Should have clarified that this new format also applies to the Europa League and the Conference League.
I think our players would be pretty happy with getting Brest.
comment by Calafiori knows how to Partey (U21076)
posted 1 minute ago
I think our players would be pretty happy with getting Brest.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's why we once signed Titi Camara
I like this new format where you play different oppositions rather than the home & away boring groups. You have to be really bad to not at least make the last 32 play off and good to see that the losers do not drop into the EL.
Thanks for the article. Instinctively it just feels 'wrong' to have a single league table comprising teams who don't all play each other, but even though it still looks far from ideal the explanations go some way to illustrating how it isn't quite as unfair as it might first appear.
As I understand from your sample draw above, you'll get two opponents from each pot, and you'll always face one of them at home and one away, right?
comment by welshpoolfan (U7693)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by Calafiori knows how to Partey (U21076)
posted 1 minute ago
I think our players would be pretty happy with getting Brest.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's why we once signed Titi Camara
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Booby Firmino
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 4 minutes ago
Thanks for the article. Instinctively it just feels 'wrong' to have a single league table comprising teams who don't all play each other, but even though it still looks far from ideal the explanations go some way to illustrating how it isn't quite as unfair as it might first appear.
As I understand from your sample draw above, you'll get two opponents from each pot, and you'll always face one of them at home and one away, right?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That is my understanding of how it will work, although I've struggled to find clear confirmation on how the home/away matches are decided. That feels the fairest and simplest way, but it is UEFA so who can tell.
I'm also curious to know how they plan to make room on the calendar for the extra fixtures.
My guess is FIFA will fight tooth and nail to preserve the number of int'l breaks, and they've also got plans for the expanded Club World Cup (unless they've been forced to scrap them).
My guess is domestic cups are going to be even further devalued, and we might see other big leagues reduced to 18 teams. Ligue 1 already went down to 18 last season, and I'm sure Serie A and La Liga would go down the same route if their big clubs had their way.
Will be interesting to see how few points are needed to get through to the 9th-24th round. Also how quickly the top teams secure top 8.
Should be good, should have big matches every week. It is meant to all but eliminate dead rubbers too.
I'm also curious to know how they plan to make room on the calendar for the extra fixtures.
====
It is already in the fixture list.
They have got rid of the winter break in England for starters, and cup replays have gone.
Comment deleted by Article Creator
comment by D'Jeezus Mackaroni (U1137)
posted 3 minutes ago
Will be interesting to see how few points are needed to get through to the 9th-24th round. Also how quickly the top teams secure top 8.
Should be good, should have big matches every week. It is meant to all but eliminate dead rubbers too.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah that will be interesting. Having 9 teams in pot 1 but only 8 last 16 places available also means that at least 1 of the top seeded teams is guaranteed to have to settle for a last 32 play-off at best.
It has a feel of Euros since 2016 about it, where very few teams actually end up going out after the group stage. You may argue that teams are playing for places so it makes it exciting, but that's not the reality. Removing the jeopardy of half the teams going out of the groups, and now having MORE games, makes each game FAR less significant.
Lose a couple of games in the old format and you would be struggling to get through.
Is there really a need for 8 matches just to decide positions of a play off round?
More matches doesn't make it better.
Comment deleted by Article Creator
comment by D'Jeezus Mackaroni (U1137)
posted 14 minutes ago
I'm also curious to know how they plan to make room on the calendar for the extra fixtures.
====
It is already in the fixture list.
They have got rid of the winter break in England for starters, and cup replays have gone.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It might suffice strictly on number of dates available, but the 4 additional fixtures in the event of having to play the R32 are a lot more than the cup replays a club might normally expect to be involved in.
Have there been any noises in England about scrapping or making wholesale changes to the League Cup?
Expanded CWC would only compound the matter further - and I think the European clubs aren't all that happy about it. I wonder if we'll see them taking second string squads or fielding weakened sides for it.
comment by John McGlashan (U1734)
posted 10 minutes ago
It has a feel of Euros since 2016 about it, where very few teams actually end up going out after the group stage. You may argue that teams are playing for places so it makes it exciting, but that's not the reality. Removing the jeopardy of half the teams going out of the groups, and now having MORE games, makes each game FAR less significant.
Lose a couple of games in the old format and you would be struggling to get through.
Is there really a need for 8 matches just to decide positions of a play off round?
More matches doesn't make it better.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That could equally be true. As far as I understand, there is no benefit to finishing first in the league over finishing 8th (I have no idea if prize money tapers or not) and similarly no difference between 9th-16th, 17th-24th, or 24th-36th.
Why are Liverpool in pot 1? Leverkusen won there league and Arsenal finished above them. England's 3rd best team in with all the heavyweights plus Bottlejob Dortmund.
Would you want a version of this format at the world cup? I am guessing the answer is no? So why for the CL?
Are people possibly losing sight of what football is all about, in favour of falling for UEFA's marketing to you of "More matches means better"?
Only a small number of teams going out after EIGHT rounds of fixtures verges on totally pointless, when you actually remember what a competition is meant to be about.
comment by Shaun M - supercalifragilisticOrtaisatrocious (U9955)
posted 12 seconds ago
Why are Liverpool in pot 1? Leverkusen won there league and Arsenal finished above them. England's 3rd best team in with all the heavyweights plus Bottlejob Dortmund.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
UEFA coefficient is based on performance in UEFA competition. Where you finished in the domestic league is irrelevant.
Arsenal or Leverkusen haven't done as well in Europe as Liverpool over the last 5 or 6 years (not sure what the time frame is).
comment by John McGlashan (U1734)
posted 2 minutes ago
Would you want a version of this format at the world cup? I am guessing the answer is no? So why for the CL?
Are people possibly losing sight of what football is all about, in favour of falling for UEFA's marketing to you of "More matches means better"?
Only a small number of teams going out after EIGHT rounds of fixtures verges on totally pointless, when you actually remember what a competition is meant to be about.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, famously all leagues are considered terrible because nobody has been knocked out after 6 matches.
comment by welshpoolfan (U7693)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Shaun M - supercalifragilisticOrtaisatrocious (U9955)
posted 12 seconds ago
Why are Liverpool in pot 1? Leverkusen won there league and Arsenal finished above them. England's 3rd best team in with all the heavyweights plus Bottlejob Dortmund.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
UEFA coefficient is based on performance in UEFA competition. Where you finished in the domestic league is irrelevant.
Arsenal or Leverkusen haven't done as well in Europe as Liverpool over the last 5 or 6 years (not sure what the time frame is).
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Leverkusen reached last seasons final. A bit biased imo, seedings used to be based on the previous seasons performance, not based on a success period. Atalanta won the Europa league last season so are a bit unfortunate to be with teams that never win it.
Seedings don't really matter anyway. You get 2 teams from each pot no matter where you are.
comment by welshpoolfan (U7693)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by John McGlashan (U1734)
posted 2 minutes ago
Would you want a version of this format at the world cup? I am guessing the answer is no? So why for the CL?
Are people possibly losing sight of what football is all about, in favour of falling for UEFA's marketing to you of "More matches means better"?
Only a small number of teams going out after EIGHT rounds of fixtures verges on totally pointless, when you actually remember what a competition is meant to be about.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, famously all leagues are considered terrible because nobody has been knocked out after 6 matches.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Don't be like that. So you are happy for the World Cup to follow the same format? Give reasons for your answer.
Was there a need to make Europe's top competition a league? Is there a need to make the World Cup a league?
Having 8 rounds of matches for only a small number going out definitely dilutes the importance of each match. Yes, there may be SOME importance to all of them. Let's say 6/10 in terms of importance for all matches. But is that better than having 9/10 importance matches with a couple of 3/10 importance matches at the end?
I don't want to watch football always played at 60% because there is less importance on those individual matches.
Also, if I went to a pub and instead of them saying I could have a normal 4 pints that are 5%, they say the law has changed and you are only allowed 2.5% pints, but you can have 8 of those for the same price as the 4 pints at 5% that you used to get.
I would be rather disappointed.
Next they will want it down to 1% and can have 12 pints. It gets to the point where the pints are boring and pointless and have lost the appeal of what a pint is meant to be.
The same for football.
I suppose I’ll have to wait and see how this all pans out but I’m already thinking what’s the point to this new format? Why fix what wasn’t broken?
And they scrapped cup replays for this? 😠
comment by Shaun M - supercalifragilisticOrtaisatrocious (U9955)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by welshpoolfan (U7693)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Shaun M - supercalifragilisticOrtaisatrocious (U9955)
posted 12 seconds ago
Why are Liverpool in pot 1? Leverkusen won there league and Arsenal finished above them. England's 3rd best team in with all the heavyweights plus Bottlejob Dortmund.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
UEFA coefficient is based on performance in UEFA competition. Where you finished in the domestic league is irrelevant.
Arsenal or Leverkusen haven't done as well in Europe as Liverpool over the last 5 or 6 years (not sure what the time frame is).
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Leverkusen reached last seasons final. A bit biased imo, seedings used to be based on the previous seasons performance, not based on a success period. Atalanta won the Europa league last season so are a bit unfortunate to be with teams that never win it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Coefficient seedings have always been based on a period of about 5 years.
The only change that was introduced relatively recently was on the CL, pot 1 was reserved for the league winners of top leagues and the winners of CL/EL.
Sign in if you want to comment
New CL format
Page 1 of 3
posted on 14/8/24
Should have clarified that this new format also applies to the Europa League and the Conference League.
posted on 14/8/24
I think our players would be pretty happy with getting Brest.
posted on 14/8/24
comment by Calafiori knows how to Partey (U21076)
posted 1 minute ago
I think our players would be pretty happy with getting Brest.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's why we once signed Titi Camara
posted on 14/8/24
I like this new format where you play different oppositions rather than the home & away boring groups. You have to be really bad to not at least make the last 32 play off and good to see that the losers do not drop into the EL.
posted on 14/8/24
Thanks for the article. Instinctively it just feels 'wrong' to have a single league table comprising teams who don't all play each other, but even though it still looks far from ideal the explanations go some way to illustrating how it isn't quite as unfair as it might first appear.
As I understand from your sample draw above, you'll get two opponents from each pot, and you'll always face one of them at home and one away, right?
posted on 14/8/24
comment by welshpoolfan (U7693)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by Calafiori knows how to Partey (U21076)
posted 1 minute ago
I think our players would be pretty happy with getting Brest.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's why we once signed Titi Camara
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Booby Firmino
posted on 14/8/24
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 4 minutes ago
Thanks for the article. Instinctively it just feels 'wrong' to have a single league table comprising teams who don't all play each other, but even though it still looks far from ideal the explanations go some way to illustrating how it isn't quite as unfair as it might first appear.
As I understand from your sample draw above, you'll get two opponents from each pot, and you'll always face one of them at home and one away, right?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That is my understanding of how it will work, although I've struggled to find clear confirmation on how the home/away matches are decided. That feels the fairest and simplest way, but it is UEFA so who can tell.
posted on 14/8/24
I'm also curious to know how they plan to make room on the calendar for the extra fixtures.
My guess is FIFA will fight tooth and nail to preserve the number of int'l breaks, and they've also got plans for the expanded Club World Cup (unless they've been forced to scrap them).
My guess is domestic cups are going to be even further devalued, and we might see other big leagues reduced to 18 teams. Ligue 1 already went down to 18 last season, and I'm sure Serie A and La Liga would go down the same route if their big clubs had their way.
posted on 14/8/24
Will be interesting to see how few points are needed to get through to the 9th-24th round. Also how quickly the top teams secure top 8.
Should be good, should have big matches every week. It is meant to all but eliminate dead rubbers too.
posted on 14/8/24
I'm also curious to know how they plan to make room on the calendar for the extra fixtures.
====
It is already in the fixture list.
They have got rid of the winter break in England for starters, and cup replays have gone.
posted on 14/8/24
Comment deleted by Article Creator
posted on 14/8/24
comment by D'Jeezus Mackaroni (U1137)
posted 3 minutes ago
Will be interesting to see how few points are needed to get through to the 9th-24th round. Also how quickly the top teams secure top 8.
Should be good, should have big matches every week. It is meant to all but eliminate dead rubbers too.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah that will be interesting. Having 9 teams in pot 1 but only 8 last 16 places available also means that at least 1 of the top seeded teams is guaranteed to have to settle for a last 32 play-off at best.
posted on 14/8/24
It has a feel of Euros since 2016 about it, where very few teams actually end up going out after the group stage. You may argue that teams are playing for places so it makes it exciting, but that's not the reality. Removing the jeopardy of half the teams going out of the groups, and now having MORE games, makes each game FAR less significant.
Lose a couple of games in the old format and you would be struggling to get through.
Is there really a need for 8 matches just to decide positions of a play off round?
More matches doesn't make it better.
posted on 14/8/24
Comment deleted by Article Creator
posted on 14/8/24
comment by D'Jeezus Mackaroni (U1137)
posted 14 minutes ago
I'm also curious to know how they plan to make room on the calendar for the extra fixtures.
====
It is already in the fixture list.
They have got rid of the winter break in England for starters, and cup replays have gone.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It might suffice strictly on number of dates available, but the 4 additional fixtures in the event of having to play the R32 are a lot more than the cup replays a club might normally expect to be involved in.
Have there been any noises in England about scrapping or making wholesale changes to the League Cup?
Expanded CWC would only compound the matter further - and I think the European clubs aren't all that happy about it. I wonder if we'll see them taking second string squads or fielding weakened sides for it.
posted on 14/8/24
comment by John McGlashan (U1734)
posted 10 minutes ago
It has a feel of Euros since 2016 about it, where very few teams actually end up going out after the group stage. You may argue that teams are playing for places so it makes it exciting, but that's not the reality. Removing the jeopardy of half the teams going out of the groups, and now having MORE games, makes each game FAR less significant.
Lose a couple of games in the old format and you would be struggling to get through.
Is there really a need for 8 matches just to decide positions of a play off round?
More matches doesn't make it better.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That could equally be true. As far as I understand, there is no benefit to finishing first in the league over finishing 8th (I have no idea if prize money tapers or not) and similarly no difference between 9th-16th, 17th-24th, or 24th-36th.
posted on 14/8/24
Why are Liverpool in pot 1? Leverkusen won there league and Arsenal finished above them. England's 3rd best team in with all the heavyweights plus Bottlejob Dortmund.
posted on 14/8/24
Would you want a version of this format at the world cup? I am guessing the answer is no? So why for the CL?
Are people possibly losing sight of what football is all about, in favour of falling for UEFA's marketing to you of "More matches means better"?
Only a small number of teams going out after EIGHT rounds of fixtures verges on totally pointless, when you actually remember what a competition is meant to be about.
posted on 14/8/24
comment by Shaun M - supercalifragilisticOrtaisatrocious (U9955)
posted 12 seconds ago
Why are Liverpool in pot 1? Leverkusen won there league and Arsenal finished above them. England's 3rd best team in with all the heavyweights plus Bottlejob Dortmund.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
UEFA coefficient is based on performance in UEFA competition. Where you finished in the domestic league is irrelevant.
Arsenal or Leverkusen haven't done as well in Europe as Liverpool over the last 5 or 6 years (not sure what the time frame is).
posted on 14/8/24
comment by John McGlashan (U1734)
posted 2 minutes ago
Would you want a version of this format at the world cup? I am guessing the answer is no? So why for the CL?
Are people possibly losing sight of what football is all about, in favour of falling for UEFA's marketing to you of "More matches means better"?
Only a small number of teams going out after EIGHT rounds of fixtures verges on totally pointless, when you actually remember what a competition is meant to be about.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, famously all leagues are considered terrible because nobody has been knocked out after 6 matches.
posted on 14/8/24
comment by welshpoolfan (U7693)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Shaun M - supercalifragilisticOrtaisatrocious (U9955)
posted 12 seconds ago
Why are Liverpool in pot 1? Leverkusen won there league and Arsenal finished above them. England's 3rd best team in with all the heavyweights plus Bottlejob Dortmund.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
UEFA coefficient is based on performance in UEFA competition. Where you finished in the domestic league is irrelevant.
Arsenal or Leverkusen haven't done as well in Europe as Liverpool over the last 5 or 6 years (not sure what the time frame is).
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Leverkusen reached last seasons final. A bit biased imo, seedings used to be based on the previous seasons performance, not based on a success period. Atalanta won the Europa league last season so are a bit unfortunate to be with teams that never win it.
posted on 14/8/24
Seedings don't really matter anyway. You get 2 teams from each pot no matter where you are.
posted on 14/8/24
comment by welshpoolfan (U7693)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by John McGlashan (U1734)
posted 2 minutes ago
Would you want a version of this format at the world cup? I am guessing the answer is no? So why for the CL?
Are people possibly losing sight of what football is all about, in favour of falling for UEFA's marketing to you of "More matches means better"?
Only a small number of teams going out after EIGHT rounds of fixtures verges on totally pointless, when you actually remember what a competition is meant to be about.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, famously all leagues are considered terrible because nobody has been knocked out after 6 matches.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Don't be like that. So you are happy for the World Cup to follow the same format? Give reasons for your answer.
Was there a need to make Europe's top competition a league? Is there a need to make the World Cup a league?
Having 8 rounds of matches for only a small number going out definitely dilutes the importance of each match. Yes, there may be SOME importance to all of them. Let's say 6/10 in terms of importance for all matches. But is that better than having 9/10 importance matches with a couple of 3/10 importance matches at the end?
I don't want to watch football always played at 60% because there is less importance on those individual matches.
Also, if I went to a pub and instead of them saying I could have a normal 4 pints that are 5%, they say the law has changed and you are only allowed 2.5% pints, but you can have 8 of those for the same price as the 4 pints at 5% that you used to get.
I would be rather disappointed.
Next they will want it down to 1% and can have 12 pints. It gets to the point where the pints are boring and pointless and have lost the appeal of what a pint is meant to be.
The same for football.
posted on 14/8/24
I suppose I’ll have to wait and see how this all pans out but I’m already thinking what’s the point to this new format? Why fix what wasn’t broken?
And they scrapped cup replays for this? 😠
posted on 14/8/24
comment by Shaun M - supercalifragilisticOrtaisatrocious (U9955)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by welshpoolfan (U7693)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Shaun M - supercalifragilisticOrtaisatrocious (U9955)
posted 12 seconds ago
Why are Liverpool in pot 1? Leverkusen won there league and Arsenal finished above them. England's 3rd best team in with all the heavyweights plus Bottlejob Dortmund.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
UEFA coefficient is based on performance in UEFA competition. Where you finished in the domestic league is irrelevant.
Arsenal or Leverkusen haven't done as well in Europe as Liverpool over the last 5 or 6 years (not sure what the time frame is).
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Leverkusen reached last seasons final. A bit biased imo, seedings used to be based on the previous seasons performance, not based on a success period. Atalanta won the Europa league last season so are a bit unfortunate to be with teams that never win it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Coefficient seedings have always been based on a period of about 5 years.
The only change that was introduced relatively recently was on the CL, pot 1 was reserved for the league winners of top leagues and the winners of CL/EL.
Page 1 of 3