Maybe you should consider supporting another team.
"a disaster" ?
Dear oh dear oh dear.
you could see how fluid the midfield could be when Cleverly played in the first half. Quick, one touch passing. Picking the right pass with the correct weighting. Not exactly rocket science.
We could have all the creative midfielders in the world but what we need more than anything is a tough tackling ball winner to protect the backline. Fletcher assumed this role and he looked fairly comfortable, that is until Everton piled on the pressure then we saw his limitations in all its glory!
You actually need to ask why two 18 year olds are not starting?
They are fantastic prospects, but we know next to nothing about how they would cope in the PL.
SAF knows what he is doing.... It is just that simple.
Imagine your scenario and he throws them into the weekend's game.... the occasion gets to them and they have a nightmare... their confidence is shot and the fans are on their back.... Not good.
They will gently be introduced.... A few games where the game is as good as done, let them get used to the pace... Then, if they are looking good each time, perhaps a start against an easier team, at home.
Slowly slowly is the way to do it.... unless Fletch, Carrick, Ando, Park and Giggs all fall ill (Which, i'm sure, some of you would love!)
Disaster, keeping a clean sheet and beating Everton away from home.
Why were we not scoring four or five.
Fletcher assumed this role and he looked fairly comfortable, that is until Everton piled on the pressure then we saw his limitations in all its glory!
...............
Spot on.
At the end of the day, Fletch is nowhere near good enough to warrant a starting place in the Un ited midfield.
Spot on.
At the end of the day, Fletch is nowhere near good enough to warrant a starting place in the Un ited midfield.
---------------------------------------------
Wasn't long ago his absence was being blamed as part of the reason United lost to Barca in a Champions League final.
How fans are fickle eh.
Now to answers the OP's question. If the likes of Pogba and Morrison are the future then why are they not getting the games?
Bizarre question really. Fergie is not rushing them because they need to be integrated within the first team gradually. He has used the league cup as the platform to blood players in the past and he is doing the same this term.
Both Pogba and Morrison have had limited game time but they have impressed none the less. Both will make it but I feel the latter has more issues than some to contend with. I refer to his off field antics which have been well documented on this forum and the wider media. Players like him run the risk of "going off the rails" if suddenly first team action gives him more limelight and the perils it brings especially to a person with behavioural issues!
I still expect both players to be shipped off on loan next to get more experience.
What we need from fans now is patience when it comes to the youth and also a touch a realism. You cannot expect young players, though precocious, to displace established squad players. They have to earn the right to play.
So does anybody here what the deal is with Rafael Leao, never actually seen him play. And how is Petrucci comin along?
Cheers
Wasn't long ago his absence was being blamed as part of the reason United lost to Barca in a Champions League final.
How fans are fickle eh.
....................
I never once subscribed to that theory, and have never been a fan of Fletch.
That season was the only good one he has ever had in a United shirt, though.
At the end of the day, Fletch is nowhere near good enough to warrant a starting place in the Un ited midfield.
------------------------------------------
Well, who else is available (Cleverley aside), Fletcher was never a quality midfielder, just a good work horse who can run around all day, break up play and then guess what lose the ball again with them pathetic hoof the ball forward. Anderson is waay to inconsistant, Carrick is well Carrick, sideways passes and what not, There is no midfielder in the team who has that creativity spark within them.
comment by RenegadeOF (U9457)
posted 4 minutes ago
Spot on.
At the end of the day, Fletch is nowhere near good enough to warrant a starting place in the Un ited midfield.
---------------------------------------------
Wasn't long ago his absence was being blamed as part of the reason United lost to Barca in a Champions League final.
How fans are fickle eh.
===
Why should fans live on mere sentiments? Sentiments do not get you results.
The season you allude to was probably a personal best for Fletcher. He has failed to reach those heights for various reasons, injury being the main.
Well, who else is available
....................
Both Carrick and Anderson are superior to Fletcher, in just about every department.
More Utd fans waking up, good to see !
Both Carrick and Anderson are superior to Fletcher, in just about every department.
-----------------------------------
Really?
Disagree completley. The one that performs best in the big games is Fletcher.
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 50 seconds ago
Well, who else is available
....................
Both Carrick and Anderson are superior to Fletcher, in just about every department.
======
As individuals they have their merits but what puzzles me is that Fergie cannot figure out a partnership that works.
I am not Carrick's biggest fan but he provides a better defensive cover, although limited relative to the best in the world, than say Fletcher.
Anderson looks a world beater one minute then his form drops dramatically. It is alarming he cannot build up momentum and establish himself as our midfield fulcrum. Maybe Fergie is culpable and is not man managing the player sufficiently, chopping and changing the midfield constantly does not help his form.
The only player that gives me encouragement is Cleverley. I admire the simplicity in his game. He regulates the tempo of our passing perfectly but why aren't the rest stepping up?
It's interesting that Cleverley is being hailed by so many on this board yet he has only appeared in 5 league games.
I think I remember similiar praise for Anderson after a few games, now its back to same old Anderson.
Fletcher is returning from an illness, and stick is given.
Carrick has been taking stick since his second season.
Yet United have won the league title 4 out of the last 5 seasons. Yes you guys must be real football gurus, Fletcher, Carrick and Anderson aren't good enough.
Cleverley who has played 5 games or so is the answer. As are Pogba and Morrison.
Disagree completley. The one that performs best in the big games is Fletcher.
..........................
Yes, he was immense against City.
I guess you are Scottish, which would account for you like of Fletch. But Fletch has not played well for United for around two years now, maybe longer.
comment by RenegadeOF (U9457)
=====
Fergie has gone on record that at any given time he needs 8 players to be at their very best to win a match.
The central midfield, whatever the combination, is average at best so they are automatically omitted from that assertion.
So in VDS we had a consistent world class keeper, a decent defence which includes one of the world's best in Vida, two marauding wingers which includes the creative but frustrating Nani and Rooney.
Game by game consistency & a bit a luck gives you a title winning team.
Imagine if only we could add a central midfield pairing who were exceptional.
I think anyone who has seen Pogba play will agree that he`s destined for big things. And most fans also realise that he`s also able to talk to other clubs in january.
I think he definitely needs to at least be getting a few minutes as a late sub in games like our next two, or he could decide that he`ll get more opportunities elsewhere.
Sir Alex said in the summer that his reasons for not dipping into the transfer market for another CM was down to guys like Pogba and made the point that he would eventually go if not given game time.
Maybe Fergie is culpable and is not man managing the player sufficiently, chopping and changing the midfield constantly does not help his form.
....................
That is exactly how I see it. Anderson had a run of a few games last season when he played really well, but found himself being ousted for Gibson.
Anderson is best suited to play with Carrick in the UNited midfield, because Carrick seems to be the only one who thinks at the same speed as Ando.
Cleverley also looks as if he and Anderson could gel.
It is all about pass and movement, and this is not Fletch's biggest asset.
Yes, he was immense against City.
--------------------------------------------------
And which other United players can walk away with credit?
He was the only one that actually scored. When he is seen as the one to 'break up play' as well.
I'm not just backing Fletcher, more laughing at the United fans slating their own midfield that has won them 4 titles in the last 5 years. Minus Paul Scholes of course.
Vidicschin (U3584)
I agree with your points re: Ando and Cleverley partnership. I sat back and thought to myself "thank christ for that, we`ve finally cracked it", for the first few games up til Cleverley`s injury. It`s no coincidence that we were looking classy and assured in the centre with those two in tandem.
I think they should start on saturday together, should Cleverley`s injury only be minor like the boss says.
"I'm not just backing Fletcher, more laughing at the United fans slating their own midfield that has won them 4 titles in the last 5 years. Minus Paul Scholes of course."
Then you`re a bit of a burke pal. Most of us aren`t "slating" anyone. The last time i checked this is a forum to "debate"???
And the funniest thing is, you answered your own question there in the last sentence you posted - we NEED to replace Paul Scholes. Ok he wasn`t as effective in the second part of last season, but his presence alone was enough to inspire and bring the best out in others.
And most of us just can`t see that spark in Fletcher and Carrick, as good as they are on their day.
You`re talking of the difference between a world renowned midfield legend and two very good midfielders who, on their day could mix it with the best, but seldom do, for whatever reason and need a Scholes type figure/player to bring the best out in them.
Sign in if you want to comment
if morrison and pogba are the future then
Page 1 of 3
posted on 31/10/11
Maybe you should consider supporting another team.
posted on 31/10/11
"a disaster" ?
Dear oh dear oh dear.
posted on 31/10/11
lolzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
posted on 31/10/11
you could see how fluid the midfield could be when Cleverly played in the first half. Quick, one touch passing. Picking the right pass with the correct weighting. Not exactly rocket science.
We could have all the creative midfielders in the world but what we need more than anything is a tough tackling ball winner to protect the backline. Fletcher assumed this role and he looked fairly comfortable, that is until Everton piled on the pressure then we saw his limitations in all its glory!
posted on 31/10/11
You actually need to ask why two 18 year olds are not starting?
They are fantastic prospects, but we know next to nothing about how they would cope in the PL.
SAF knows what he is doing.... It is just that simple.
Imagine your scenario and he throws them into the weekend's game.... the occasion gets to them and they have a nightmare... their confidence is shot and the fans are on their back.... Not good.
They will gently be introduced.... A few games where the game is as good as done, let them get used to the pace... Then, if they are looking good each time, perhaps a start against an easier team, at home.
Slowly slowly is the way to do it.... unless Fletch, Carrick, Ando, Park and Giggs all fall ill (Which, i'm sure, some of you would love!)
posted on 31/10/11
Disaster, keeping a clean sheet and beating Everton away from home.
Why were we not scoring four or five.
posted on 31/10/11
Fletcher assumed this role and he looked fairly comfortable, that is until Everton piled on the pressure then we saw his limitations in all its glory!
...............
Spot on.
At the end of the day, Fletch is nowhere near good enough to warrant a starting place in the Un ited midfield.
posted on 31/10/11
Spot on.
At the end of the day, Fletch is nowhere near good enough to warrant a starting place in the Un ited midfield.
---------------------------------------------
Wasn't long ago his absence was being blamed as part of the reason United lost to Barca in a Champions League final.
How fans are fickle eh.
posted on 31/10/11
Now to answers the OP's question. If the likes of Pogba and Morrison are the future then why are they not getting the games?
Bizarre question really. Fergie is not rushing them because they need to be integrated within the first team gradually. He has used the league cup as the platform to blood players in the past and he is doing the same this term.
Both Pogba and Morrison have had limited game time but they have impressed none the less. Both will make it but I feel the latter has more issues than some to contend with. I refer to his off field antics which have been well documented on this forum and the wider media. Players like him run the risk of "going off the rails" if suddenly first team action gives him more limelight and the perils it brings especially to a person with behavioural issues!
I still expect both players to be shipped off on loan next to get more experience.
What we need from fans now is patience when it comes to the youth and also a touch a realism. You cannot expect young players, though precocious, to displace established squad players. They have to earn the right to play.
posted on 31/10/11
So does anybody here what the deal is with Rafael Leao, never actually seen him play. And how is Petrucci comin along?
Cheers
posted on 31/10/11
Wasn't long ago his absence was being blamed as part of the reason United lost to Barca in a Champions League final.
How fans are fickle eh.
....................
I never once subscribed to that theory, and have never been a fan of Fletch.
That season was the only good one he has ever had in a United shirt, though.
posted on 31/10/11
At the end of the day, Fletch is nowhere near good enough to warrant a starting place in the Un ited midfield.
------------------------------------------
Well, who else is available (Cleverley aside), Fletcher was never a quality midfielder, just a good work horse who can run around all day, break up play and then guess what lose the ball again with them pathetic hoof the ball forward. Anderson is waay to inconsistant, Carrick is well Carrick, sideways passes and what not, There is no midfielder in the team who has that creativity spark within them.
posted on 31/10/11
comment by RenegadeOF (U9457)
posted 4 minutes ago
Spot on.
At the end of the day, Fletch is nowhere near good enough to warrant a starting place in the Un ited midfield.
---------------------------------------------
Wasn't long ago his absence was being blamed as part of the reason United lost to Barca in a Champions League final.
How fans are fickle eh.
===
Why should fans live on mere sentiments? Sentiments do not get you results.
The season you allude to was probably a personal best for Fletcher. He has failed to reach those heights for various reasons, injury being the main.
posted on 31/10/11
Well, who else is available
....................
Both Carrick and Anderson are superior to Fletcher, in just about every department.
posted on 31/10/11
More Utd fans waking up, good to see !
posted on 31/10/11
Both Carrick and Anderson are superior to Fletcher, in just about every department.
-----------------------------------
Really?
Disagree completley. The one that performs best in the big games is Fletcher.
posted on 31/10/11
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 50 seconds ago
Well, who else is available
....................
Both Carrick and Anderson are superior to Fletcher, in just about every department.
======
As individuals they have their merits but what puzzles me is that Fergie cannot figure out a partnership that works.
I am not Carrick's biggest fan but he provides a better defensive cover, although limited relative to the best in the world, than say Fletcher.
Anderson looks a world beater one minute then his form drops dramatically. It is alarming he cannot build up momentum and establish himself as our midfield fulcrum. Maybe Fergie is culpable and is not man managing the player sufficiently, chopping and changing the midfield constantly does not help his form.
The only player that gives me encouragement is Cleverley. I admire the simplicity in his game. He regulates the tempo of our passing perfectly but why aren't the rest stepping up?
posted on 31/10/11
It's interesting that Cleverley is being hailed by so many on this board yet he has only appeared in 5 league games.
I think I remember similiar praise for Anderson after a few games, now its back to same old Anderson.
Fletcher is returning from an illness, and stick is given.
Carrick has been taking stick since his second season.
Yet United have won the league title 4 out of the last 5 seasons. Yes you guys must be real football gurus, Fletcher, Carrick and Anderson aren't good enough.
Cleverley who has played 5 games or so is the answer. As are Pogba and Morrison.
posted on 31/10/11
Disagree completley. The one that performs best in the big games is Fletcher.
..........................
Yes, he was immense against City.
I guess you are Scottish, which would account for you like of Fletch. But Fletch has not played well for United for around two years now, maybe longer.
posted on 31/10/11
comment by RenegadeOF (U9457)
=====
Fergie has gone on record that at any given time he needs 8 players to be at their very best to win a match.
The central midfield, whatever the combination, is average at best so they are automatically omitted from that assertion.
So in VDS we had a consistent world class keeper, a decent defence which includes one of the world's best in Vida, two marauding wingers which includes the creative but frustrating Nani and Rooney.
Game by game consistency & a bit a luck gives you a title winning team.
Imagine if only we could add a central midfield pairing who were exceptional.
posted on 31/10/11
I think anyone who has seen Pogba play will agree that he`s destined for big things. And most fans also realise that he`s also able to talk to other clubs in january.
I think he definitely needs to at least be getting a few minutes as a late sub in games like our next two, or he could decide that he`ll get more opportunities elsewhere.
Sir Alex said in the summer that his reasons for not dipping into the transfer market for another CM was down to guys like Pogba and made the point that he would eventually go if not given game time.
posted on 31/10/11
Maybe Fergie is culpable and is not man managing the player sufficiently, chopping and changing the midfield constantly does not help his form.
....................
That is exactly how I see it. Anderson had a run of a few games last season when he played really well, but found himself being ousted for Gibson.
Anderson is best suited to play with Carrick in the UNited midfield, because Carrick seems to be the only one who thinks at the same speed as Ando.
Cleverley also looks as if he and Anderson could gel.
It is all about pass and movement, and this is not Fletch's biggest asset.
posted on 31/10/11
Yes, he was immense against City.
--------------------------------------------------
And which other United players can walk away with credit?
He was the only one that actually scored. When he is seen as the one to 'break up play' as well.
I'm not just backing Fletcher, more laughing at the United fans slating their own midfield that has won them 4 titles in the last 5 years. Minus Paul Scholes of course.
posted on 31/10/11
Vidicschin (U3584)
I agree with your points re: Ando and Cleverley partnership. I sat back and thought to myself "thank christ for that, we`ve finally cracked it", for the first few games up til Cleverley`s injury. It`s no coincidence that we were looking classy and assured in the centre with those two in tandem.
I think they should start on saturday together, should Cleverley`s injury only be minor like the boss says.
posted on 31/10/11
"I'm not just backing Fletcher, more laughing at the United fans slating their own midfield that has won them 4 titles in the last 5 years. Minus Paul Scholes of course."
Then you`re a bit of a burke pal. Most of us aren`t "slating" anyone. The last time i checked this is a forum to "debate"???
And the funniest thing is, you answered your own question there in the last sentence you posted - we NEED to replace Paul Scholes. Ok he wasn`t as effective in the second part of last season, but his presence alone was enough to inspire and bring the best out in others.
And most of us just can`t see that spark in Fletcher and Carrick, as good as they are on their day.
You`re talking of the difference between a world renowned midfield legend and two very good midfielders who, on their day could mix it with the best, but seldom do, for whatever reason and need a Scholes type figure/player to bring the best out in them.
Page 1 of 3