comment by Elvis: King of Cult (U7425)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Der Post Nearly Mann. Rangnificent (U1270)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Elvis: King of Cult (U7425)
posted 54 seconds ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 3 minutes ago
Elvis

“ He's right though. That's exactly why people voted to leave.”

Polls showed the two main reasons being immigration and sovereignty. The immigration argument was countered by facts showing EU migrants are of a net benefit to the U.K. and aren’t a hindrance at all. Sovereignty is a load of shiite jingoistic nonsense.
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So....they voted on feelings and emotions?
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I find this somewhat disappointing as it's ultimately people's livelihoods or standard of living that are affected.

'I may be worse off, but I feel better'?

Madness.
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But if you don't provide the average person with the required information to make a decision, that is what happens. The whole thing was a clusterfeck really.
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Completely agree. But now that we're starting to realise the extent of the impact, the fact that some people aren't experiencing any cognitive dissonance at all amazes me. They're still unaware of the issues beyond the dog whistle they followed at the time.

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

comment by Elvis: King of Cult (U7425)
posted 11 minutes ago
comment by Jadon The King Sancho (U10026)
posted 3 minutes ago
And that he’s right that people didn’t care about facts and only cared about feelings shows they are idiots. Which was the point.
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Harsh to call them (all) idiots. Some certainly are. But how can you expect the average person to be fully informed on such a complex issue? And, as already pointed out, the 2 campaigns were absolute crap. They didn't provide any real form of information to help guide the people. So they were always going to vote on feelings and emotions.

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When you have a series of Government Brexit ministers wholly ignorant of EU protocols and mechanims, (including some of the most basic policies) it's hard to expect joe public to be able to make an informed decision.

Which was exploited by the leave campaigns. And poorly countered by Better In.

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

That’s excellent.

comment by Michael, this isn't right. 😭 (U10408)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by Clockwork Red: Jadon and the Argonauts (U4892)
posted 19 minutes ago
comment by Michael, this isn't right. 😭 (U10408)
posted 21 minutes ago
Remainders are like WW2 or British Empire bores, repeating the same old tired ramblings.
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Well, this is laced with irony, isn’t it?

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Glad you noticed.👍😂
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I'm guessing you voted Leave and stand by that, Michael. If I'm right what was the impact of Leave that you were looking for, and having seen the Fiscal Policy Unit analysis earlier, are you happy that we're on the right path to achieving this?

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

comment by Michael, this isn't right. 😭 (U10408)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by Der Post Nearly Mann. Rangnificent (U1270)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Michael, this isn't right. 😭 (U10408)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by Clockwork Red: Jadon and the Argonauts (U4892)
posted 19 minutes ago
comment by Michael, this isn't right. 😭 (U10408)
posted 21 minutes ago
Remainders are like WW2 or British Empire bores, repeating the same old tired ramblings.
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Well, this is laced with irony, isn’t it?

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Glad you noticed.👍😂
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I'm guessing you voted Leave and stand by that, Michael. If I'm right what was the impact of Leave that you were looking for, and having seen the Fiscal Policy Unit analysis earlier, are you happy that we're on the right path to achieving this?
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Well you'd guess wrong. 👍
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Really? Which part?

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

comment by Michael, this isn't right. 😭 (U10408)
posted 2 minutes ago
I didn't vote leave.
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Did you vote?

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

Too young?

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

comment by Henry Chinaski (U21800)
posted 6 hours, 40 minutes ago
Shocked that middle-class, world-travelling Robb doesn't understand the experience of the British working class.

The truth is, the way Remainers insult the intelligence of people they don't know or understand is disgusting. How can you be so arrogant about something that a) you are in the minority on, and b) has so far played out during the backdrop of a worldwide pandemic, and been overseen by a corrupt Tory government?

Give it time, and a change of government, and maybe we'll see more positives from Brexit.

I would wager some people were turned towards the leave side purely due to Remainers being so smug and self-congratulatory.

Maybe consider being more moderate and try to understand the opposition and debate with them properly, instead of huffing your own farts and patting each other on the back, and maybe you'll change some people's minds.
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So this is what you think Remainers are, while at the same time stating that remainers are arrogant for saying what they think about leavers.

Another one from the bottomless pit of genius rationale that leavers constantly come out with.

If remainers are all like this then its also possible that leavers are all thick. The point is you can't group people together and label them smug and self congratulatory while at the same time crying that they are labelling another group of people as lacking intelligence. Contradictory.

comment by Michael, this isn't right. 😭 (U10408)
posted 12 minutes ago
I wish. 😂

At the time I lived abroad, but I was in the UK for the vote and the weeks prior. I watched the 'debates' and came to the conclusion I was too uninformed - as the info they were spouting was ballacks on both sides. So, I decided to leave it upto the people living in the UK
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Same. Only I live in the UK.

I voted remain on the basis that nobody was explaining how they'd replace favourable agreements with our biggest trading partners, and the immigration dog whistles didn't register with me.

The NHS pledge made me laugh. People who'd be up in arms if a manifesto included a direct £100 a year tax increase solely for NHS funding are happy to lose more than that as inflation increases and imported goods tariffs drive up costs. And they still won't get their promised funding.

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

comment by No Love AKA Mamba - not home right now as I'm out rioting and looting with BLM and my right hand man Sizzle (U1282)
posted 19 minutes ago
comment by Henry Chinaski (U21800)
posted 6 hours, 40 minutes ago
Shocked that middle-class, world-travelling Robb doesn't understand the experience of the British working class.

The truth is, the way Remainers insult the intelligence of people they don't know or understand is disgusting. How can you be so arrogant about something that a) you are in the minority on, and b) has so far played out during the backdrop of a worldwide pandemic, and been overseen by a corrupt Tory government?

Give it time, and a change of government, and maybe we'll see more positives from Brexit.

I would wager some people were turned towards the leave side purely due to Remainers being so smug and self-congratulatory.

Maybe consider being more moderate and try to understand the opposition and debate with them properly, instead of huffing your own farts and patting each other on the back, and maybe you'll change some people's minds.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So this is what you think Remainers are, while at the same time stating that remainers are arrogant for saying what they think about leavers.

Another one from the bottomless pit of genius rationale that leavers constantly come out with.

If remainers are all like this then its also possible that leavers are all thick. The point is you can't group people together and label them smug and self congratulatory while at the same time crying that they are labelling another group of people as lacking intelligence. Contradictory.
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Are you not casually lumping leavers together here, lad.

I have seen many from remain label leavers thick quite often too....thus insulting millions of labour voters.

It is arrogant to think one is more intelligent than others, is it not, no matter how one votes?

The NHS thing easily played into people’s xenophobic sensibilities.

comment by Michael, this isn't right. 😭 (U10408)
posted 2 seconds ago
comment by Der Post Nearly Mann. Rangnificent (U1270)
posted 14 seconds ago
I voted remain on the basis that nobody was explaining how they'd replace favourable agreements with our biggest trading partners, and the immigration dog whistles didn't register with me.

The NHS pledge made me laugh. People who'd be up in arms if a manifesto included a direct £100 a year tax increase solely for NHS funding are happy to lose more than that as inflation increases and imported goods tariffs drive up costs. And they still won't get their promised funding.
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So the trading was the reason for you, but you must acknowledge that for many people that are struggling financially, trade is the last thing on their mind.

Until a proper discussion can be had with feasible outcomes on why people voted leave did, any future debates are futile.

I hope you don't think it's as simple as racism, but even if that did play a role (it did, but I think to a very minor degree), why are those people feeling that? How can it be rectified?

Gotta get to da roots!
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Did the Brexit campaign promise individual prosperity? There were indirect lines, but you come back to them being associated with immigration.

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

Don't worry lads you're still our non EU fwiends

comment by Michael, this isn't right. 😭 (U10408)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Der Post Nearly Mann. Rangnificent (U1270)
posted 14 seconds ago
I voted remain on the basis that nobody was explaining how they'd replace favourable agreements with our biggest trading partners, and the immigration dog whistles didn't register with me.

The NHS pledge made me laugh. People who'd be up in arms if a manifesto included a direct £100 a year tax increase solely for NHS funding are happy to lose more than that as inflation increases and imported goods tariffs drive up costs. And they still won't get their promised funding.
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So the trading was the reason for you, but you must acknowledge that for many people that are struggling financially, trade is the last thing on their mind.

Until a proper discussion can be had with feasible outcomes on why people voted leave did, any future debates are futile.

I hope you don't think it's as simple as racism, but even if that did play a role (it did, but I think to a very minor degree), why are those people feeling that? How can it be rectified?

Gotta get to da roots!
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Trade generates income for the public purse. Which enables governments to spend more. Thus helping people out of financial distress.

To date GDP as a result of the TCA agreement (covid aside which has cost 2% of GDP) has been hit by a 4% decline.

Trade was very rarely discussed during referendum discussions, and as acknowledged by Cummings in his blog it was an argument they could never win. So other issues (immigration, NHS, EU army etc etc) were used instead.

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

comment by Irishred (U2539)
posted 5 minutes ago
Don't worry lads you're still our non EU fwiends
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Irish