Gerrard?? You thi k hes played poorly vor England? Wasnt he englands best player in 2012 tourno? I think he's got more goals in the last 3 tournos than rooney btw!
I'm a supporter of Rooney for England but he hasn't really 'proven' himself
a purple patch of 2 games a decade ago isn't really proof of anything.
Gerrard was England's best player at the last Euro's and is one of the most consistent and best performers...
I would argue that welbeck offers more than Rooney for England.
comment by Got_Better (U6241)
posted 21 seconds ago
Gerrard?? You thi k hes played poorly vor England? Wasnt he englands best player in 2012 tourno? I think he's got more goals in the last 3 tournos than rooney btw!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Hasn't been great.
He had 3 'assists' at the last tournament. 2 really good deliveries for Lescott and then Carroll and then the GK fumbling the ball to Rooney. Overall, he was ok, but never imposed himself, but then he never really does for England. When a really big performance is needed, he doesn't deliver. Not only him. But when we've been beaten in tournaments, when has it been a defeat despite the best efforts of Gerrard? Same with most players. We get beat and its a damp squib of an effort from the players.
If you discount Rooney for not performing, then you should for Gerrard.
comment by Barf Vader (U15867)
posted 18 minutes ago
Surely if people are arguing against Rooney being included due to not having good previous tournaments, then is it fair to ask for everyone else with previous tournament experience to not be included?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
and when Rooney isn't scoring, what is he doing for the team? Yep, NOTHING! If he was contributing towards the team, fine. Sadly he does nothing for England at tournaments, goals or great contribution. There are other players who should be given the chance ahead of him.
Why are you even having this discussion anyways? Hodge will NOT drop Rooney no matter what, so pointless discussing it
Barf....ur way off mate. Gerrard has played well for england, has assists and goals and you can see the effort.
I said before its NOT a man u vs lfc point, its a point based on performance and goals. Rooney quite simply as England's striker has a shocking goals return at tournos and also his play is poor. Gerrard play is better and he offers more in an England shirt, to think otherwise is blinkered.....go look at the videos if you like and the stats.
"and when Rooney isn't scoring, what is he doing for the team? Yep, NOTHING!"
actually that's why I think he needs to be in the side, even if he's not scoring he's busting a gut all over the ptich, closing down, helping out in defence and picking out teammates with solid passes.
playing the support role and doing all those other bits probably doesn't help his scoring record
GB
Rooney quite simply as England's striker has a shocking goals return at tournos
-------------------------------------------
Off the top of my head he has 5 in 14(13 starts), which is not great, not entirely rubbish.
Of those 14, 4 of them (Euro 04) were when he was fully fit. All the rest were when he probably shouldn't have gone due not not being fit.
Hart
Johnson Cahill Jagielka Baines
Gerrard Wilshere
Sterling Rooney Lallana
Sturridge
Forster
Walker Smalling Jones Shaw
Henderson Carrick
Chamberlain Barkley Johnson
Lambert
Barf,....as I said then, shocking!
You know what, I wouldnt mind but effort wise he is poor as well. People dont consider that its the continual selection of players that flop at tournos that contributes to the pz poor England tournos record.
You want to win or do well in tournos? Play players that perform in them, dont rely on those that CONTINUALLY underperform; its not rocket science is it!
I think Rooney should play behind Studge with Lallana and Sterling on the wings. Gerrard beside Henderson or Milner and Shaw at left back. The rest picks itself.
comment by TheKaisersTrainers Love FSG (U5676)
posted 12 minutes ago
"and when Rooney isn't scoring, what is he doing for the team? Yep, NOTHING!"
actually that's why I think he needs to be in the side, even if he's not scoring he's busting a gut all over the ptich, closing down, helping out in defence and picking out teammates with solid passes.
playing the support role and doing all those other bits probably doesn't help his scoring record
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No he isn't. He is greedy and selfish. I have lost count of the number of times he gives the ball away, gets tackled because he hasn't passed when he should have, or shoots when it is easier to pass to a player in a better position. He is not international tournament material. Barnes was the same. Absolutely amazing for us, but for England he was largely pointless. Some players have it when it comes to the international stage, some don't. Macca was one of those also. Welbeck for instance is the opposite, not that great a player, but seems to do well for England.
Rooney should be benched for Englands benefit. I wouldn't take him at all if it was my decision, but he will go.
God..spot on! Why the continual obsession playing playrrs that flop at tournos I just dont know.
Another point, why the fk do England take injured players? Drives me mental.
You want to win or do well in tournos? Play players that perform in them, dont rely on those that CONTINUALLY underperform; its not rocket science is it!
-----------------------------
Again, Gerrard was part of teams that massively underperformed. Using your criteria, he shouldn't go. Johnson was poor in 2010, and again in 2012. He shouldn't go. Milner has never performed. Its wrong though. They will go because they are our best options (maybe not Milner) for their positions. Ditto Rooney. You can't leave out a guy who has 38 international goals. He's still the biggest goal threat for England.
Stop quoting 38 international goals, its tournament goals that count.
Rooney IS NOT the best to go either, welbeck performs better than him for England. On milner, I agree he shouldn't start either! Johnson, if there is better for engalnd then play em; I keep saying its not a lfc point, its a play players who perform for England point!
England flop at tournos because they play players who flop at tournos. Leave out rooney, milner, lampard and maybe johnson and cole and you just might get somewhere.....now theres a thought!
Muller won the golden boot at 19/20 years of age in 2010. Bring all the young players.
johnson was our second best player at euro 2012
comment by Got_Better (U6241)
posted 1 hour, 44 minutes ago
Barf....ur way off mate. Gerrard has played well for england, has assists and goals and you can see the effort.
I said before its NOT a man u vs lfc point, its a point based on performance and goals. Rooney quite simply as England's striker has a shocking goals return at tournos and also his play is poor. Gerrard play is better and he offers more in an England shirt, to think otherwise is blinkered.....go look at the videos if you like and the stats.
==
Well GB I looked at the stats and rooney has more goals....what more can I say, only four players have more England goals....So he is the current England leading goal scorer (still playing)
Lampard has more goals than Gerrard....club and country . But dont let facts cloud your judgement eh!
comment by Got_Better (U6241)
posted 1 hour, 5 minutes ago
Stop quoting 38 international goals, its tournament goals that count.
Rooney IS NOT the best to go either, welbeck performs better than him for England. On milner, I agree he shouldn't start either! Johnson, if there is better for engalnd then play em; I keep saying its not a lfc point, its a play players who perform for England point!
England flop at tournos because they play players who flop at tournos. Leave out rooney, milner, lampard and maybe johnson and cole and you just might get somewhere.....now theres a thought!
===
If we are leaving out players who flop at tournaments then they all have to go. Gerrard has won nothing with England....same with Rooney, Lampard.....the list goes on. You leave a group of players out for being flops.....why do other tournament flops still get another go
-------------------Hart
Johnson--Cahill--Jags--Baines
--------Gerrard-----Hendo
Sterling-----Rooney----Lallana
---------------Sturridge
Rest of squad
Foster
Forster
Walker
Smalling
Jones
Shaw
Carrick
Wilshere
Ox
Rodriguez
Barkley
Wellbeck
the reasoning behind some selections
Hendo starting over the other options - for the game against Italy especially we are going to need energy, as gerrard is the captain and undroppable, its going to be up to the guy beside him and rooney to do the legwork against italys midfield, depending on what result hodge wants against uruguay wilshere could be brought in for him and id expect wilsh/ox/barkley to be going against costa rica
forster over ruddy, just rate forster a little bit more
shaw over cole - show is our long term future left back, id bring him in, mostly for the experience of staying around a squad for a couple of weeks
ive also got rodriguez in as he is experienced as an option playing from the left and gettting goals from that position, but can also be the 4th striking option
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
--------------------------Hart---------------------
Johnson-----Jagielka-------Cahill------Shaw
----------Henderson----------Gerrard--------
Ox--------------Rooney--------- Sterling
-------------------Sturridge----------------
I'd go with that.
comment by Greatteamswinit4times (U6008)
posted 11 minutes ago
You need more than Henderson can offer in the middle at an international tournament. There will be games where he is needed, but I wouldn't start him ahead of Wilshire, who, whilst struggling a bit at the moment, has far more in his locker than Henderson.
==============
I disagree. Having something in your locker is all good but if its not coming out it means nothing. The team should be picked on form IMO not on the fact that so and so is potentially better than so and so. I think Henderson offers more energy, closing down and the fitness and willingness to be everywhere on the pitch so I'd pick him over Wilshire. I also feel Hendersinho has a far better mentality and approach to the game at this moment in time. Bottomline IMO is that at the mo Hendo is better than Wishire. This might change in the future though.
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Best England Lineup For World Cup
Page 4 of 5
posted on 9/3/14
Gerrard?? You thi k hes played poorly vor England? Wasnt he englands best player in 2012 tourno? I think he's got more goals in the last 3 tournos than rooney btw!
posted on 9/3/14
I'm a supporter of Rooney for England but he hasn't really 'proven' himself
a purple patch of 2 games a decade ago isn't really proof of anything.
posted on 9/3/14
Gerrard was England's best player at the last Euro's and is one of the most consistent and best performers...
posted on 9/3/14
I would argue that welbeck offers more than Rooney for England.
posted on 9/3/14
comment by Got_Better (U6241)
posted 21 seconds ago
Gerrard?? You thi k hes played poorly vor England? Wasnt he englands best player in 2012 tourno? I think he's got more goals in the last 3 tournos than rooney btw!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Hasn't been great.
He had 3 'assists' at the last tournament. 2 really good deliveries for Lescott and then Carroll and then the GK fumbling the ball to Rooney. Overall, he was ok, but never imposed himself, but then he never really does for England. When a really big performance is needed, he doesn't deliver. Not only him. But when we've been beaten in tournaments, when has it been a defeat despite the best efforts of Gerrard? Same with most players. We get beat and its a damp squib of an effort from the players.
If you discount Rooney for not performing, then you should for Gerrard.
posted on 9/3/14
comment by Barf Vader (U15867)
posted 18 minutes ago
Surely if people are arguing against Rooney being included due to not having good previous tournaments, then is it fair to ask for everyone else with previous tournament experience to not be included?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
and when Rooney isn't scoring, what is he doing for the team? Yep, NOTHING! If he was contributing towards the team, fine. Sadly he does nothing for England at tournaments, goals or great contribution. There are other players who should be given the chance ahead of him.
posted on 9/3/14
Why are you even having this discussion anyways? Hodge will NOT drop Rooney no matter what, so pointless discussing it
posted on 9/3/14
Barf....ur way off mate. Gerrard has played well for england, has assists and goals and you can see the effort.
I said before its NOT a man u vs lfc point, its a point based on performance and goals. Rooney quite simply as England's striker has a shocking goals return at tournos and also his play is poor. Gerrard play is better and he offers more in an England shirt, to think otherwise is blinkered.....go look at the videos if you like and the stats.
posted on 9/3/14
"and when Rooney isn't scoring, what is he doing for the team? Yep, NOTHING!"
actually that's why I think he needs to be in the side, even if he's not scoring he's busting a gut all over the ptich, closing down, helping out in defence and picking out teammates with solid passes.
playing the support role and doing all those other bits probably doesn't help his scoring record
posted on 9/3/14
GB
Rooney quite simply as England's striker has a shocking goals return at tournos
-------------------------------------------
Off the top of my head he has 5 in 14(13 starts), which is not great, not entirely rubbish.
Of those 14, 4 of them (Euro 04) were when he was fully fit. All the rest were when he probably shouldn't have gone due not not being fit.
posted on 9/3/14
Hart
Johnson Cahill Jagielka Baines
Gerrard Wilshere
Sterling Rooney Lallana
Sturridge
Forster
Walker Smalling Jones Shaw
Henderson Carrick
Chamberlain Barkley Johnson
Lambert
posted on 9/3/14
Barf,....as I said then, shocking!
You know what, I wouldnt mind but effort wise he is poor as well. People dont consider that its the continual selection of players that flop at tournos that contributes to the pz poor England tournos record.
You want to win or do well in tournos? Play players that perform in them, dont rely on those that CONTINUALLY underperform; its not rocket science is it!
posted on 9/3/14
I think Rooney should play behind Studge with Lallana and Sterling on the wings. Gerrard beside Henderson or Milner and Shaw at left back. The rest picks itself.
posted on 9/3/14
comment by TheKaisersTrainers Love FSG (U5676)
posted 12 minutes ago
"and when Rooney isn't scoring, what is he doing for the team? Yep, NOTHING!"
actually that's why I think he needs to be in the side, even if he's not scoring he's busting a gut all over the ptich, closing down, helping out in defence and picking out teammates with solid passes.
playing the support role and doing all those other bits probably doesn't help his scoring record
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No he isn't. He is greedy and selfish. I have lost count of the number of times he gives the ball away, gets tackled because he hasn't passed when he should have, or shoots when it is easier to pass to a player in a better position. He is not international tournament material. Barnes was the same. Absolutely amazing for us, but for England he was largely pointless. Some players have it when it comes to the international stage, some don't. Macca was one of those also. Welbeck for instance is the opposite, not that great a player, but seems to do well for England.
Rooney should be benched for Englands benefit. I wouldn't take him at all if it was my decision, but he will go.
posted on 9/3/14
God..spot on! Why the continual obsession playing playrrs that flop at tournos I just dont know.
Another point, why the fk do England take injured players? Drives me mental.
posted on 9/3/14
You want to win or do well in tournos? Play players that perform in them, dont rely on those that CONTINUALLY underperform; its not rocket science is it!
-----------------------------
Again, Gerrard was part of teams that massively underperformed. Using your criteria, he shouldn't go. Johnson was poor in 2010, and again in 2012. He shouldn't go. Milner has never performed. Its wrong though. They will go because they are our best options (maybe not Milner) for their positions. Ditto Rooney. You can't leave out a guy who has 38 international goals. He's still the biggest goal threat for England.
posted on 9/3/14
Stop quoting 38 international goals, its tournament goals that count.
Rooney IS NOT the best to go either, welbeck performs better than him for England. On milner, I agree he shouldn't start either! Johnson, if there is better for engalnd then play em; I keep saying its not a lfc point, its a play players who perform for England point!
England flop at tournos because they play players who flop at tournos. Leave out rooney, milner, lampard and maybe johnson and cole and you just might get somewhere.....now theres a thought!
posted on 10/3/14
Muller won the golden boot at 19/20 years of age in 2010. Bring all the young players.
posted on 10/3/14
johnson was our second best player at euro 2012
posted on 10/3/14
comment by Got_Better (U6241)
posted 1 hour, 44 minutes ago
Barf....ur way off mate. Gerrard has played well for england, has assists and goals and you can see the effort.
I said before its NOT a man u vs lfc point, its a point based on performance and goals. Rooney quite simply as England's striker has a shocking goals return at tournos and also his play is poor. Gerrard play is better and he offers more in an England shirt, to think otherwise is blinkered.....go look at the videos if you like and the stats.
==
Well GB I looked at the stats and rooney has more goals....what more can I say, only four players have more England goals....So he is the current England leading goal scorer (still playing)
Lampard has more goals than Gerrard....club and country . But dont let facts cloud your judgement eh!
posted on 10/3/14
comment by Got_Better (U6241)
posted 1 hour, 5 minutes ago
Stop quoting 38 international goals, its tournament goals that count.
Rooney IS NOT the best to go either, welbeck performs better than him for England. On milner, I agree he shouldn't start either! Johnson, if there is better for engalnd then play em; I keep saying its not a lfc point, its a play players who perform for England point!
England flop at tournos because they play players who flop at tournos. Leave out rooney, milner, lampard and maybe johnson and cole and you just might get somewhere.....now theres a thought!
===
If we are leaving out players who flop at tournaments then they all have to go. Gerrard has won nothing with England....same with Rooney, Lampard.....the list goes on. You leave a group of players out for being flops.....why do other tournament flops still get another go
posted on 10/3/14
-------------------Hart
Johnson--Cahill--Jags--Baines
--------Gerrard-----Hendo
Sterling-----Rooney----Lallana
---------------Sturridge
Rest of squad
Foster
Forster
Walker
Smalling
Jones
Shaw
Carrick
Wilshere
Ox
Rodriguez
Barkley
Wellbeck
the reasoning behind some selections
Hendo starting over the other options - for the game against Italy especially we are going to need energy, as gerrard is the captain and undroppable, its going to be up to the guy beside him and rooney to do the legwork against italys midfield, depending on what result hodge wants against uruguay wilshere could be brought in for him and id expect wilsh/ox/barkley to be going against costa rica
forster over ruddy, just rate forster a little bit more
shaw over cole - show is our long term future left back, id bring him in, mostly for the experience of staying around a squad for a couple of weeks
ive also got rodriguez in as he is experienced as an option playing from the left and gettting goals from that position, but can also be the 4th striking option
posted on 10/3/14
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 10/3/14
--------------------------Hart---------------------
Johnson-----Jagielka-------Cahill------Shaw
----------Henderson----------Gerrard--------
Ox--------------Rooney--------- Sterling
-------------------Sturridge----------------
I'd go with that.
posted on 10/3/14
comment by Greatteamswinit4times (U6008)
posted 11 minutes ago
You need more than Henderson can offer in the middle at an international tournament. There will be games where he is needed, but I wouldn't start him ahead of Wilshire, who, whilst struggling a bit at the moment, has far more in his locker than Henderson.
==============
I disagree. Having something in your locker is all good but if its not coming out it means nothing. The team should be picked on form IMO not on the fact that so and so is potentially better than so and so. I think Henderson offers more energy, closing down and the fitness and willingness to be everywhere on the pitch so I'd pick him over Wilshire. I also feel Hendersinho has a far better mentality and approach to the game at this moment in time. Bottomline IMO is that at the mo Hendo is better than Wishire. This might change in the future though.
Page 4 of 5