Jan again, it's not my valuation, it's the clubs. Doesnt mean that's what he is worth.

You wander away from the computer for half an hour and the thread becomes a journos bag of shoite.

No offence meant, of course

Jloo, you have made an assumption that after his poor performance in the Senior side and at the U21's he will get a look in or be a regular in a well stocked Liverpool midfield. Rodwell is hardly playing CM with Championship players either

I guess we have a wager then?

Toot-Toot!

comment by FatJanMolby (U4297)


posted 13 minutes ago

this is a figure the club would want. DOESNT mean he is worth that figure.

--

So your valuation is £25m for a player who is a bit injury prone, isn't a regular starter and yet you call us delusional for paying £16m for Hendo..
-------------------------------------------------------------

No, all he's doing is pointing out there are mugs like you out there willing to pay that price. Something which is self-evident and makes you delusional not him

Thanks N-n-n-nineteen.

What was difficult for Jan to understand?

comment by Phil Jagielkas Sweatband. (U1308)


posted 7 minutes ago

Thanks N-n-n-nineteen.

What was difficult for Jan to understand?
----------------------------------------

As a guess I would say life in general

N-n--n-nineteen and PJS

This is how transfers work. The team put a valuation on their player, whether or not he is actually worth it. The buying team decides to meet that valuation if they want that player. Sunderland put a valuation of £16m on Henderson, and we met it. Is he worth £16m? Probably not, but that was the going price we which decided to pay for a potentially very good player.

Was Ronaldo worth £80m( £30m more than Zidane). Never, but Real Madrid decided to pay the price. Is Phil Jones worth £17m. No, but Fergie decided to pay it.

This is what you boys need to understand. No Liverpool fan thinks that Hendo is worth £16m but that is the going price for young British talent. And this is proven by the sales in recent years of SWP, Milner, Bentley, Phil Jones, Rooney, Lescott, Carrick, Hargreaves, Glen Johnson.....We're certainly not the first team to do this and certainly won't be the last. I honestly don't know why your so astonished by the price?

This is how the world in general works lads; whether it be property, cars, football shirts, a pint of lager.

lol.. typical liverpool.

blame everyone else around them for the cost of english players

kenny came into money this january and decided to go blow it all on carroll within the blink of an eye then again with henderson this summer

if comolli and jenny negotiated better, they could have got much better deals but yeah blame everyone else around for the price of players except yourselves

comment by FatJanMolby (U4297)


posted 12 minutes ago

N-n--n-nineteen and PJS

This is how transfers work. The team put a valuation on their player, whether or not he is actually worth it. The buying team decides to meet that valuation if they want that player. Sunderland put a valuation of £16m on Henderson, and we met it. Is he worth £16m? Probably not, but that was the going price we which decided to pay for a potentially very good player.

Was Ronaldo worth £80m( £30m more than Zidane). Never, but Real Madrid decided to pay the price. Is Phil Jones worth £17m. No, but Fergie decided to pay it.

This is what you boys need to understand. No Liverpool fan thinks that Hendo is worth £16m but that is the going price for young British talent. And this is proven by the sales in recent years of SWP, Milner, Bentley, Phil Jones, Rooney, Lescott, Carrick, Hargreaves, Glen Johnson.....We're certainly not the first team to do this and certainly won't be the last. I honestly don't know why your so astonished by the price?

This is how the world in general works lads; whether it be property, cars, football shirts, a pint of lager.

-------------------------------------------------------------

Haven't you just said what Phil Jags Sweatband was saying?????

Everton can put a price tag of £25m on their player and if another club want him they will pay. As you've implied, a player is only worth what someone is willing to pay for them.

You have to bear in mind though that when the likes of LFC spend £35m on Carroll and £20m on Henderson then it gives a reason for teams like Everton to put a fat price on their players because they will feel they have a realistic chance of achieving it.

mr chelsea, you haven't really been blessed with intelligence have you son.

Did you see anything in my post that said other teams were to blame. If you read what I wrote carefully, you'll see I also mention Glen Johnson who we bought for £18m. Not worth it, but unfortunately the price you pay for English talent.

We all do it, and the evidence is there for you all to see. Prices for English players are inflated but if you want that player you have to pay it. We wanted Hendo and we had to pay the price, or do you really think that our owners who have made billions in finance went in with an offer of £16m straight from the go. It is clear to everyone that that was Sunderland valuation.

You have to bear in mind though that when the likes of LFC spend £35m on Carroll and £20m on Henderson then it gives a reason for teams like Everton to put a fat price on their players because they will feel they have a realistic chance of achieving it.

---------

I agree with PJS and I'm glad that he knows how the market works. Presumably you agree too. If you do, you can't call us mugs for paying market prices. We've not done anything crazy or extrordinary here as I've shown by the comparisons to other English players. The team you support have just bought a player for the same amount who has less first team appearances, doesn't yet have an England cap. I bet you don't think Fergie is a mug do you?

There have been rumours for over a year ythat Man Utd were interested in Rodwell and the price rumoured has always been between £20-25m. So no I don't think their valuation has anything to do with what we paid for Carrol or Hendo.

Don't understand where you're going with this. You were the one questioning Rodwell's valuation not me. Also, it was you that made the comparison between your purchases and Rodwell....

FatJanMolby (U4297)
-----------------------------
So your valuation is £25m for a player who is a bit injury prone, isn't a regular starter and yet you call us delusional for paying £16m for Hendo..
------------------------------------------------------------

All I pointed out was that it isn't delusional for Everton as a selling club to put a price on a player like Rodwell when there are teams like LFC paying extortionate prices for questionable signings. If you agree with that then why make the above comment in the first place?

In answer to your other point. Yes you are mugs for buying Carroll for £35m because you are the buying club (not the selling one). You can bring up Fergie's signings but there's a number of differences. First of all Fergie doesn't need to build a trophy winning team, he already has one. Secondly he's spent less than that on quality signings like Smalling and Chico which have helped him to win the league so not all his signings are overpriced. Thirdly Fergie's not breaking United's transfer record to buy these players. Fourthly you spent £35m for Andy Carroll after 19 appearances in the prem ffs! Finally, Downing is not good enough for Liverpool or for any top 4 team. Jaysus man, Spurs fans were getting excited about possibly getting him. Is that your level? It's ok to overspend on players with real potential but unforgivable to do so on 2 rubbish players when you're looking for your first trophy in 5-6 years.

Mate it is quite clear where I am going with this. Everton value Rodwell at £25m and Sunderland valued Henderson at £16m. We both agree that neither is worth it, but if Everton think Rodwell is valued at £25m, then I can't see why we are getting stick for buying a player who Sunderland valued at £16m, when this £16m player has actually done more to justify his valuation. I thinks thats quite clear don't you.

It doesn't matter how many title Fergie has won. That has nothing to do with paying £17m for Jones. We're not building a team around Henderson either, he's one for the future as is Jones. In fact I doubt Henderson will start a half of our games this season.

Carroll is a complete anamoly and you know this. He was bought in a January window where prices are inflated anyway because no team wants to lose their player half way through a season, add the fact that he is a young English talent (more inflation) and thirdly and most importantly Newcastle knew we were sellling Carroll for £50m. The Carroll buy was a gesture from the owners, to say we're not concerned that Torres is going, and it worked. Instead of us sulking about Torres leaving there was a feel good factor around Anfield. He is not worth £35m, we all know this. But who cares anyway. The only people that seem to care are non-Liverpool fans and it really is no concern of yours. If he scores goals and helps us get back into the Champions League then he has paid for himself.

We'll probably have to agree to disagree on this, but I think we've bought the better player and the better professional in Downing than you did with Young.

There is absolutely no justifcation to say that these two players are rubbish. In fact far from it, they are two talented players who will be very good players in the future. I'm not just saying this because they are our players. I've was actually impressed with both at Newcastle and Sunderland.

That shoudl read selling Torres for £50m not Carroll

I think Rodwell would definitely be more valuable than Henderson. Yes Henderson had more first team games than Rodwell last season, but Rodwell has been injured and Everton have a far superior midfield to Sunderland so it's harder to get a game ahead of Arteta and Fellaini. Rodwell and Henderson are both good technically, but Rodwell is superior physically, he is faster, stronger and taller and this counts for a lot in the premier league.

I'm sure most teams if they had the choice would choose Rodwell over Henderson. Also the only reason Henderson got that England cap and not Rodwell was because of Rodwells injury.

First of all you're buying Henderson for £20m. Secondly, you need to understand that Everton are not mugs for putting a £25m price tag on their player. Sunderland are not mugs for putting a £20m price tag on their player. If they achieve that price it makes them bloody shrewd. It's like saying United are mugs for wanting £80m for Ronaldo. For you to say Everton are mugs doesn't make sense when even you accept that in today's market somebody might pay that for him.

You missed the point about my Fergie comments. It's not one of those 5 reasons but all collectively. If you're looking for silverware, you're buying players and all of them are overpriced and imo (although we agree to disagree here) all except 1 is average (not LFC quality) and certainly not good enough to scare your competition. So I don't understand the statement of intent either? By the way surely the Suarez signing would have done that???

We will defintely agree to disagree about Young and Downing although I remember before both signings a lot of liverpool fans were wanting to buy Young and I can't recall any mentioning Downing.

Not a Man Utd or Liverpool fan but I would prefer Ashley Young over Downing any day. Simply the better player

N-n-n-nineteen

There is nothing wrong with Everton or Sunderland putting those types of valuations on players and at no point did I say that Everton were mugs for doing so.

This is the market for English players. We've not done anything different to what Spurs did when buying Bentley, or what Chelsea did with buying SWP, or Man City did when buying Milner and Lescott or what Man Utd did with Jones, Carrick and Hargreaves but for some reason we seem to be getting an enormous amount of stick for doing it.

The reason I compared Rodwell and the Henderson price is because it perfectly exemplifies the English transfer market. Everton value him at £25m and Sunderland valued Henderson at £20m. Both are ridiculous prices but I think that Henderson has done more to justify that price tag in the last year or so (even though it is inflated). So if Everton think that Rodwell is valued at £25m in this market I don't see how Everton fans such as PJS can think it is that outrageous that Henderson is valued at £20m when he had a better season and is in my opinion the better player. The fact that we were willing to pay that price is irrelevant. You can't call us delusional or mugs for meeting the market price of a player that we wanted.

We will have to agree to disagree here again. I think every player we have bought (regardless of price) is a good player. They are all PL players, who all had good seasons last year. Our believe we've made our squad better. Our first team was always good enough to beat the teams around us, as we showed in the second half of the season, we beat Man Utd, Chelsea, Man City and drew with Arsenal, but what we didn't have was a good squad and I think that now we do. Maybe a couple of defenders are needed. The actual money spent doesn't matter to me. We're a debt free club who are making money (unlike Man Utd and Chelsea) so if we feel we can afford these prices then so be it. Its not for me to argue, and it certainly isn't the business of rival fans. They should be concerned with their own clubs.

And I'm glad that these players don't worry you too much. We'll quietly get on with it next season with no pressure and get a top 4 place.

Anyway, I'm bored of this topic now so I'll leave it there.

Jan. How can you think Henderson has achieved more?

He has not played as many PL games as Rodwell, has not played in Europe at all.

The main difference is the single England cap in a friendly where he was shown up.

imagine how much queen Jenny would pay for rodwell . Cash in before the senile old boy gets fired

Jan. How can you think Henderson has achieved more?

He has not played as many PL games as Rodwell, has not played in Europe at all.

The main difference is the single England cap in a friendly where he was shown up.

---

PJS, as an Everton you'd think you knew a little more about your own player. Rodwell and Henderson have each had 71 appearances each for their respective clubs however Henderson has started more games.

He is also chosen ahead of Rodwell in the U21. Even Mancienne who is actually a defender is getting into the U21 team ahead of Rodwell.

And now Henderson is playing for a better club than Rodwell. Don't get me wrong, I think Rodwell is a good player and he clearly has talent, but Henderson in my opinion has more. He is more creative than Rodwell, he creates chances, he is more of a goal threat and he is a very good passer of the ball.

he creates chances, he is more of a goal threat and he is a very good passer of the ball.

==

Thats a hell of a thing to say about Rodwell

To be honest I have not paid that much attention to Henderson. But having one more England cap and playing in a 6th place team must make him better then

To be honest I have not paid that much attention to Henderson

--------

And yet you tell us we wasted out money. The mind boggles.

Did I say wasted? I said he was overpriced