involved not reporting anything at the time. It completely ignores the fact that these girls were either sextrafficked or put in compromised situations by people in a position of power. They were not in a situation where they would have felt comfortable saying no or reporting it at the time. It is completely reasonable that it would have taken them years to have the right situation where they feel comfortable speaking out against people with such power, wealth and influence.
The ignorance to this is actually a bit sad, as it means there are still people out there who will allow abuses of power so long as there is no physical evidence at the time or the victim doesn't immediately accuse. It is this sort of attitude that has allowed the likes of Epstein, Saville, Rolf Harris etc to operate for as long as they did.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What argument? I merely asked the question as to whether she tried to bring charges and notes that from her quotes she didn't seem too bothered by the incident. I dont know how many times I have to say the same thing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think the fact you keep saying the same thing is the point. You keep going back to the fact that you think she wasn't bothered by it and didn't report it at the time.
You keep ignoring the power dynamic and the fact she was groomed. You ignore that the other girl involved was sextrafficked. It even says in your link you posted that she felt she was groomed and is ashamed. It says in the papers today that she believes sexual activity happened between Prince Andrew and the other sextrafficked girl.
As with MU52, I'll leave it there with you. I think the fact you don't understand those things and won't budge on your position makes carrying on pointless.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
She said no to Epstein then changed her mind when she wanted the money. She felt strong enough to knock him back initially. In he own words, she made a deal with the devil. I'm not excusing Epstein or Maxwell. Horrible people. But my thoughts when I read what she said about Prince Andrew were thay she didn't seem upset by the incident or have any I'll feeling towards him.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
She also said she was being groomed. Something you acknowledge in one post and then ignore in another. Her saying she was being groomed and that she regrets everything doesn't sound like someone who isn't upset by it.
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 44 seconds ago
Elvis
https://www.imediaethics.org/the-inquisitr-daily-mail-admit-roger-moore-quotes-fake/
https://www.thejc.com/news/mp-goldsmiths-anger-at-grotesque-mail-quote-p57w03b3?reloadTime=1653868800011
https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/shine-a-light/too-little-too-late-as-daily-mail-corrects-bogus-human-rights-splash/
You poor niave little man.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
One example of a fake direct quote in there. From a dead person. Assuming they didn't print that they had been told by 'a source'. Which is the usual trick. I guess the story will have been taken down now?
And one where they copied a story from The People.
Do you think they ran a full interview/story with Sjoberg and falsified all the quotes?
comment by Jalisco Red (U4195)
posted 1 hour, 51 minutes ago
comment by #4zA (U22472)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Jalisco Red (U4195)
posted 2 minutes ago
The big question is: Are the QAnon nutters happy?
Are they excited for more?
Or is there a sense of disappointment?
I hardly use social media anymore, largely because of QAnon nutters and their ilk, but I do wonder how they're reacting.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Strange how the messiah Trump is listed innit
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Is he? I keep hearing different things.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yup
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 9 minutes ago
Elvis
The Mail made up an entire interview with Roger Moore but in your dense head they would never make up a quote.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No they didn't. The People did it and The Mail copied their story. You have a real problem with reading and comprehension
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 44 seconds ago
Elvis
https://www.imediaethics.org/the-inquisitr-daily-mail-admit-roger-moore-quotes-fake/
https://www.thejc.com/news/mp-goldsmiths-anger-at-grotesque-mail-quote-p57w03b3?reloadTime=1653868800011
https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/shine-a-light/too-little-too-late-as-daily-mail-corrects-bogus-human-rights-splash/
You poor niave little man.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
One example of a fake direct quote in there. From a dead person. Assuming they didn't print that they had been told by 'a source'. Which is the usual trick. I guess the story will have been taken down now?
And one where they copied a story from The People.
Do you think they ran a full interview/story with Sjoberg and falsified all the quotes?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"The phony interview quoted Moore as boasting about his sexlife and and appearance. One such comment The People said Moore made was “I’ve have more women than James Bond.” The error spread further because the Daily Mail re-published the fake quotes from The People. But, making matters worse, not only did The Daily Mail publish fake quotes, it didn’t give any credit to The People, therefore stealing the phony Moore comments. From there, many international news outlets picked up the quotes and credited the Daily Mail."
Well that's OK then
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 2 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 14 minutes ago
Elvis
Where did you get that quote from if not The Mail?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
https://heavy.com/news/2019/11/johanna-sjoberg/
I wasn't aware of the story back in 2007 when The Mail ran it. I was travelling the world, blissfully unaware.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Conveniently left the rest of the quote where she states;
"was groomed for it,” she said of her experience, “I made a pact with the devil in exchange for excitement and glamour. I was only a college student. I was hard-up and foolish."
Why would you leave this part out I wonder?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because the being groomed part relates to Epstein and Maxwell. Not Prince Andrew, which is who/what we were discussing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So it's OK to grope someone who has been groomed, so long as you don't do the grooming?
Definitely stepping away now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's not what I said at all. You two both have a terrible habbit of misrepresenting what people actually post.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So it's not OK to grope someone who has been groomed by someone else? Surely that makes the fact she said she was being groomed relevant to Prince Andrew then.
I think you need to step away and try to work out what you are arguing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You asked why I had excluded that part of her quotes and I explained. Stop twisting what I've posted. From her quotes in that interview she didn't appear bothered by the incident with PA. Which is why I asked if she tried brining charges at the time. I was in South East Asia when this story originally broke, so don't have any recollection of it back then. I wasn't aware of it until years later
comment by Real Fans Don't WUM (U23132)
posted 12 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 9 minutes ago
-----------------------------
I'm not excusing Epstein or Maxwell. Horrible people. But my thoughts when I read what she said about Prince Andrew were thay she didn't seem upset by the incident or have any I'll feeling towards him.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Your thoughts on a regurgitated quote from the fackin daily mail. From back in 2007 no less which much different times to 2023.
What makes you so sure they didn't direct and present the interview in a misrepresentative way exactly?
How facking ridiculous is this.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Where have I said I am sure?
Elvis
"One example of a direct quote feomma dead person" (Roger Moore wasn't dead at the time he made the compalint you dope) but anyway, you said this a couple of hours back;
"That doesn't answer my question. Even The Mail, as SC ummmmmy as it is, doesn't print fake quotes that I am aware of. Unless you know different."
"my thoughts when I read what she said about Prince Andrew were thay she didn't seem upset by the incident or have any I'll feeling towards him"
Elvis do you think the interview they conducted in 2007 was conducted fair and impartially?
Do you think Viscount Rothermere back in 2007 was going to allow an interview to be published that presented a RF member as "acting in a manner unbecoming"?
Or perhaps the direct quote is somewhat out of context and not particularly useful in assessing whether she was upset by the incident and had any ill feelings or not?
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 16 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 10 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 6 minutes ago
The whole argument Elvis and MU52 have, seems to be based on the girls involved not reporting anything at the time. It completely ignores the fact that these girls were either sextrafficked or put in compromised situations by people in a position of power. They were not in a situation where they would have felt comfortable saying no or reporting it at the time. It is completely reasonable that it would have taken them years to have the right situation where they feel comfortable speaking out against people with such power, wealth and influence.
The ignorance to this is actually a bit sad, as it means there are still people out there who will allow abuses of power so long as there is no physical evidence at the time or the victim doesn't immediately accuse. It is this sort of attitude that has allowed the likes of Epstein, Saville, Rolf Harris etc to operate for as long as they did.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What argument? I merely asked the question as to whether she tried to bring charges and notes that from her quotes she didn't seem too bothered by the incident. I dont know how many times I have to say the same thing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think the fact you keep saying the same thing is the point. You keep going back to the fact that you think she wasn't bothered by it and didn't report it at the time.
You keep ignoring the power dynamic and the fact she was groomed. You ignore that the other girl involved was sextrafficked. It even says in your link you posted that she felt she was groomed and is ashamed. It says in the papers today that she believes sexual activity happened between Prince Andrew and the other sextrafficked girl.
As with MU52, I'll leave it there with you. I think the fact you don't understand those things and won't budge on your position makes carrying on pointless.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
She said no to Epstein then changed her mind when she wanted the money. She felt strong enough to knock him back initially. In he own words, she made a deal with the devil. I'm not excusing Epstein or Maxwell. Horrible people. But my thoughts when I read what she said about Prince Andrew were thay she didn't seem upset by the incident or have any I'll feeling towards him.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
She also said she was being groomed. Something you acknowledge in one post and then ignore in another. Her saying she was being groomed and that she regrets everything doesn't sound like someone who isn't upset by it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Upset at what happened with PA? Or at what she did with Epstein?
Maybe she was upset with what happened with PA. It just doesn't sound like it from her quotes.
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 1 minute ago
Elvis
"One example of a direct quote feomma dead person" (Roger Moore wasn't dead at the time he made the compalint you dope) but anyway, you said this a couple of hours back;
"That doesn't answer my question. Even The Mail, as SC ummmmmy as it is, doesn't print fake quotes that I am aware of. Unless you know different."
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Was it a direct quote? Did they claim he had said it or that a source told them he had said it?
And more importantly, do you think they made up all the quotes attributed to Sjoberg in 2007?
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 2 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 14 minutes ago
Elvis
Where did you get that quote from if not The Mail?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
https://heavy.com/news/2019/11/johanna-sjoberg/
I wasn't aware of the story back in 2007 when The Mail ran it. I was travelling the world, blissfully unaware.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Conveniently left the rest of the quote where she states;
"was groomed for it,” she said of her experience, “I made a pact with the devil in exchange for excitement and glamour. I was only a college student. I was hard-up and foolish."
Why would you leave this part out I wonder?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because the being groomed part relates to Epstein and Maxwell. Not Prince Andrew, which is who/what we were discussing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So it's OK to grope someone who has been groomed, so long as you don't do the grooming?
Definitely stepping away now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's not what I said at all. You two both have a terrible habbit of misrepresenting what people actually post.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So it's not OK to grope someone who has been groomed by someone else? Surely that makes the fact she said she was being groomed relevant to Prince Andrew then.
I think you need to step away and try to work out what you are arguing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You asked why I had excluded that part of her quotes and I explained. Stop twisting what I've posted. From her quotes in that interview she didn't appear bothered by the incident with PA. Which is why I asked if she tried brining charges at the time. I was in South East Asia when this story originally broke, so don't have any recollection of it back then. I wasn't aware of it until years later
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I didn't ask why you excluded it. Just responded to your reasons. I'm not twisting what you've posted. It's either relevant or not for the above reasons. You seem to be avoiding that.
I also wasn't aware of this at the time. I probably didn't even know who Jeffrey Epstein was back in 2007. I think being aware of it in 2007 is irrelevant here.
Her comments in 2007 come across as someone who has been groomed. She was groomed to think it was normal, but was starting to think it wasn't and feel ashamed. The reason she doesn't think anything was wrong was because she blames herself, which is classic in abuse of power grooming situations. You have just gone along with her blaming herself and spoke about how 'she wanted the money' whilst ignoring the grooming aspect and power dynamic to pretend nothing was wrong.
I'm sure she feels very differently about it today. The quotes in the released papers today convey a different feel (despite you saying its nothing new) and she has cooperated with each case since 2007. That would suggest she wasn't over telling her story and her opinion on what happened has changed over time.
comment by Real Fans Don't WUM (U23132)
posted 3 minutes ago
"my thoughts when I read what she said about Prince Andrew were thay she didn't seem upset by the incident or have any I'll feeling towards him"
Elvis do you think the interview they conducted in 2007 was conducted fair and impartially?
Do you think Viscount Rothermere back in 2007 was going to allow an interview to be published that presented a RF member as "acting in a manner unbecoming"?
Or perhaps the direct quote is somewhat out of context and not particularly useful in assessing whether she was upset by the incident and had any ill feelings or not?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
All possible. Which is why I said she didn't 'appear' upset and tried to establish further context. Anyway, bed time for me.
Sign in if you want to comment
Epstein List to be released
Page 14 of 24
15 | 16 | 17 | 18 | 19
posted on 4/1/24
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 56 seconds ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Kobbie The King Mainoo (U10026)
posted 10 minutes ago
Not sure what’s worse, defending Prince Andrew or the Daily Mail.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm not defending either. But when do English national newspapers print fake quotes and attribute them directly to a person?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You can't be this naïve.
The S*n erroneously quoting people at Hillsborough claimimg LFC fans urinated on and pickpocketed the dead victims of a tragedy is one high profile example.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Were they direct quotes attributed to a named person?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not named people no, quoted anonymously from people allegedly at the match under the the infamous headline 'The truth'. Also quotes from police officers re ticket less fans, the opening of gate C etc.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok so not a direct quote then. Try again.
Do you actually think The Mail made. up quotes from person that they had interviewed and who would be reading the article?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sorry what now? Try what again?
Of course they weren't going to name people, doesn't mean the quotes posted weren't lies attributed to people at the match.
Yep, its the modus operandi of tabloid dogshiite rags. You naively think a paper known for printing mis & disinformation, fake news & false facts makes sure it's accurate when quoting people, yeah do one
posted on 4/1/24
comment by Elvis (U7425)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Apart from the fact that she did say no to Epstein. She refused to do anything sexual with him. Then at a later date changed her mind because she wanted the money he offered her.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
The relentless coercion from a billionaire grooming ring probably didn't come into it at all yeah. Silly girl.
posted on 4/1/24
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 6 minutes ago
The whole argument Elvis and MU52 have, seems to be based on the girls involved not reporting anything at the time. It completely ignores the fact that these girls were either sextrafficked or put in compromised situations by people in a position of power. They were not in a situation where they would have felt comfortable saying no or reporting it at the time. It is completely reasonable that it would have taken them years to have the right situation where they feel comfortable speaking out against people with such power, wealth and influence.
The ignorance to this is actually a bit sad, as it means there are still people out there who will allow abuses of power so long as there is no physical evidence at the time or the victim doesn't immediately accuse. It is this sort of attitude that has allowed the likes of Epstein, Saville, Rolf Harris etc to operate for as long as they did.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What argument? I merely asked the question as to whether she tried to bring charges and notes that from her quotes she didn't seem too bothered by the incident. I dont know how many times I have to say the same thing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think the fact you keep saying the same thing is the point. You keep going back to the fact that you think she wasn't bothered by it and didn't report it at the time.
You keep ignoring the power dynamic and the fact she was groomed. You ignore that the other girl involved was sextrafficked. It even says in your link you posted that she felt she was groomed and is ashamed. It says in the papers today that she believes sexual activity happened between Prince Andrew and the other sextrafficked girl.
As with MU52, I'll leave it there with you. I think the fact you don't understand those things and won't budge on your position makes carrying on pointless.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
She said no to Epstein then changed her mind when she wanted the money. She felt strong enough to knock him back initially. In he own words, she made a deal with the devil. I'm not excusing Epstein or Maxwell. Horrible people. But my thoughts when I read what she said about Prince Andrew were thay she didn't seem upset by the incident or have any I'll feeling towards him.
posted on 4/1/24
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 4 minutes ago
Oh and heavy.com as a reliable source that's quoting The Mail second hand FFS
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So which of the quotes that The Mail and heavy.com.used are fake? Just the ones that you don't like? Or are the ones that you do like also fake? Did The Mail even interview her? Or dis they make the whole thing up in your opinion?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You tell me, you posted the quote and link. You seem so certain what you've quoted is factual surely you'd know if The Mail interviewed her.
posted on 5/1/24
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 2 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 14 minutes ago
Elvis
Where did you get that quote from if not The Mail?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
https://heavy.com/news/2019/11/johanna-sjoberg/
I wasn't aware of the story back in 2007 when The Mail ran it. I was travelling the world, blissfully unaware.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Conveniently left the rest of the quote where she states;
"was groomed for it,” she said of her experience, “I made a pact with the devil in exchange for excitement and glamour. I was only a college student. I was hard-up and foolish."
Why would you leave this part out I wonder?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because the being groomed part relates to Epstein and Maxwell. Not Prince Andrew, which is who/what we were discussing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So it's OK to grope someone who has been groomed, so long as you don't do the grooming?
Definitely stepping away now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's not what I said at all. You two both have a terrible habbit of misrepresenting what people actually post.
posted on 5/1/24
comment by son of quebec (U8127)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 26 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 14 minutes ago
Elvis
Where did you get that quote from if not The Mail?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
https://heavy.com/news/2019/11/johanna-sjoberg/
I wasn't aware of the story back in 2007 when The Mail ran it. I was travelling the world, blissfully unaware.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Conveniently left the rest of the quote where she states;
"was groomed for it,” she said of her experience, “I made a pact with the devil in exchange for excitement and glamour. I was only a college student. I was hard-up and foolish."
Why would you leave this part out I wonder?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because the being groomed part relates to Epstein and Maxwell. Not Prince Andrew, which is who/what we were discussing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
They were being groomed to be shex toys to your prince and his ilk. i.e. sick fvks.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
My Prince? What are you on about?
posted on 5/1/24
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 4 minutes ago
Oh and heavy.com as a reliable source that's quoting The Mail second hand FFS
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So which of the quotes that The Mail and heavy.com.used are fake? Just the ones that you don't like? Or are the ones that you do like also fake? Did The Mail even interview her? Or dis they make the whole thing up in your opinion?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You tell me, you posted the quote and link. You seem so certain what you've quoted is factual surely you'd know if The Mail interviewed her.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's you picking and choosing which quotes are real. I'm assuming they all are, as that tends to be the case with direct quotes.
posted on 5/1/24
Elvis
https://www.imediaethics.org/the-inquisitr-daily-mail-admit-roger-moore-quotes-fake/
https://www.thejc.com/news/mp-goldsmiths-anger-at-grotesque-mail-quote-p57w03b3?reloadTime=1653868800011
https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/shine-a-light/too-little-too-late-as-daily-mail-corrects-bogus-human-rights-splash/
You poor niave little man.
posted on 5/1/24
Elvis
The Mail made up an entire interview with Roger Moore but in your dense head they would never make up a quote.
posted on 5/1/24
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 2 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 14 minutes ago
Elvis
Where did you get that quote from if not The Mail?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
https://heavy.com/news/2019/11/johanna-sjoberg/
I wasn't aware of the story back in 2007 when The Mail ran it. I was travelling the world, blissfully unaware.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Conveniently left the rest of the quote where she states;
"was groomed for it,” she said of her experience, “I made a pact with the devil in exchange for excitement and glamour. I was only a college student. I was hard-up and foolish."
Why would you leave this part out I wonder?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because the being groomed part relates to Epstein and Maxwell. Not Prince Andrew, which is who/what we were discussing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So it's OK to grope someone who has been groomed, so long as you don't do the grooming?
Definitely stepping away now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's not what I said at all. You two both have a terrible habbit of misrepresenting what people actually post.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So it's not OK to grope someone who has been groomed by someone else? Surely that makes the fact she said she was being groomed relevant to Prince Andrew then.
I think you need to step away and try to work out what you are arguing.
posted on 5/1/24
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 9 minutes ago
-----------------------------
I'm not excusing Epstein or Maxwell. Horrible people. But my thoughts when I read what she said about Prince Andrew were thay she didn't seem upset by the incident or have any I'll feeling towards him.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Your thoughts on a regurgitated quote from the fackin daily mail. From back in 2007 no less which much different times to 2023.
What makes you so sure they didn't direct and present the interview in a misrepresentative way exactly?
How facking ridiculous is this.
posted on 5/1/24
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 4 minutes ago
Oh and heavy.com as a reliable source that's quoting The Mail second hand FFS
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So which of the quotes that The Mail and heavy.com.used are fake? Just the ones that you don't like? Or are the ones that you do like also fake? Did The Mail even interview her? Or dis they make the whole thing up in your opinion?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You tell me, you posted the quote and link. You seem so certain what you've quoted is factual surely you'd know if The Mail interviewed her.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's you picking and choosing which quotes are real. I'm assuming they all are, as that tends to be the case with direct quotes.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Didn't claim anything quoted was real. Simply posted the rest of the quote you conveniently left out as it contradicts your claim she didn't seem upset about it.
posted on 5/1/24
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 10 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 6 minutes ago
The whole argument Elvis and MU52 have, seems to be based on the girls involved not reporting anything at the time. It completely ignores the fact that these girls were either sextrafficked or put in compromised situations by people in a position of power. They were not in a situation where they would have felt comfortable saying no or reporting it at the time. It is completely reasonable that it would have taken them years to have the right situation where they feel comfortable speaking out against people with such power, wealth and influence.
The ignorance to this is actually a bit sad, as it means there are still people out there who will allow abuses of power so long as there is no physical evidence at the time or the victim doesn't immediately accuse. It is this sort of attitude that has allowed the likes of Epstein, Saville, Rolf Harris etc to operate for as long as they did.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What argument? I merely asked the question as to whether she tried to bring charges and notes that from her quotes she didn't seem too bothered by the incident. I dont know how many times I have to say the same thing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think the fact you keep saying the same thing is the point. You keep going back to the fact that you think she wasn't bothered by it and didn't report it at the time.
You keep ignoring the power dynamic and the fact she was groomed. You ignore that the other girl involved was sextrafficked. It even says in your link you posted that she felt she was groomed and is ashamed. It says in the papers today that she believes sexual activity happened between Prince Andrew and the other sextrafficked girl.
As with MU52, I'll leave it there with you. I think the fact you don't understand those things and won't budge on your position makes carrying on pointless.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
She said no to Epstein then changed her mind when she wanted the money. She felt strong enough to knock him back initially. In he own words, she made a deal with the devil. I'm not excusing Epstein or Maxwell. Horrible people. But my thoughts when I read what she said about Prince Andrew were thay she didn't seem upset by the incident or have any I'll feeling towards him.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
She also said she was being groomed. Something you acknowledge in one post and then ignore in another. Her saying she was being groomed and that she regrets everything doesn't sound like someone who isn't upset by it.
posted on 5/1/24
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 44 seconds ago
Elvis
https://www.imediaethics.org/the-inquisitr-daily-mail-admit-roger-moore-quotes-fake/
https://www.thejc.com/news/mp-goldsmiths-anger-at-grotesque-mail-quote-p57w03b3?reloadTime=1653868800011
https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/shine-a-light/too-little-too-late-as-daily-mail-corrects-bogus-human-rights-splash/
You poor niave little man.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
One example of a fake direct quote in there. From a dead person. Assuming they didn't print that they had been told by 'a source'. Which is the usual trick. I guess the story will have been taken down now?
And one where they copied a story from The People.
Do you think they ran a full interview/story with Sjoberg and falsified all the quotes?
posted on 5/1/24
comment by Jalisco Red (U4195)
posted 1 hour, 51 minutes ago
comment by #4zA (U22472)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Jalisco Red (U4195)
posted 2 minutes ago
The big question is: Are the QAnon nutters happy?
Are they excited for more?
Or is there a sense of disappointment?
I hardly use social media anymore, largely because of QAnon nutters and their ilk, but I do wonder how they're reacting.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Strange how the messiah Trump is listed innit
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Is he? I keep hearing different things.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yup
posted on 5/1/24
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 9 minutes ago
Elvis
The Mail made up an entire interview with Roger Moore but in your dense head they would never make up a quote.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No they didn't. The People did it and The Mail copied their story. You have a real problem with reading and comprehension
posted on 5/1/24
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 44 seconds ago
Elvis
https://www.imediaethics.org/the-inquisitr-daily-mail-admit-roger-moore-quotes-fake/
https://www.thejc.com/news/mp-goldsmiths-anger-at-grotesque-mail-quote-p57w03b3?reloadTime=1653868800011
https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/shine-a-light/too-little-too-late-as-daily-mail-corrects-bogus-human-rights-splash/
You poor niave little man.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
One example of a fake direct quote in there. From a dead person. Assuming they didn't print that they had been told by 'a source'. Which is the usual trick. I guess the story will have been taken down now?
And one where they copied a story from The People.
Do you think they ran a full interview/story with Sjoberg and falsified all the quotes?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"The phony interview quoted Moore as boasting about his sexlife and and appearance. One such comment The People said Moore made was “I’ve have more women than James Bond.” The error spread further because the Daily Mail re-published the fake quotes from The People. But, making matters worse, not only did The Daily Mail publish fake quotes, it didn’t give any credit to The People, therefore stealing the phony Moore comments. From there, many international news outlets picked up the quotes and credited the Daily Mail."
Well that's OK then
posted on 5/1/24
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 2 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 14 minutes ago
Elvis
Where did you get that quote from if not The Mail?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
https://heavy.com/news/2019/11/johanna-sjoberg/
I wasn't aware of the story back in 2007 when The Mail ran it. I was travelling the world, blissfully unaware.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Conveniently left the rest of the quote where she states;
"was groomed for it,” she said of her experience, “I made a pact with the devil in exchange for excitement and glamour. I was only a college student. I was hard-up and foolish."
Why would you leave this part out I wonder?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because the being groomed part relates to Epstein and Maxwell. Not Prince Andrew, which is who/what we were discussing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So it's OK to grope someone who has been groomed, so long as you don't do the grooming?
Definitely stepping away now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's not what I said at all. You two both have a terrible habbit of misrepresenting what people actually post.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So it's not OK to grope someone who has been groomed by someone else? Surely that makes the fact she said she was being groomed relevant to Prince Andrew then.
I think you need to step away and try to work out what you are arguing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You asked why I had excluded that part of her quotes and I explained. Stop twisting what I've posted. From her quotes in that interview she didn't appear bothered by the incident with PA. Which is why I asked if she tried brining charges at the time. I was in South East Asia when this story originally broke, so don't have any recollection of it back then. I wasn't aware of it until years later
posted on 5/1/24
comment by Real Fans Don't WUM (U23132)
posted 12 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 9 minutes ago
-----------------------------
I'm not excusing Epstein or Maxwell. Horrible people. But my thoughts when I read what she said about Prince Andrew were thay she didn't seem upset by the incident or have any I'll feeling towards him.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Your thoughts on a regurgitated quote from the fackin daily mail. From back in 2007 no less which much different times to 2023.
What makes you so sure they didn't direct and present the interview in a misrepresentative way exactly?
How facking ridiculous is this.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Where have I said I am sure?
posted on 5/1/24
Elvis
"One example of a direct quote feomma dead person" (Roger Moore wasn't dead at the time he made the compalint you dope) but anyway, you said this a couple of hours back;
"That doesn't answer my question. Even The Mail, as SC ummmmmy as it is, doesn't print fake quotes that I am aware of. Unless you know different."
posted on 5/1/24
"my thoughts when I read what she said about Prince Andrew were thay she didn't seem upset by the incident or have any I'll feeling towards him"
Elvis do you think the interview they conducted in 2007 was conducted fair and impartially?
Do you think Viscount Rothermere back in 2007 was going to allow an interview to be published that presented a RF member as "acting in a manner unbecoming"?
Or perhaps the direct quote is somewhat out of context and not particularly useful in assessing whether she was upset by the incident and had any ill feelings or not?
posted on 5/1/24
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 16 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 10 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 6 minutes ago
The whole argument Elvis and MU52 have, seems to be based on the girls involved not reporting anything at the time. It completely ignores the fact that these girls were either sextrafficked or put in compromised situations by people in a position of power. They were not in a situation where they would have felt comfortable saying no or reporting it at the time. It is completely reasonable that it would have taken them years to have the right situation where they feel comfortable speaking out against people with such power, wealth and influence.
The ignorance to this is actually a bit sad, as it means there are still people out there who will allow abuses of power so long as there is no physical evidence at the time or the victim doesn't immediately accuse. It is this sort of attitude that has allowed the likes of Epstein, Saville, Rolf Harris etc to operate for as long as they did.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What argument? I merely asked the question as to whether she tried to bring charges and notes that from her quotes she didn't seem too bothered by the incident. I dont know how many times I have to say the same thing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think the fact you keep saying the same thing is the point. You keep going back to the fact that you think she wasn't bothered by it and didn't report it at the time.
You keep ignoring the power dynamic and the fact she was groomed. You ignore that the other girl involved was sextrafficked. It even says in your link you posted that she felt she was groomed and is ashamed. It says in the papers today that she believes sexual activity happened between Prince Andrew and the other sextrafficked girl.
As with MU52, I'll leave it there with you. I think the fact you don't understand those things and won't budge on your position makes carrying on pointless.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
She said no to Epstein then changed her mind when she wanted the money. She felt strong enough to knock him back initially. In he own words, she made a deal with the devil. I'm not excusing Epstein or Maxwell. Horrible people. But my thoughts when I read what she said about Prince Andrew were thay she didn't seem upset by the incident or have any I'll feeling towards him.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
She also said she was being groomed. Something you acknowledge in one post and then ignore in another. Her saying she was being groomed and that she regrets everything doesn't sound like someone who isn't upset by it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Upset at what happened with PA? Or at what she did with Epstein?
Maybe she was upset with what happened with PA. It just doesn't sound like it from her quotes.
posted on 5/1/24
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 1 minute ago
Elvis
"One example of a direct quote feomma dead person" (Roger Moore wasn't dead at the time he made the compalint you dope) but anyway, you said this a couple of hours back;
"That doesn't answer my question. Even The Mail, as SC ummmmmy as it is, doesn't print fake quotes that I am aware of. Unless you know different."
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Was it a direct quote? Did they claim he had said it or that a source told them he had said it?
And more importantly, do you think they made up all the quotes attributed to Sjoberg in 2007?
posted on 5/1/24
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 2 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 14 minutes ago
Elvis
Where did you get that quote from if not The Mail?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
https://heavy.com/news/2019/11/johanna-sjoberg/
I wasn't aware of the story back in 2007 when The Mail ran it. I was travelling the world, blissfully unaware.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Conveniently left the rest of the quote where she states;
"was groomed for it,” she said of her experience, “I made a pact with the devil in exchange for excitement and glamour. I was only a college student. I was hard-up and foolish."
Why would you leave this part out I wonder?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because the being groomed part relates to Epstein and Maxwell. Not Prince Andrew, which is who/what we were discussing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So it's OK to grope someone who has been groomed, so long as you don't do the grooming?
Definitely stepping away now.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's not what I said at all. You two both have a terrible habbit of misrepresenting what people actually post.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So it's not OK to grope someone who has been groomed by someone else? Surely that makes the fact she said she was being groomed relevant to Prince Andrew then.
I think you need to step away and try to work out what you are arguing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You asked why I had excluded that part of her quotes and I explained. Stop twisting what I've posted. From her quotes in that interview she didn't appear bothered by the incident with PA. Which is why I asked if she tried brining charges at the time. I was in South East Asia when this story originally broke, so don't have any recollection of it back then. I wasn't aware of it until years later
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I didn't ask why you excluded it. Just responded to your reasons. I'm not twisting what you've posted. It's either relevant or not for the above reasons. You seem to be avoiding that.
I also wasn't aware of this at the time. I probably didn't even know who Jeffrey Epstein was back in 2007. I think being aware of it in 2007 is irrelevant here.
Her comments in 2007 come across as someone who has been groomed. She was groomed to think it was normal, but was starting to think it wasn't and feel ashamed. The reason she doesn't think anything was wrong was because she blames herself, which is classic in abuse of power grooming situations. You have just gone along with her blaming herself and spoke about how 'she wanted the money' whilst ignoring the grooming aspect and power dynamic to pretend nothing was wrong.
I'm sure she feels very differently about it today. The quotes in the released papers today convey a different feel (despite you saying its nothing new) and she has cooperated with each case since 2007. That would suggest she wasn't over telling her story and her opinion on what happened has changed over time.
posted on 5/1/24
comment by Real Fans Don't WUM (U23132)
posted 3 minutes ago
"my thoughts when I read what she said about Prince Andrew were thay she didn't seem upset by the incident or have any I'll feeling towards him"
Elvis do you think the interview they conducted in 2007 was conducted fair and impartially?
Do you think Viscount Rothermere back in 2007 was going to allow an interview to be published that presented a RF member as "acting in a manner unbecoming"?
Or perhaps the direct quote is somewhat out of context and not particularly useful in assessing whether she was upset by the incident and had any ill feelings or not?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
All possible. Which is why I said she didn't 'appear' upset and tried to establish further context. Anyway, bed time for me.
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