The bombing of Dresden was pure terrorism. Germany were already overstretched on all fronts and losing. Did they really have to roast tens of thousand of civilians to death?

And as for aggressive occupier.

We still ignoring the fact that israel and Palestine could have co-existed and did co-exist until they decided to start blowing up buses and markets.

As Cal says, 1.5 million Muslims live in Israel without problem, the borders were open, Palestine fúcked it up.

comment by Sheriff John Brown - bring back David Dein (U7482)
posted 26 seconds ago
The bombing of Dresden was pure terrorism. Germany were already overstretched on all fronts and losing. Did they really have to roast tens of thousand of civilians to death?
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And not forgetting the biggest act of terrorism ever: Hiroshima and Nagasaki. It's amazing how the world has moved on from it as if nothing happened. Yet, every anniversary of 9/11 gets media saturation.

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Its funny how almost all these problems trace back to the creation and the mass immigration to set up Israel...

Its almost as if it was the cause of all the problems but personally I think the Israeli supporters have got the right idea and it is all one massive coincidence!

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"And not forgetting the biggest act of terrorism ever: Hiroshima and Nagasaki."

my understanding is dropping one was a tactical and significant life saver. Japan was dug in and it would have been island by island trench warfare killing more people by orders of magnitude than the result of forcing surrender with nuke(s)

dropping 2 is the debatable situation. was it actually necessary to end the war.

then there is the statement of intent to Russia. would one have been enough to start a cold war rather than a proper war to claim what was left of Europe. Significant saved lives (definitely with one, 2 debatable) again.

who knows, you can't try both and see.

comment by SAF_The_Legend-FreePalestine (U5768)
posted 47 seconds ago
Its funny how almost all these problems trace back to the creation and the mass immigration to set up Israel...

Its almost as if it was the cause of all the problems but personally I think the Israeli supporters have got the right idea and it is all one massive coincidence!
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And you still bang this drum.

As before, people fully understand this wasn't the best idea and triggered the situation.

But the problem here is how to end it and save lives, not make excuses for why those lives are lost.

Palestine will never win this war, it needs to quit with the terrorism and rocket attacks, Israel will stop its latest clean up operation and we can discuss moving forward.

I think a lot of people forgot Jews have always existed in the Middle East. They may have been conquered and displaced in Arab lands but the resident Jews there found more acceptance than the hostility which they suffered in Europe for several centuries. Arab hostility REALLY emerged after mass migration of millions and the formation of the Jewish state. Think of the hysteria that minimal immigration causes in politics today and then imagine what happened with Zionist "colonization" and mass settlement in Arab land.

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"Why wasn't there war or chaos between the groups before this?!"

the area was always ruled by an Empire to keep it in check. Ottomans and British.

Prior to empires it was war and conquering and expulsion and reclamation by Jews and Arabs.

This is absurdly complicated.

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

I look forward to Kash posting on islamist terrorism and abuse of Christians and women around the world.

Of course the death of innocents is awful,but did you post when Boko Haram or Isis murder on a massive scale?

Should Israel allow hamas to fire rockets at them,kill teenage boys,bomb buses,tunnel into Israel to slaughter?

War is evil and both sides should call peace.

gaza people cheer hamas rockets,9/11 etc,just as hardline Israeli's sing sick songs...........BOTH are wrong.

I guess this would be a fair fight if the 'Iron Dome' didn't exist.

No lack of intent from Palestine in trying to kill civilians thats for sure.

You really want to know how to end it, someone posted this on another thread....

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There are only two ways to stop terrorism.

Either wipe them all out. Impossible as the more violence you apply, the more recruits they gain to their cause.

Or take away their reasons to commit terrorist acts by dialogue and negotiation.

Killing their kids brothers and sisters will only make them them more determined and unconscionable in their attacks. This slaughter is an insanity. In the long run it will make Hamas stronger. It enhances their cause. It justifies in their minds the murder of more innocent Israelis.
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Sums the situation up perfectly.

But the problem here is how to end it and save lives, not make excuses for why those lives are lost.

Palestine will never win this war, it needs to quit with the terrorism and rocket attacks, Israel will stop its latest clean up operation and we can discuss moving forward.
.......................................

If we are talking morality who started it has a purpose...

If we are talking about solving it see my post above.

the area was always ruled by an Empire to keep it in check. Ottomans and British.

Prior to empires it was war and conquering and expulsion and reclamation by Jews and Arabs.

This is absurdly complicated.
....................................................

Even when the British were there the trouble flared up. Even before the creation of Israel. Whereas prior to that and the mass immigration of Jews the people in the area lived relatively peacefully together...

Even with the British looking after the place the mass immigration of Jews looking to found their own county lead to ever increasing violence between the religious groups that was just not there to anywhere near that level for hundreds of years previously....

"Whereas prior to that and the mass immigration of Jews the people in the area lived relatively peacefully together..."

hmm

historians report otherwise

generally speaking the entire planet has been one great big continuous cycle of slavery, conquering, killing and eviction everywhere on earth for the entire history of humanity other than recently and pockets of empires and tyranny. that includes the holy land.

humans love killing and enslaving and exterminating those not the same. and when they are the 'same' we've always found a way to be different just to keep on killin' and conquerin' and oppressin'

we're good at this
it's our nature
we're fecking evil, savage and selfish. hardwired.

thank f3ck for football, it takes our mind off of it

Don't get me wrong as any minority would in a non first world western society they had some problems... but lookup Jewish persecution over the years. For a long time prior to the founding of Israel and the mass immigration that preceded it Jewish persecution happened overwhelmingly in Europe.

Despite groups of Jews living in the Arab world they never had anywhere near the problems of European Jews.

This has dramatically changed since the mass immigration and founding of Israel though...

problems in europe came from immigration as well

'different' peoples came in and were successful

the locals don't take kindly to outsiders doing well

repeating pattern

left the homeland and got persecuted as outsiders, came 'home' and got persecuted as outsiders

someone said 'let's give them a country, these people are f3cked wherever they go'

I'm not jealous.

The Jews that were ill treated had sometimes lived there for many years and even generations, like they did in the Palestine area and many other Arab areas but with far less mistreatment.

The Arab vs Jew conflict only really kicked off with the mass immigration and the founding of Israel. A lot of of what you say above is true and I agree with a fair bit of what you have said but that doesn't change the fact they lived relatively peacefully in the middle east until mass immigration and Israel's founding.

it's complicated

i normally try and ignore it

every now and again it gets pushed to the front of news and debate but I wish it would just go away

someone else's problem becomes my 'problem' once a year or so

oh well

Feel like I am badgering you at this point so feel free to tell me to f off or ignore me...

But...

It is our problem... a large part of the West vs Muslim conflict is due to the Israel-Palestine issue. It leads to events like 9/11 and 7/7. Which in turn leads to expensive wars in foreign countries where we send our kids to die...

A large part of Al Qaeda's recruiting strategy pre-Iraq war 2 (under Bush jnr) was the Israel-Palestine conflict so it very much causes problems for us.

Even if the only direct effect on you or me so far has been the financial cost of the war and the terrorism.