Agree with most of those assessments. I thought Leicester were the better team in the 90 minutes and although they weren’t very good at penalties, they were better than us.

Ruddy made one great save and had a good game.
Dendoncker looks ready when we need him. Coady steady as ever. Hause did ok but never looks complete comfortable on the ball. Castro I thought was our best player and showed he can play on the right. Saiss never imposed himself on the game. Gibbs White got better as the game went on and will be a star when his confidence grows. Vinagre did lots of good work going forward but his defending is quite poor. Traore had so good moments but didn’t do enough over the 90 and Nuno was regularly having a go at him at his lack of movement off the ball. Bonatini got no supply but had a poor game. Cavaleiro was one of the few bright spots in the first half and will soon be ready to be a sub for the first team. Jota made a big difference when he came on. Benny Ashley Seal looks a player in the making. Big guy for his age and was the only one to take a good penalty. Bennett came on and played right wing back and looked well unsuited to that position

Everyone keeps saying Benny Ashley-Seal did well, but I thought he looked as if he was trying too hard to be involved and it was difficult to tell. For example, he got in the way of Vinagre at one point as he was breaking with the ball, committed a few fouls etc. Did look a big lad for his age so ok physically and his penalty was very well taken; but think people are blinkered by him being a young prospect when assessing how he did.

Benny was only on for less than ten minutes last night so my comments were more about his general progress than that short time where he got little chance to impress. Got 7 goals in 3 games for the U23s and is improving fast.

Are you going to the game at Brighton in October tam? I am planning to spend the weekend down there. Did the same last time we played there and stayed in the Thistle Hotel near the pier. They have the biggest beds I have ever slept in!

Just looked to book and the Thistle is now a Jurys

And the prices seem to have doubled

Can't say I understand the view that Mgw suffered from not having a dynamic midfielder next to him when I think the opposite is far more likely, we already know Saiss is good enough and I suspect our midfield didn't work because mgw isn't really a center mid and seen plenty saying he looked better once he pushed forward more.

Bigger problem is our second striker and it is gonna bite us on the arris, Bonatini again disappoints and if he can't even slightly impose himself on a game which was basically lower championship standard we have a problem if Jimenez gets injured.

That said I can understand it isn't easy to get going when you don't play much for weeks at a time and that applies.to several of last night's side.

It's weird that we haven't conceded a goal in our last 6 matches in this cup, yet get dumped out on both occasions via penalties.

comment by Spangles (U17289)
posted about 4 hours ago
Benny was only on for less than ten minutes last night so my comments were more about his general progress than that short time where he got little chance to impress. Got 7 goals in 3 games for the U23s and is improving fast.

Are you going to the game at Brighton in October tam? I am planning to spend the weekend down there. Did the same last time we played there and stayed in the Thistle Hotel near the pier. They have the biggest beds I have ever slept in!
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Would like to go, but doubt I will be able to get a ticket given we keep selling out our allocation before it gets to general sale. Easy away day for me if I can though, as trains to the ground are free from my local station if you have a ticket to the game.

comment by WOLVES55 (U10973)
posted 17 hours, 1 minute ago
Have to say the Leicester fans singing "Jamie Vardy he's won more than you" was strange....he hasn't
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well I think there are several points to note here:

1. In my experience fans only retrospectively question what opposing fans were singing when they have lost a game. Very rarely is this issue ever raised in victory as it’s a pretty moot point.

2. Terrace chants are predominantly used to generate atmosphere or for “banter” between opposing sets of fans. I don’t think historical accuracy, necessarily, is forefront in the average fan’s mind. For example: we have a song about being the: “world’s greatest team” and another about being better than: “Barcelona and Madrid”. I doubt many neutral observers would agree with either of these standpoints.

3. There is a certain amount of subjectivity in the statement. Who is the “you” in “he’s won more than you”? Individual players? fans? the opposing team? I’ve previously had a discussion with friends who support Derby or Forest when they say they’ve won more than me. The question is whether they were physically present when their teams achieved their success- or even alive? I have been in the ground when Leicester City have lifted the PL title and 2 League Cups. If there are Wolves fans, in the ground, who witnessed their great era in the 1950’s then the factual accuracy of: “he’s won more than you” could be questioned, but arguably it is accurate for the majority of those present. Of course if we are considering Wolves, the club, in its entire history then I’d agree that Jamie Vardy has, indeed, not won more than “you”.

comment by Cinciwolf--Top ten finish? Piece of pee (U11551)
posted about 4 hours ago
Can't say I understand the view that Mgw suffered from not having a dynamic midfielder next to him when I think the opposite is far more likely, we already know Saiss is good enough and I suspect our midfield didn't work because mgw isn't really a center mid and seen plenty saying he looked better once he pushed forward more.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

We don’t know Saiss is good enough for Premier League level. To an extent, both will have suffered without having someone like Neves or Moutinho with them. The difference being that MGW showed flashes of brilliance, whereas Saiss showed very little all game and was very average.

I don’t really understand people talking about MGW being pushed up more. He played centrally all game. Got in more advanced positions as the game wore on, but that was due to our play being better second half and having more of the ball; rather than a change in position.

I don’t think there’s any doubt that central midfield is Gibbs White’s position and he surely has every chance of being a star there. He was frustrating at times last night because in the first hour he passed the ball back to Coady on countless occasions. But when Jota came on and started opening Leicester up on the left, MGW became more positive and started showing what he can do. One run he made past at least four Leicester players was almost Messi-like. As his experience grows so will his confidence to be more adventurous more often

As for Saiss he hardly got into the game at all last night. I have always felt there isn’t enough in his game for him to be a top flight midfielder and suspect he will end up as a defender. But he would have to play on the left of defence and you would never select him in preference to Boly

comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted about 2 hours ago
comment by Cinciwolf--Top ten finish? Piece of pee (U11551)
posted about 4 hours ago
Can't say I understand the view that Mgw suffered from not having a dynamic midfielder next to him when I think the opposite is far more likely, we already know Saiss is good enough and I suspect our midfield didn't work because mgw isn't really a center mid and seen plenty saying he looked better once he pushed forward more.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

We don’t know Saiss is good enough for Premier League level. To an extent, both will have suffered without having someone like Neves or Moutinho with them. The difference being that MGW showed flashes of brilliance, whereas Saiss showed very little all game and was very average.

I don’t really understand people talking about MGW being pushed up more. He played centrally all game. Got in more advanced positions as the game wore on, but that was due to our play being better second half and having more of the ball; rather than a change in position.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

The fact he got in advanced positions at all is alien to our usual central midfield pairings, Neves got into the oppo box six times all last season.

Nuno wants his center mids to sit and be disciplined all game recycling possession again and again and I just don't think that is mgws natural game.

comment by Jobyfox (U4183)
posted 6 hours, 25 minutes ago
comment by WOLVES55 (U10973)
posted 17 hours, 1 minute ago
Have to say the Leicester fans singing "Jamie Vardy he's won more than you" was strange....he hasn't
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well I think there are several points to note here:

1. In my experience fans only retrospectively question what opposing fans were singing when they have lost a game. Very rarely is this issue ever raised in victory as it’s a pretty moot point.

2. Terrace chants are predominantly used to generate atmosphere or for “banter” between opposing sets of fans. I don’t think historical accuracy, necessarily, is forefront in the average fan’s mind. For example: we have a song about being the: “world’s greatest team” and another about being better than: “Barcelona and Madrid”. I doubt many neutral observers would agree with either of these standpoints.

3. There is a certain amount of subjectivity in the statement. Who is the “you” in “he’s won more than you”? Individual players? fans? the opposing team? I’ve previously had a discussion with friends who support Derby or Forest when they say they’ve won more than me. The question is whether they were physically present when their teams achieved their success- or even alive? I have been in the ground when Leicester City have lifted the PL title and 2 League Cups. If there are Wolves fans, in the ground, who witnessed their great era in the 1950’s then the factual accuracy of: “he’s won more than you” could be questioned, but arguably it is accurate for the majority of those present. Of course if we are considering Wolves, the club, in its entire history then I’d agree that Jamie Vardy has, indeed, not won more than “you”.



----------------------------------------------------------------------
So by your reckoning.....our 19 Year old central midfielder has won more than you and Vardy put together <World Cup>

comment by Cinciwolf--Top ten finish? Piece of pee (U11551)
posted 4 hours, 57 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted about 2 hours ago
comment by Cinciwolf--Top ten finish? Piece of pee (U11551)
posted about 4 hours ago
Can't say I understand the view that Mgw suffered from not having a dynamic midfielder next to him when I think the opposite is far more likely, we already know Saiss is good enough and I suspect our midfield didn't work because mgw isn't really a center mid and seen plenty saying he looked better once he pushed forward more.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

We don’t know Saiss is good enough for Premier League level. To an extent, both will have suffered without having someone like Neves or Moutinho with them. The difference being that MGW showed flashes of brilliance, whereas Saiss showed very little all game and was very average.

I don’t really understand people talking about MGW being pushed up more. He played centrally all game. Got in more advanced positions as the game wore on, but that was due to our play being better second half and having more of the ball; rather than a change in position.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

The fact he got in advanced positions at all is alien to our usual central midfield pairings, Neves got into the oppo box six times all last season.

Nuno wants his center mids to sit and be disciplined all game recycling possession again and again and I just don't think that is mgws natural game.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I only remember him getting into the box once and that was part of a counter attacking move where he broke quickly to get beyond the striker. Other than that, he didn’t really position himself too differently. Advanced positions isn’t too alien, one of Moutinho and Neves regularly get themselves around the edge of the area when we are high up the pitch.

Obviously he is a different type of midfielder to Neves and Moutinho, but that is mainly due to his willingness to carry the ball, drive into space and take a man on. That isn’t a bad thing and I am pretty sure Nuno isn’t as close minded to shut off that option in midfield if he thinks it will work; hence why we have seen him used more than Saiss this season.

Yes I remember Gibbs White going into the opposition area once. Can’t imagine Nuno ever selecting him to play in midfield again

But more astonishing is the news that Neves and Moutinho, who are being talked of as one of the best midfield pairings in the country, are just employed to sit deep and recycle the ball Can’t see us getting £110m for Neves if that’s all he does

comment by Spangles (U17289)
posted 28 minutes ago
Yes I remember Gibbs White going into the opposition area once. Can’t imagine Nuno ever selecting him to play in midfield again

But more astonishing is the news that Neves and Moutinho, who are being talked of as one of the best midfield pairings in the country, are just employed to sit deep and recycle the ballCan’t see us getting £110m for Neves if that’s all he does
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Didn't see anyone say that is all they did?!

Fact is that Mgw is very different to Neves, Moutinho and Saiss, the three fellas who have occupied our midfield the last year and a bit, I don't recall any of those ever coming and playing advanced as we have seen mgw do several times.

And agreed, Moutinho and Neves are one of the best pairings in the country, I have been saying that all over these boards this season

I thought MGW was very good on Tuesday night, not sure what the point is here ?

MGW is not Neves or Mutty, so not sure why we’re trying to judge him on his ability to be a carbon copy of those aforementioned portugeser’s?

Confused Tettenhall x

comment by Sir Halfy ...Premier League Thread Master (U11570)
posted about an hour ago
I thought MGW was very good on Tuesday night, not sure what the point is here ?

MGW is not Neves or Mutty, so not sure why we’re trying to judge him on his ability to be a carbon copy of those aforementioned portugeser’s?

Confused Tettenhall x
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I think Cinci was aimlessly trying to defend a very mediocre performance from Saiss by blaming MGW for not being a midfielder.

comment by Sir Halfy ...Premier League Thread Master (U11570)
posted about 11 hours ago
comment by Jobyfox (U4183)
posted 6 hours, 25 minutes ago
comment by WOLVES55 (U10973)
posted 17 hours, 1 minute ago
Have to say the Leicester fans singing "Jamie Vardy he's won more than you" was strange....he hasn't
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well I think there are several points to note here:

1. In my experience fans only retrospectively question what opposing fans were singing when they have lost a game. Very rarely is this issue ever raised in victory as it’s a pretty moot point.

2. Terrace chants are predominantly used to generate atmosphere or for “banter” between opposing sets of fans. I don’t think historical accuracy, necessarily, is forefront in the average fan’s mind. For example: we have a song about being the: “world’s greatest team” and another about being better than: “Barcelona and Madrid”. I doubt many neutral observers would agree with either of these standpoints.

3. There is a certain amount of subjectivity in the statement. Who is the “you” in “he’s won more than you”? Individual players? fans? the opposing team? I’ve previously had a discussion with friends who support Derby or Forest when they say they’ve won more than me. The question is whether they were physically present when their teams achieved their success- or even alive? I have been in the ground when Leicester City have lifted the PL title and 2 League Cups. If there are Wolves fans, in the ground, who witnessed their great era in the 1950’s then the factual accuracy of: “he’s won more than you” could be questioned, but arguably it is accurate for the majority of those present. Of course if we are considering Wolves, the club, in its entire history then I’d agree that Jamie Vardy has, indeed, not won more than “you”.



----------------------------------------------------------------------
So by your reckoning.....our 19 Year old central midfielder has won more than you and Vardy put together <World Cup>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Thank you for completely ignoring my points about subjectivity and historical accuracy. If you hadn’t you wouldn’t be making that statement.

I refer you back to my point two. Another example: I’m old enough to have been a football fan when David Beckham first started dating Victoria Adams. Despite a popular refrain from the terraces at that time I’m not sure that anybody has ever verified, conclusively, whether Posh Spice does, indeed, take it up the backside.

Jobyfox

Thank you. Your last comment literally made me laugh out loud. A brilliant comment in a sea of mediocrity

comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted about 4 hours ago
comment by Sir Halfy ...Premier League Thread Master (U11570)
posted about an hour ago
I thought MGW was very good on Tuesday night, not sure what the point is here ?

MGW is not Neves or Mutty, so not sure why we’re trying to judge him on his ability to be a carbon copy of those aforementioned portugeser’s?

Confused Tettenhall x
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I think Cinci was aimlessly trying to defend a very mediocre performance from Saiss by blaming MGW for not being a midfielder.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Not trying to defend anyone, clearly our midfield didn't work Tuesday but just more bemused by some of the bizarre comments I read regarding certain players folks clearly don't like.

Saiss....Lazy, not interested, body language, doesn't want to be here, sideways etc etc

Mgw is clearly a very very good player in the making and I am keen to see how he is used and how we adapt over the coming years

comment by Vinnie Garstrokes (U2138)
posted about 2 hours ago
Jobyfox

Thank you. Your last comment literally made me laugh out loud. A brilliant comment in a sea of mediocrity
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Thanks for that - it's good to know I've brightened at least one person's day.

comment by Cinciwolf--Top ten finish? Piece of pee (U11551)
posted 2 hours, 23 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted about 4 hours ago
comment by Sir Halfy ...Premier League Thread Master (U11570)
posted about an hour ago
I thought MGW was very good on Tuesday night, not sure what the point is here ?

MGW is not Neves or Mutty, so not sure why we’re trying to judge him on his ability to be a carbon copy of those aforementioned portugeser’s?

Confused Tettenhall x
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I think Cinci was aimlessly trying to defend a very mediocre performance from Saiss by blaming MGW for not being a midfielder.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Not trying to defend anyone, clearly our midfield didn't work Tuesday but just more bemused by some of the bizarre comments I read regarding certain players folks clearly don't like.

Saiss....Lazy, not interested, body language, doesn't want to be here, sideways etc etc

Mgw is clearly a very very good player in the making and I am keen to see how he is used and how we adapt over the coming years
----------------------------------------------------------------------

But Saiss was poor in the last match, his passing was negative and he was very slow. Should we ignore that despite the fact he is supposed to be our back up using the opportunity to challenge for a first team place, just because you like him? I don’t think I have ever seen you criticise him, so perhaps it is actually you that makes the bizarre comments?

Saiss does the same every single week.

As for a first team place he has zero chance unless Neves or Moutinho get injured and even then I would imagine Dendoncker would get the chance first.

I wouldn’t single Saïss out for criticism based on Tuesday night, it would have been a difficult game to get in to based on the time he had. No doubt his mission was to break down any threat and keep the ball ...that’s what he did