HK Reine-Adelaide
But that doesn't mean he has told LVG he doesn't want to. Usually if a player refuses to play they are fined, why has there been any mention of this?
With t he exception of Ronaldo, all were sold when the club decided. Tevez we never owned.
=================
Yeah! Cos you didn't want to lose them at a loss or they were unsettled!
comment by Robbing_Hoody - Part of FSG's black flag operation (U6374)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 1 minute ago
You don't think that money men at United are intelligent enough to factor in the potential ramifications of selling De Gea and the team failing to make the top 4? Or the knockout stages of the CL?
=====================
What are the ramifications of losing him for nothing and not hitting those targets?
-------------------------------------
About £20m more than losing him and not hitting those targets. The more important question is how much the chances of missing those targets increase through selling him without an adequate replacement.
Yeah and see Beckham, Ronaldo, RvN, Veron, Tevez and ADM
---------------------------------------------------
Ruud was clearly past his best when he left for Real Madrid. He was axed and went to a team that at the time wasn't as strong as us.
Ronaldo - yes, he had his heart set on RM and there was nothing we could do, except demand a world record fee for him.
Beckham - the relationship with Fergie had broken down and I think it suited both sides for him to leave.
Veron - sold because it didn't work out for him on the field.
Tevez - got the hump because he was behind Rooney and Berbatov in the team.
ADM - flopped and didn't settle.
I think only one of those truly comes across as a 'more powerful club swoops on helpless United' scenario.
>>tells the marketplace
how can a club talk to the "marketplace"? its not a generic thing, every players situation is different. Fans seem obsessed that we need to posture to show "we're a big club" but there are other factors. When we sign "latin" players, if a big spanish club comes knocking its not just the club but the lifestyle and climate too. We simply cannot offer that, so trying to show "muscle" in the market place is an irrelevant argument.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 32 seconds ago
HK Reine-Adelaide
But that doesn't mean he has told LVG he doesn't want to. Usually if a player refuses to play they are fined, why has there been any mention of this?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
but he wasn't selected and he is fit for selection. So Van Gaal doesn't trust him
we are liverpool fc
You can 'not be in the right frame of mind' and also want to play. The manager makes the final call and he feels it's best he doesn't, but none of us know for sure whether de Gea has specifically said he does not want to play.
comment by The Number 4 Shirt - I don't actually want Pedro =/ (U19487)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by we are liverpool fc (U13373)
posted 11 seconds ago
comment by The Number 4 Shirt - I don't actually want Pedro =/ (U19487)
posted 2 minutes ago
We are,
How do you feel about the points I've made? Especially regarding the decision the board will take vis-à-vis selling De Gea for an amount which is paltry compared to our annual turnover and projected income for 2015?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
yes very informative number 4
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No, I genuinely want your opinion. Like you say you had the Sterling situation. I'm honestly curious.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
ill get to you soon number4,other mancs what my POV first , please
HK Reine-Adelaide
Yes and LVG has the right to make such a call which he feels is best. But that in no way confirms that de Gea doesn't want to play which he and his representatives and disputing LVG's claims.
Is this really hard for your brain to understand?
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 15 seconds ago
we are liverpool fc
You can 'not be in the right frame of mind' and also want to play. The manager makes the final call and he feels it's best he doesn't, but none of us know for sure whether de Gea has specifically said he does not want to play.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
yeh i see your point 1982,hes doesnt seem the type to rock the boat tbh
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 1 minute ago
HK Reine-Adelaide
Yes and LVG has the right to make such a call which he feels is best. But that in no way confirms that de Gea doesn't want to play which he and his representatives and disputing LVG's claims.
Is this really hard for your brain to understand?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I said it's a risk keeping him because how do you know he will be ready to play in the future?.
comment by we are liverpool fc (U13373)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by The Number 4 Shirt - I don't actually want Pedro =/ (U19487)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by we are liverpool fc (U13373)
posted 11 seconds ago
comment by The Number 4 Shirt - I don't actually want Pedro =/ (U19487)
posted 2 minutes ago
We are,
How do you feel about the points I've made? Especially regarding the decision the board will take vis-à-vis selling De Gea for an amount which is paltry compared to our annual turnover and projected income for 2015?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
yes very informative number 4
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No, I genuinely want your opinion. Like you say you had the Sterling situation. I'm honestly curious.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
ill get to you soon number4,other mancs what my POV first , please
-------------r---------------------------------------------------------
right number 4 what was the question son
comment by Robbing_Hoody - Part of FSG's black flag operation (U6374)
posted 2 minutes ago
We buy players to play for us at their best, and when they leave more often than not is it because there best has now past. See van Persie ect.
==================
Yeah and see Beckham, Ronaldo, RvN, Veron, Tevez and ADM.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Beckham - 2003
Ronaldo - 2009
van Nistelrooy - 2006
Tevez- 2009 - Never ours to sell, was a loan player.
Veron - 2005 - Poor for us, and was poor afterwards sadly. 50% of initial fee received.
Di Maria - 2015- Poor for us and didn't like England. 75% of initial fee received.
Some very big gaps, only 4 legitimate world class players at the time, only 3 were ours and only Ronaldo and Beckham were under 30 when they were sold.
Sorry but I don't believe you're correct at all Robbing.
comment by United we win (U19958)
posted 3 minutes ago
Fact of the matter is, if we lose De Gea, no chance will we get top 4. Romero is a rubbish keeper and should not even be 2nd choice.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Source?
comment by Robbing_Hoody - Part of FSG's black flag operation (U6374)
posted 31 seconds ago
With t he exception of Ronaldo, all were sold when the club decided. Tevez we never owned.
=================
Yeah! Cos you didn't want to lose them at a loss or they were unsettled!
--------------------------
You are making stuff up now. RVN had been replaced in the team by Saha. SAF decided he didn't need him anymore and the team's style of play was moving in a different direction. He was probably just past his best too. Becks he decided was more hassle than he was worth. Veron hadn't worked out and was surplus to requirements. Think we lost 12m on him?
comment by United we win (U19958)
posted 3 minutes ago
Fact of the matter is, if we lose De Gea, no chance will we get top 4. Romero is a rubbish keeper and should not even be 2nd choice.
............
Yet saved more shots in a league match then de gea managed in 2015 on his league debut and has a much higher save percentage then De Gea in last year as well as reaching world cup final keeping clean sheets.
we are liverpool fc
I just find it odd that a player supposedly told his manager he doesn't want to play and he hasn't been fined.
If I refused to work I wouldn't expect to get paid.
If we do lose DDG and stick with Romero, Lindegaard and Johnstone then I'd put Liverpool ahead of us as favs to get top 4. It's already tight as they have had a good window so far.
Us losing our best player won't help our cause one bit.
Read the thread...
1 place higher in the PL, 1 round further in the CL... £15/20m straight away.
*****
But we can't predict the future. You could accept the offer from Real and still achieve your targets which would be better than keeping him and still achieving said targets. Or you could accept it and fail but there would still be no way to determine whether the failure is down to selling De Gea because you could also keep him and still fail. It's all ifs and buts and in most cases (not all) it doesn't end well that's why clubs prefer to sell the player under such circumstances.
comment by we are liverpool fc (U13373)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by The Number 4 Shirt - I don't actually want Pedro =/ (U19487)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by we are liverpool fc (U13373)
posted 11 seconds ago
comment by The Number 4 Shirt - I don't actually want Pedro =/ (U19487)
posted 2 minutes ago
We are,
How do you feel about the points I've made? Especially regarding the decision the board will take vis-à-vis selling De Gea for an amount which is paltry compared to our annual turnover and projected income for 2015?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
yes very informative number 4
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No, I genuinely want your opinion. Like you say you had the Sterling situation. I'm honestly curious.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
ill get to you soon number4,other mancs what my POV first , please
----------------------------------------------------------------------
To be fair, if you can't identify when you get the chance to give your opinion in a legitimate conversation, it shows everyone what your real intentions are.
Bad luck friend.
Bottom line is everyone on here can clearly now see why selling De Gea for less than your value is the wrong move. It's clear as day.
I should say as much as de gea managed not more. Valdes did save more though in his first full game.
comment by Royalsmokin999uk (U5762)
posted 44 seconds ago
>>tells the marketplace
how can a club talk to the "marketplace"? its not a generic thing, every players situation is different. Fans seem obsessed that we need to posture to show "we're a big club" but there are other factors. When we sign "latin" players, if a big spanish club comes knocking its not just the club but the lifestyle and climate too. We simply cannot offer that, so trying to show "muscle" in the market place is an irrelevant argument.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Of course the marketplace as a whole is made up of myriad transactions that are all unique in certain ways. However, that's not to say that from the mass of transactions certain generalised perceptions cannot be formed. We need to bear in mind that the football industry is actually a matrix of different markets, not just the transfer market. Another is the sponsorship market. If United are generally perceived to be weaker than the most potent players and powerless to prevent the loss of their best talent, that affects the brand, affects the marketability of United as a 'media product' (which is how the Glazers now pitch us to investors). This can lead to an erosion of our ability to monetise the brand. Meanwhile, the same perception of relative weakness has an impact on footballers' perceptions of our club. Other players we want to keep; players we want to compete with the best clubs to sign. Does a footballer with the world at his feet want to go to the club that bends over or the club that stands behind with a grin on his face? I don't think these factors can be dismissed as fans' bravado. I think they are real factors with real (though hard to measure) financial impacts.
People re-writing history.
RvN hit 64 goals in less than 100 games for Madrid winning two la liga titles in three years.
If you think Utd came well out of all those transfers then great but I don't. Losing world class players at a loss is bad in my opinion but maybe I'm old fashioned.
Sign in if you want to comment
Sell De Gea
Page 5 of 7
6 | 7
posted on 14/8/15
HK Reine-Adelaide
But that doesn't mean he has told LVG he doesn't want to. Usually if a player refuses to play they are fined, why has there been any mention of this?
posted on 14/8/15
With t he exception of Ronaldo, all were sold when the club decided. Tevez we never owned.
=================
Yeah! Cos you didn't want to lose them at a loss or they were unsettled!
posted on 14/8/15
comment by Robbing_Hoody - Part of FSG's black flag operation (U6374)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 1 minute ago
You don't think that money men at United are intelligent enough to factor in the potential ramifications of selling De Gea and the team failing to make the top 4? Or the knockout stages of the CL?
=====================
What are the ramifications of losing him for nothing and not hitting those targets?
-------------------------------------
About £20m more than losing him and not hitting those targets. The more important question is how much the chances of missing those targets increase through selling him without an adequate replacement.
posted on 14/8/15
Yeah and see Beckham, Ronaldo, RvN, Veron, Tevez and ADM
---------------------------------------------------
Ruud was clearly past his best when he left for Real Madrid. He was axed and went to a team that at the time wasn't as strong as us.
Ronaldo - yes, he had his heart set on RM and there was nothing we could do, except demand a world record fee for him.
Beckham - the relationship with Fergie had broken down and I think it suited both sides for him to leave.
Veron - sold because it didn't work out for him on the field.
Tevez - got the hump because he was behind Rooney and Berbatov in the team.
ADM - flopped and didn't settle.
I think only one of those truly comes across as a 'more powerful club swoops on helpless United' scenario.
posted on 14/8/15
>>tells the marketplace
how can a club talk to the "marketplace"? its not a generic thing, every players situation is different. Fans seem obsessed that we need to posture to show "we're a big club" but there are other factors. When we sign "latin" players, if a big spanish club comes knocking its not just the club but the lifestyle and climate too. We simply cannot offer that, so trying to show "muscle" in the market place is an irrelevant argument.
posted on 14/8/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 14/8/15
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 32 seconds ago
HK Reine-Adelaide
But that doesn't mean he has told LVG he doesn't want to. Usually if a player refuses to play they are fined, why has there been any mention of this?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
but he wasn't selected and he is fit for selection. So Van Gaal doesn't trust him
posted on 14/8/15
we are liverpool fc
You can 'not be in the right frame of mind' and also want to play. The manager makes the final call and he feels it's best he doesn't, but none of us know for sure whether de Gea has specifically said he does not want to play.
posted on 14/8/15
comment by The Number 4 Shirt - I don't actually want Pedro =/ (U19487)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by we are liverpool fc (U13373)
posted 11 seconds ago
comment by The Number 4 Shirt - I don't actually want Pedro =/ (U19487)
posted 2 minutes ago
We are,
How do you feel about the points I've made? Especially regarding the decision the board will take vis-à-vis selling De Gea for an amount which is paltry compared to our annual turnover and projected income for 2015?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
yes very informative number 4
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No, I genuinely want your opinion. Like you say you had the Sterling situation. I'm honestly curious.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
ill get to you soon number4,other mancs what my POV first , please
posted on 14/8/15
HK Reine-Adelaide
Yes and LVG has the right to make such a call which he feels is best. But that in no way confirms that de Gea doesn't want to play which he and his representatives and disputing LVG's claims.
Is this really hard for your brain to understand?
posted on 14/8/15
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 15 seconds ago
we are liverpool fc
You can 'not be in the right frame of mind' and also want to play. The manager makes the final call and he feels it's best he doesn't, but none of us know for sure whether de Gea has specifically said he does not want to play.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
yeh i see your point 1982,hes doesnt seem the type to rock the boat tbh
posted on 14/8/15
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 1 minute ago
HK Reine-Adelaide
Yes and LVG has the right to make such a call which he feels is best. But that in no way confirms that de Gea doesn't want to play which he and his representatives and disputing LVG's claims.
Is this really hard for your brain to understand?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I said it's a risk keeping him because how do you know he will be ready to play in the future?.
posted on 14/8/15
comment by we are liverpool fc (U13373)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by The Number 4 Shirt - I don't actually want Pedro =/ (U19487)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by we are liverpool fc (U13373)
posted 11 seconds ago
comment by The Number 4 Shirt - I don't actually want Pedro =/ (U19487)
posted 2 minutes ago
We are,
How do you feel about the points I've made? Especially regarding the decision the board will take vis-à-vis selling De Gea for an amount which is paltry compared to our annual turnover and projected income for 2015?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
yes very informative number 4
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No, I genuinely want your opinion. Like you say you had the Sterling situation. I'm honestly curious.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
ill get to you soon number4,other mancs what my POV first , please
-------------r---------------------------------------------------------
right number 4 what was the question son
posted on 14/8/15
comment by Robbing_Hoody - Part of FSG's black flag operation (U6374)
posted 2 minutes ago
We buy players to play for us at their best, and when they leave more often than not is it because there best has now past. See van Persie ect.
==================
Yeah and see Beckham, Ronaldo, RvN, Veron, Tevez and ADM.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Beckham - 2003
Ronaldo - 2009
van Nistelrooy - 2006
Tevez- 2009 - Never ours to sell, was a loan player.
Veron - 2005 - Poor for us, and was poor afterwards sadly. 50% of initial fee received.
Di Maria - 2015- Poor for us and didn't like England. 75% of initial fee received.
Some very big gaps, only 4 legitimate world class players at the time, only 3 were ours and only Ronaldo and Beckham were under 30 when they were sold.
Sorry but I don't believe you're correct at all Robbing.
posted on 14/8/15
comment by United we win (U19958)
posted 3 minutes ago
Fact of the matter is, if we lose De Gea, no chance will we get top 4. Romero is a rubbish keeper and should not even be 2nd choice.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Source?
posted on 14/8/15
comment by Robbing_Hoody - Part of FSG's black flag operation (U6374)
posted 31 seconds ago
With t he exception of Ronaldo, all were sold when the club decided. Tevez we never owned.
=================
Yeah! Cos you didn't want to lose them at a loss or they were unsettled!
--------------------------
You are making stuff up now. RVN had been replaced in the team by Saha. SAF decided he didn't need him anymore and the team's style of play was moving in a different direction. He was probably just past his best too. Becks he decided was more hassle than he was worth. Veron hadn't worked out and was surplus to requirements. Think we lost 12m on him?
posted on 14/8/15
comment by United we win (U19958)
posted 3 minutes ago
Fact of the matter is, if we lose De Gea, no chance will we get top 4. Romero is a rubbish keeper and should not even be 2nd choice.
............
Yet saved more shots in a league match then de gea managed in 2015 on his league debut and has a much higher save percentage then De Gea in last year as well as reaching world cup final keeping clean sheets.
posted on 14/8/15
we are liverpool fc
I just find it odd that a player supposedly told his manager he doesn't want to play and he hasn't been fined.
posted on 14/8/15
If I refused to work I wouldn't expect to get paid.
posted on 14/8/15
If we do lose DDG and stick with Romero, Lindegaard and Johnstone then I'd put Liverpool ahead of us as favs to get top 4. It's already tight as they have had a good window so far.
Us losing our best player won't help our cause one bit.
posted on 14/8/15
Read the thread...
1 place higher in the PL, 1 round further in the CL... £15/20m straight away.
*****
But we can't predict the future. You could accept the offer from Real and still achieve your targets which would be better than keeping him and still achieving said targets. Or you could accept it and fail but there would still be no way to determine whether the failure is down to selling De Gea because you could also keep him and still fail. It's all ifs and buts and in most cases (not all) it doesn't end well that's why clubs prefer to sell the player under such circumstances.
posted on 14/8/15
comment by we are liverpool fc (U13373)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by The Number 4 Shirt - I don't actually want Pedro =/ (U19487)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by we are liverpool fc (U13373)
posted 11 seconds ago
comment by The Number 4 Shirt - I don't actually want Pedro =/ (U19487)
posted 2 minutes ago
We are,
How do you feel about the points I've made? Especially regarding the decision the board will take vis-à-vis selling De Gea for an amount which is paltry compared to our annual turnover and projected income for 2015?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
yes very informative number 4
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No, I genuinely want your opinion. Like you say you had the Sterling situation. I'm honestly curious.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
ill get to you soon number4,other mancs what my POV first , please
----------------------------------------------------------------------
To be fair, if you can't identify when you get the chance to give your opinion in a legitimate conversation, it shows everyone what your real intentions are.
Bad luck friend.
Bottom line is everyone on here can clearly now see why selling De Gea for less than your value is the wrong move. It's clear as day.
posted on 14/8/15
I should say as much as de gea managed not more. Valdes did save more though in his first full game.
posted on 14/8/15
comment by Royalsmokin999uk (U5762)
posted 44 seconds ago
>>tells the marketplace
how can a club talk to the "marketplace"? its not a generic thing, every players situation is different. Fans seem obsessed that we need to posture to show "we're a big club" but there are other factors. When we sign "latin" players, if a big spanish club comes knocking its not just the club but the lifestyle and climate too. We simply cannot offer that, so trying to show "muscle" in the market place is an irrelevant argument.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Of course the marketplace as a whole is made up of myriad transactions that are all unique in certain ways. However, that's not to say that from the mass of transactions certain generalised perceptions cannot be formed. We need to bear in mind that the football industry is actually a matrix of different markets, not just the transfer market. Another is the sponsorship market. If United are generally perceived to be weaker than the most potent players and powerless to prevent the loss of their best talent, that affects the brand, affects the marketability of United as a 'media product' (which is how the Glazers now pitch us to investors). This can lead to an erosion of our ability to monetise the brand. Meanwhile, the same perception of relative weakness has an impact on footballers' perceptions of our club. Other players we want to keep; players we want to compete with the best clubs to sign. Does a footballer with the world at his feet want to go to the club that bends over or the club that stands behind with a grin on his face? I don't think these factors can be dismissed as fans' bravado. I think they are real factors with real (though hard to measure) financial impacts.
posted on 14/8/15
People re-writing history.
RvN hit 64 goals in less than 100 games for Madrid winning two la liga titles in three years.
If you think Utd came well out of all those transfers then great but I don't. Losing world class players at a loss is bad in my opinion but maybe I'm old fashioned.
Page 5 of 7
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