Mudd

I didn't realise about the Virgin thing... mental.

I think that Roberts doesn't help the situation at all though. He's not "doing anything" except asking other people to do something about it. If he had his badges and had repeatedly been turned down for jobs (i.e he has first hand experience) then you would give him more credence.

Have we heard from Chris Powell or Chris Hughton that they are struggling for jobs due to ethnicity?

comment by Earl Brutus (U1449)
posted 1 second ago
Paul Ince is probably the most high profile black British manager out there ATM

He's managed both Blackpool and Blackburn, see the pattern emerging here ?
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He's a shíte manager though...

Not to mention Hughton has managed 3 or 4 PL clubs in the last like 6 years

comment by M.U.D.D - Luke Shaw makes me throb with desire (U9612)
posted 2 minutes ago
Furthermore I find it hilarious that a lot of these people in the FA who want to discriminate in favour of "British" players are not solidly behind this "Rooney Rule."

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I don't think a mandatory interview for a black player helps though MUDD...

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

I would however like to note that in the NFL the number of minorities managing clubs increased with the introduction of the rule and one has won the superbowl.

Again I do not agree with this but if people think there isn't a problem, they are deluded.

As a proportion, how many black players go on to take their badges and aspire to manage compared to white?

Ian Wright's giggling doesn't help.

Something needs to change but I think maybe British people need to try and work overseas more to increase skills and experience....regardless of skin colour managerial appointments (in football) in this country are just a merry go round of the same half a dozen managers continuously replacing each other

I would however like to note that in the NFL the number of minorities managing clubs increased with the introduction of the rule and one has won the superbowl.

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It has, and while I'm fairly sure it would work in the Championship downwards, I just can't see that working in the PL.

NFL is a very different beast though, no? I don't follow it but I understand that this "draft" thing they do basically means all of the teams get dibs on some players?

I genuinely don't think that in this day and age, managers are being passed over based on their skin colour. Especially when you consider just how many owners come from Asian countries, it just seems illogical.

I think Roberts is an attention seeker and if I was a black manager trying to get a job, I certainly would not want him to speak on my behalf.

I have always been of the opinion, get all the qualifications you need for a job, if you cannot get it, get something close or understudy, maybe take a step back and ensure you have all the requirements then go for it.

In terms of football at the highest level, there are actually very few managers who manage elite clubs so I would suggest a grass roots start for some of these guys.

The thing is a lot of people will not appreciate where these guys are coming from because you have not lived life in their shoes. The experience of an average black man in the UK is very different to an average white man.

When people understand this, they will begin to appreciate where these guys are coming from.

Some will ask, how do you know; I get the same treatment when I get a tan and I grew up in the USA and you will notice the differences.

Not just jobs, shops, bars, cafe's, the police, etc. Very, very different

Owner thinks : Can a black man manage, control, discipline, be respected by, lead a club mainly full of white men?

He's still thinking.

I don't think that is relevant to the discussion Mr New Guy

My team just hired Chris Powell as manager. It was revealed we had over 30 applicants for the job.

Colour has nothing to do with it. If the chairman/board think you're the best candidate then you get the job. It's that simple.

Jason Roberts is just like Sol. A black guy who has been given every opportunity to thrive in his chosen profession, yet still carries a chip on his shoulder. These blokes are really not good representatives of black people at all.

comment by M.U.D.D - Luke Shaw makes me throb with desire (U9612)
posted 1 minute ago
I think Roberts is an attention seeker and if I was a black manager trying to get a job, I certainly would not want him to speak on my behalf.

I have always been of the opinion, get all the qualifications you need for a job, if you cannot get it, get something close or understudy, maybe take a step back and ensure you have all the requirements then go for it.

In terms of football at the highest level, there are actually very few managers who manage elite clubs so I would suggest a grass roots start for some of these guys.

The thing is a lot of people will not appreciate where these guys are coming from because you have not lived life in their shoes. The experience of an average black man in the UK is very different to an average white man.

When people understand this, they will begin to appreciate where these guys are coming from.

Some will ask, how do you know; I get the same treatment when I get a tan and I grew up in the USA and you will notice the differences.

Not just jobs, shops, bars, cafe's, the police, etc. Very, very different
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Good post MUDD.

A part you touched upon was starting at grass roots. Do you think Mr Roberts is expecting, being an ex-player, to be handed his job without having to work for it? and perhaps perceives that this is the way it works for white people?

comment by Robben van Persie #20 (U1145)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by M.U.D.D - Luke Shaw makes me throb with desire(U9612)
posted 2 minutes ago
Furthermore I find it hilarious that a lot of these people in the FA who want to discriminate in favour of "British" players are not solidly behind this "Rooney Rule."

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I don't think a mandatory interview for a black player helps though MUDD...
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I do not think it will help at all. Just playing devil's advocate

comment by Champers - Pow! Right in the kisser (U6859)
posted 3 minutes ago
My team just hired Chris Powell as manager. It was revealed we had over 30 applicants for the job.

Colour has nothing to do with it. If the chairman/board think you're the best candidate then you get the job. It's that simple.

Jason Roberts is just like Sol. A black guy who has been given every opportunity to thrive in his chosen profession, yet still carries a chip on his shoulder. These blokes are really not good representatives of black people at all.

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Cheers Champers - I guess this gives some perspective. If a black guy wants to be a manager, do the hard work and then apply for jobs starting low and working your way up.

Just waiting for 24 hours for the SoBL to respond to any criticism Roberts receives for his comments.

There really aren't that many players who would make decent managers anymore.

Jay their statement is probably already written!

That's the thing, when you break it down and say that there are 20 teams in the PL, how many English managers are there? So therefore, what proportion of this should be black?

just because you're an ex-player doesn't mean you'd be a good manager....
Milan are finding that out with Seedorf and possibly Inzaghi

*these

Paul Ince was an awful manager at Blackpool to be fair. His tactics were overly defensive and archaic to say the least. Riga is getting better support from the fans because he at least tries to play some expansive football.

The Virgin thing is actually not an issue, the evidence seems to be based on the CV's that were submitted and there were many differences, not just a change of the name and ethnicity.

Finally what I would like to know is how many assistant coaches are from a minority? It seems to me that it isn't enough to just get the coaching badges and then think you can apply for a job like United Manager. The transition from player to manager isn't as easy as that and I doubt the subtleties of the role can be learned in a classroom. These guys need firstly to get the badges but then serve an apprenticeship, even for free if required, under a top manager. Giggs has been quite lucky in that LVG is giving him that opportunity at the club he played at but most will have to move, and possibly abroad to get that opportunity.

Not to mention, if the sport was inherently discriminatory, we would not be seeing as many black players as we do & some of them are the best young talents of our generation.

I could look at it another way - in IT at my place, there are 4 women out of about 90 people. Does that make my company sexist because the majority of the applicants are male? Or does it simply mean that less women choose to work in IT?

The issue is there aren't many black managers, full stop, not that they aren't being given jobs.

A part you touched upon was starting at grass roots. Do you think Mr Roberts is expecting, being an ex-player, to be handed his job without having to work for it? and perhaps perceives that this is the way it works for white people?
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I think Mr Roberts is an idiot personally. If you look at the top clubs in the prem, none of the managers are british.

Roberts is trying to combine a variety of issues and strikes me as someone who has a victim complex.

Managing clubs like Utd, Ars, etc is not for every Tom, Díck and Harry. You have to earn it. How do you earn it, start at the grass roots, do something with your badges and then people will talk you up for the position. Look at Martinez for example.

Without coming across as being non-pc, the only 2 black managers I can think of who have achieved anything in international football (world cup, not age group tournaments) and at club level are Riijkaard and Tigana. No one else.

I believe there is a problem and it is not unique to football, however before we can make an accurate assessment, you need to do your own bit and make sure you have the requirements. When you do and you do not get a look in, then we can begin to address the problem properly.

It has worked very well in the Oil and Gas industry, lots of success stories to tell. Can work anywhere, fix the root of the problem (qualifications, mentoring, internships, development, etc) then the trust and opportunities will come.