Playing is about subjective ability. You can't do a QCF in playing football.
_________________________
And managing is about subjective ability.
No it's not.
It's about being qualified and being given the opportunity to at least talk about your ideas in an interview let alone actually display them within a role.
It is a statistical fact that the proportion of qualified BAME staff is not represented in paid roles.
Why?
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
Hopefully there will also be a rule which come into being whereby PL clubs (and football league clubs as well) have to interview at least 1 English manager when the job is up for grabs.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
the simple facts are that the percentage of professional footballers in this country being of black or asian origin has been increasing constantly over the past few decades, and in all likelihood will continue to increase.
concomitant with that is that the number of retiring players of black or asian origin who decide to get their coaching badges will also continue to increase.
as these coaches prove themselves, the percentage of black or asian coaches/managers of professional football in this country will trend towards equality with the percentages of ethnicity making up the country as a whole.
all that is needed is time.
to attempt to force clubs to give jobs to people based purely on the colour of their skin is positive discrimination. that IS still DISCRIMINATION, and there is absolutely nothing positive about that, despite the common nomenclature. generally it involves someone better able or qualified losing out so that an artificial quota/target can be met.
the jobs should go to the best qualified applicant, regardless of gender, colour or creed.
and at the end of the day, we can't force a black or asian player to get their coaching badges, or apply for a manager's job, just like we can't force a white player, or a female player.
until the percentage of black or asian ex-players CHOOSING to get their coaching qualifications increases then they're going to be under-represented in management, that has nothing to do with racism, it's simply a numbers game.
until the percentage of black or asian ex-players CHOOSING to get their coaching qualifications increases then they're going to be under-represented in management, that has nothing to do with racism
======================================================
Why would a higher proportion of black or asian ex-players CHOOSE not to get their coaching qualifications?
Can you think of a reason?
the jobs should go to the best qualified applicant, regardless of gender, colour or creed.
------------------------------
No one is suggesting otherwise.
This is a common comment when this topic comes up and is usually irrelevant. The article linked and the discussion have not been about giving the job to anyone other than the best qualified.
Yeah, those responses always miss the point spectacularly!
"Why would a higher proportion of black or asian ex-players CHOOSE not to get their coaching qualifications?"
Absolutely pertinent question there!
I see Chris Powell and Chris Ramsey aren't doing much for black coaches or managers.
Its ok though as 2 black coaches will have to be interviewed for their post in the future.
You are a huge idiot and I am being kind here
With the high wages now paid why would intelligent and wealthy footballers want to go back into/remain in football once the finish playing?
Maybe it's just idiots like Redknapp who can't do anything else that pick management?
I see Chris Powell and Chris Ramsey aren't doing much for black coaches or managers.
Its ok though as 2 black coaches will have to be interviewed for their post in the future.
===========================================================
WTF??
I see Tim Sherwood and Uwe Rosler aren't doing much for white coaches or managers
It’s ok though as they’ve already been replaced by white coaches.
comment by Wumpatrol (U5046)
posted 17 hours, 33 minutes ago
You are a huge idiot and I am being kind here
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Maybe, I am just pointing out as I said at the beginning, maybe it's not a case of managers not getting the chance it's a case of them not being the best man for the job. On the other hand it might be part of the conspiracy, hire a black coach then sack them to prove that they aren't fit for the job and managers should be picked on merit.
Sorry if I offended anyone, WUM
comment by Wessie Road (U10652)
posted 17 hours, 18 minutes ago
I see Chris Powell and Chris Ramsey aren't doing much for black coaches or managers.
Its ok though as 2 black coaches will have to be interviewed for their post in the future.
===========================================================
WTF??
I see Tim Sherwood and Uwe Rosler aren't doing much for white coaches or managers
It’s ok though as they’ve already been replaced by white coaches.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly, pick managers on merit. If they aren't enough or aren't a good fit, move them on. White, black whatever.
Exactly, pick managers on merit. If they aren't enough or aren't a good fit, move them on. White, black whatever.
===========================================================
Well, that’s not what’s happening, is it? What’s happening is “white, black, whatever...but mostly white”.
This apparently leads to the curious conclusion that there is a meritocracy in place, but that “blacks may not want to be coaches”, as if there might be any rational reason why people with black skin (but from different cultures and backgrounds) might view coaching differently from the way people with white skin view it.
Or as if they might have a common view about anything.
Townsend's comments are silly...it's a results-based business...but I don't understand the anger some people feel about examining the question of whether there is something not quite right about the status quo.
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Black managers and coaches
Page 3 of 3
posted on 30/10/15
Playing is about subjective ability. You can't do a QCF in playing football.
_________________________
And managing is about subjective ability.
posted on 30/10/15
No it's not.
It's about being qualified and being given the opportunity to at least talk about your ideas in an interview let alone actually display them within a role.
It is a statistical fact that the proportion of qualified BAME staff is not represented in paid roles.
Why?
posted on 30/10/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 30/10/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 30/10/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 30/10/15
Hopefully there will also be a rule which come into being whereby PL clubs (and football league clubs as well) have to interview at least 1 English manager when the job is up for grabs.
posted on 30/10/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 30/10/15
the simple facts are that the percentage of professional footballers in this country being of black or asian origin has been increasing constantly over the past few decades, and in all likelihood will continue to increase.
concomitant with that is that the number of retiring players of black or asian origin who decide to get their coaching badges will also continue to increase.
as these coaches prove themselves, the percentage of black or asian coaches/managers of professional football in this country will trend towards equality with the percentages of ethnicity making up the country as a whole.
all that is needed is time.
to attempt to force clubs to give jobs to people based purely on the colour of their skin is positive discrimination. that IS still DISCRIMINATION, and there is absolutely nothing positive about that, despite the common nomenclature. generally it involves someone better able or qualified losing out so that an artificial quota/target can be met.
the jobs should go to the best qualified applicant, regardless of gender, colour or creed.
and at the end of the day, we can't force a black or asian player to get their coaching badges, or apply for a manager's job, just like we can't force a white player, or a female player.
until the percentage of black or asian ex-players CHOOSING to get their coaching qualifications increases then they're going to be under-represented in management, that has nothing to do with racism, it's simply a numbers game.
posted on 30/10/15
until the percentage of black or asian ex-players CHOOSING to get their coaching qualifications increases then they're going to be under-represented in management, that has nothing to do with racism
======================================================
Why would a higher proportion of black or asian ex-players CHOOSE not to get their coaching qualifications?
Can you think of a reason?
posted on 30/10/15
the jobs should go to the best qualified applicant, regardless of gender, colour or creed.
------------------------------
No one is suggesting otherwise.
This is a common comment when this topic comes up and is usually irrelevant. The article linked and the discussion have not been about giving the job to anyone other than the best qualified.
posted on 30/10/15
Yeah, those responses always miss the point spectacularly!
posted on 30/10/15
"Why would a higher proportion of black or asian ex-players CHOOSE not to get their coaching qualifications?"
Absolutely pertinent question there!
posted on 5/11/15
I see Chris Powell and Chris Ramsey aren't doing much for black coaches or managers.
Its ok though as 2 black coaches will have to be interviewed for their post in the future.
posted on 5/11/15
You are a huge idiot and I am being kind here
posted on 5/11/15
With the high wages now paid why would intelligent and wealthy footballers want to go back into/remain in football once the finish playing?
Maybe it's just idiots like Redknapp who can't do anything else that pick management?
posted on 5/11/15
I see Chris Powell and Chris Ramsey aren't doing much for black coaches or managers.
Its ok though as 2 black coaches will have to be interviewed for their post in the future.
===========================================================
WTF??
I see Tim Sherwood and Uwe Rosler aren't doing much for white coaches or managers
It’s ok though as they’ve already been replaced by white coaches.
posted on 6/11/15
comment by Wumpatrol (U5046)
posted 17 hours, 33 minutes ago
You are a huge idiot and I am being kind here
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Maybe, I am just pointing out as I said at the beginning, maybe it's not a case of managers not getting the chance it's a case of them not being the best man for the job. On the other hand it might be part of the conspiracy, hire a black coach then sack them to prove that they aren't fit for the job and managers should be picked on merit.
Sorry if I offended anyone, WUM
posted on 6/11/15
comment by Wessie Road (U10652)
posted 17 hours, 18 minutes ago
I see Chris Powell and Chris Ramsey aren't doing much for black coaches or managers.
Its ok though as 2 black coaches will have to be interviewed for their post in the future.
===========================================================
WTF??
I see Tim Sherwood and Uwe Rosler aren't doing much for white coaches or managers
It’s ok though as they’ve already been replaced by white coaches.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly, pick managers on merit. If they aren't enough or aren't a good fit, move them on. White, black whatever.
posted on 6/11/15
Exactly, pick managers on merit. If they aren't enough or aren't a good fit, move them on. White, black whatever.
===========================================================
Well, that’s not what’s happening, is it? What’s happening is “white, black, whatever...but mostly white”.
This apparently leads to the curious conclusion that there is a meritocracy in place, but that “blacks may not want to be coaches”, as if there might be any rational reason why people with black skin (but from different cultures and backgrounds) might view coaching differently from the way people with white skin view it.
Or as if they might have a common view about anything.
Townsend's comments are silly...it's a results-based business...but I don't understand the anger some people feel about examining the question of whether there is something not quite right about the status quo.
Page 3 of 3