Just keep it for the semi automated offsides and scrap the rest.
comment by (K̇ash) - Klopp's Last Dance - Free Pale... (U1108)
posted 1 second ago
Just keep it for the semi automated offsides and scrap the rest.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why? If you’ve got referees looking at a decision from 10 different facking angles how are you concluding it’s VAR that is the problem? Why are other countries managing fine with it?
The system is absolutely part of the problem.
It needs a complete overhaul.
I wonder if the PL have considered employing referees from abroad? Or is PGMOL the issue?
Can they vote to scrap PGMOL instead?
comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 31 seconds ago
I wonder if the PL have considered employing referees from abroad? Or is PGMOL the issue?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
They brought Jarred Gillett in from Australia already - and he is one of the worst refs going. You have to wonder why they brought him over...
I would guess a lot of refs across Europe wouldn't want to move to England, tbh. They have careers outside of football usually, so unless it was for a lifechanging wage they are probably happy where they are.
But scrapping VAR is not the solution. Sorting out the rules and improving the standards of refs is the key.
Any goal that comes via a through ball or flick on hasn't been the same since VAR was introduced. You can't fully celebrate it until it's cleared. It's a huge issue for me and why technology works better in some sports than it does in others.
Scrap it. Football was more enjoyable without VAR.
Is Cinci a shareholder at Wolves then?
Handball rule needs simplified, ball hits you on any part of your hand/arm from fingertip to elbow regardless of intent or body shape, handball. Hits any other part of arm, its a shoulder, play on.
comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 1 minute ago
Handball rule needs simplified, ball hits you on any part of your hand/arm from fingertip to elbow regardless of intent or body shape, handball. Hits any other part of arm, its a shoulder, play on.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Awful idea.
Why give penalties for an ‘offence’ that a defender could do nothing about?
If people remembered why we have a handball law, it’d be a start.
I watched the african cup of nations this year. It was one of the best refed tournament thanks to VAR used judiciously. Its bad here mainly because of its use. Be stringent in the rules, and the league will adjust to it. They are just trying to make the refs decision on the game almost always correct.
I’m not keen of VAR because I prefer games to flow and like human error. I dont think clubs will be fine with their being more mistakes if VAR is removed so surprised they want this unless they’re all stupid and don’t realise that the best way to lessen the amount of human error is to figure out more effective ways to use VAR, not remove it.
The handball rule is an absolute farce, but I don't think it's because it's too complicated.
I think it's because in essence, it's supposed to prevent players from using their hands/arms to manipulate the play to their advantage.
IFAB has tried to be much too clever with this, trying to establish a set of conditions in which that intentionality can be evinced, but ave made a pig's dinner of it with the whole 'unnatural' position concept.
There are plenty of situations where you arms spread out away from the body as part of your natural balance.
I've seen penalties given where a player's been barged from behind mid-leap with a ball incoming. It's 100% natural for the arms to open out as the brain instinctively seeks to regain its centre of gravity, but the ball's hit the player on the arm and he's been punished with a penalty for it.
I think it's more a case that there are simply situations where it has to be down to the ref's discretion to make the call. That goes for many 'soft' fouls too.
Everyone's going to have a different opinion, but in the end the reason there's a ref is because someone has to be trusted to make unbiased rulings on the play.
VAR should be there to offer the ref the help he might need to reach a fair decision when things are unclear, when his vision's been blocked, or things have happened too fast for him to be able to appreciate them in real time.
The key issue is that the governing bodies have sought to legislate for every single situation, and taken more power out of the hands of the ref than they should have, diminishing their authority in the process.
comment by Glazers Out (SE85) (U21241)
posted 15 minutes ago
Any goal that comes via a through ball or flick on hasn't been the same since VAR was introduced. You can't fully celebrate it until it's cleared. It's a huge issue for me and why technology works better in some sports than it does in others.
Scrap it. Football was more enjoyable without VAR.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I agree with you.
Not often I say that.
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 16 minutes ago
Is Cinci a shareholder at Wolves then?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Was thinking that. So precious.
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 54 seconds ago
The handball rule is an absolute farce, but I don't think it's because it's too complicated.
I think it's because in essence, it's supposed to prevent players from using their hands/arms to manipulate the play to their advantage.
IFAB has tried to be much too clever with this, trying to establish a set of conditions in which that intentionality can be evinced, but ave made a pig's dinner of it with the whole 'unnatural' position concept.
There are plenty of situations where you arms spread out away from the body as part of your natural balance.
I've seen penalties given where a player's been barged from behind mid-leap with a ball incoming. It's 100% natural for the arms to open out as the brain instinctively seeks to regain its centre of gravity, but the ball's hit the player on the arm and he's been punished with a penalty for it.
I think it's more a case that there are simply situations where it has to be down to the ref's discretion to make the call. That goes for many 'soft' fouls too.
Everyone's going to have a different opinion, but in the end the reason there's a ref is because someone has to be trusted to make unbiased rulings on the play.
VAR should be there to offer the ref the help he might need to reach a fair decision when things are unclear, when his vision's been blocked, or things have happened too fast for him to be able to appreciate them in real time.
The key issue is that the governing bodies have sought to legislate for every single situation, and taken more power out of the hands of the ref than they should have, diminishing their authority in the process.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sadly, too many idiots on here will argue that we can’t rely on interpretation and it has to be consistent, etc etc.
9 times out of 10, most normal people can agree with the player deliberately tried to affect the ball with his arms.
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 1 minute ago
The handball rule is an absolute farce, but I don't think it's because it's too complicated.
I think it's because in essence, it's supposed to prevent players from using their hands/arms to manipulate the play to their advantage.
IFAB has tried to be much too clever with this, trying to establish a set of conditions in which that intentionality can be evinced, but ave made a pig's dinner of it with the whole 'unnatural' position concept.
There are plenty of situations where you arms spread out away from the body as part of your natural balance.
I've seen penalties given where a player's been barged from behind mid-leap with a ball incoming. It's 100% natural for the arms to open out as the brain instinctively seeks to regain its centre of gravity, but the ball's hit the player on the arm and he's been punished with a penalty for it.
I think it's more a case that there are simply situations where it has to be down to the ref's discretion to make the call. That goes for many 'soft' fouls too.
Everyone's going to have a different opinion, but in the end the reason there's a ref is because someone has to be trusted to make unbiased rulings on the play.
VAR should be there to offer the ref the help he might need to reach a fair decision when things are unclear, when his vision's been blocked, or things have happened too fast for him to be able to appreciate them in real time.
The key issue is that the governing bodies have sought to legislate for every single situation, and taken more power out of the hands of the ref than they should have, diminishing their authority in the process.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Agree with all of this. As you know, what is given for handballs and penalties nowadays boils my piiiiiiss. And it’s the governing bodies enabling cheating and stupid decisions by the officials that have ruined it.
This is absolutely not the way forward. Facking hell.
I don't like it. Get rid.
comment by Boris 'Inky’ Gibson (U5901)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Glazers Out (SE85) (U21241)
posted 15 minutes ago
Any goal that comes via a through ball or flick on hasn't been the same since VAR was introduced. You can't fully celebrate it until it's cleared. It's a huge issue for me and why technology works better in some sports than it does in others.
Scrap it. Football was more enjoyable without VAR.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I agree with you.
Not often I say that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's not true. We agree on a lot of things.
You just don't agree with me on one particular high profile topic. 😂
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 18 minutes ago
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 54 seconds ago
The handball rule is an absolute farce, but I don't think it's because it's too complicated.
I think it's because in essence, it's supposed to prevent players from using their hands/arms to manipulate the play to their advantage.
IFAB has tried to be much too clever with this, trying to establish a set of conditions in which that intentionality can be evinced, but ave made a pig's dinner of it with the whole 'unnatural' position concept.
There are plenty of situations where you arms spread out away from the body as part of your natural balance.
I've seen penalties given where a player's been barged from behind mid-leap with a ball incoming. It's 100% natural for the arms to open out as the brain instinctively seeks to regain its centre of gravity, but the ball's hit the player on the arm and he's been punished with a penalty for it.
I think it's more a case that there are simply situations where it has to be down to the ref's discretion to make the call. That goes for many 'soft' fouls too.
Everyone's going to have a different opinion, but in the end the reason there's a ref is because someone has to be trusted to make unbiased rulings on the play.
VAR should be there to offer the ref the help he might need to reach a fair decision when things are unclear, when his vision's been blocked, or things have happened too fast for him to be able to appreciate them in real time.
The key issue is that the governing bodies have sought to legislate for every single situation, and taken more power out of the hands of the ref than they should have, diminishing their authority in the process.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sadly, too many idiots on here will argue that we can’t rely on interpretation and it has to be consistent, etc etc.
9 times out of 10, most normal people can agree with the player deliberately tried to affect the ball with his arms.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I do simultaneously think that there's often a high degree of inconsistency though. I just don't trust interested parties (fans of either side, fans invested because their club has some skin in the game, or fans who simply feel strongly about one of the sides/players involved).
Madrid had a game against Almería this season where not even a partisan fan like myself could deny that something was awry.
Turned out Madrid had long felt aggrieved by decisions made by this particular ref, and had run a week long campaign highlighting every big call they felt he'd given against them down the years. It didn't help that he'd gone on record when he was still starting out saying he was a Barça fan.
It seems likely they got into his head, because some of the calls he made that day were just inexplicably bad.
Generally though, it's easier to observe when it isn't your team involved. From that perspective, watching PL highlights this season, where I'm not really all that concerned by the outcome, some of the decisions where refs have had the benefit of being able to review the footage have left me well and truly baffled.
It's still only a small minority of all decisions though.
I agree about consistency.
But ultimately, we can’t have consistency. It’s impossible.
In 2018 or whichever year it was before VAR was introduced, most people were convinced that VAR would destroy Liverpool.
They won the league i think the following season.
So I am all for scrapping it.
It basically comes down to whether you want to have potentially tens of millions worth of decisions made by humans and continue to accept that some errors will be made (charm of the game).
Or fully lean on technology which in the long run will be perfected in conjunction with future rule changes to make situations black or white judgeable by AI.
Personally, after the Henry handball, some World Cup howlers by refs, I'm done with 'charm of the game' even if teams I supported/liked to watch profited most from them. On the other hand I wouldn't mind the FA being the only one to dismiss the VAR and just watch the Prem as a Mickey Mouse sh1tshow as long as they keep it in the CL/WC/EC's
Sign in if you want to comment
Scrapping VAR
Page 1 of 3
posted on 15/5/24
Just keep it for the semi automated offsides and scrap the rest.
posted on 15/5/24
comment by (K̇ash) - Klopp's Last Dance - Free Pale... (U1108)
posted 1 second ago
Just keep it for the semi automated offsides and scrap the rest.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why? If you’ve got referees looking at a decision from 10 different facking angles how are you concluding it’s VAR that is the problem? Why are other countries managing fine with it?
posted on 15/5/24
The system is absolutely part of the problem.
It needs a complete overhaul.
posted on 15/5/24
I wonder if the PL have considered employing referees from abroad? Or is PGMOL the issue?
posted on 15/5/24
Can they vote to scrap PGMOL instead?
posted on 15/5/24
comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 31 seconds ago
I wonder if the PL have considered employing referees from abroad? Or is PGMOL the issue?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
They brought Jarred Gillett in from Australia already - and he is one of the worst refs going. You have to wonder why they brought him over...
I would guess a lot of refs across Europe wouldn't want to move to England, tbh. They have careers outside of football usually, so unless it was for a lifechanging wage they are probably happy where they are.
But scrapping VAR is not the solution. Sorting out the rules and improving the standards of refs is the key.
posted on 15/5/24
They’re idiots.
posted on 15/5/24
Any goal that comes via a through ball or flick on hasn't been the same since VAR was introduced. You can't fully celebrate it until it's cleared. It's a huge issue for me and why technology works better in some sports than it does in others.
Scrap it. Football was more enjoyable without VAR.
posted on 15/5/24
Is Cinci a shareholder at Wolves then?
posted on 15/5/24
Handball rule needs simplified, ball hits you on any part of your hand/arm from fingertip to elbow regardless of intent or body shape, handball. Hits any other part of arm, its a shoulder, play on.
posted on 15/5/24
comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 1 minute ago
Handball rule needs simplified, ball hits you on any part of your hand/arm from fingertip to elbow regardless of intent or body shape, handball. Hits any other part of arm, its a shoulder, play on.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Awful idea.
Why give penalties for an ‘offence’ that a defender could do nothing about?
If people remembered why we have a handball law, it’d be a start.
posted on 15/5/24
I watched the african cup of nations this year. It was one of the best refed tournament thanks to VAR used judiciously. Its bad here mainly because of its use. Be stringent in the rules, and the league will adjust to it. They are just trying to make the refs decision on the game almost always correct.
posted on 15/5/24
I’m not keen of VAR because I prefer games to flow and like human error. I dont think clubs will be fine with their being more mistakes if VAR is removed so surprised they want this unless they’re all stupid and don’t realise that the best way to lessen the amount of human error is to figure out more effective ways to use VAR, not remove it.
posted on 15/5/24
The handball rule is an absolute farce, but I don't think it's because it's too complicated.
I think it's because in essence, it's supposed to prevent players from using their hands/arms to manipulate the play to their advantage.
IFAB has tried to be much too clever with this, trying to establish a set of conditions in which that intentionality can be evinced, but ave made a pig's dinner of it with the whole 'unnatural' position concept.
There are plenty of situations where you arms spread out away from the body as part of your natural balance.
I've seen penalties given where a player's been barged from behind mid-leap with a ball incoming. It's 100% natural for the arms to open out as the brain instinctively seeks to regain its centre of gravity, but the ball's hit the player on the arm and he's been punished with a penalty for it.
I think it's more a case that there are simply situations where it has to be down to the ref's discretion to make the call. That goes for many 'soft' fouls too.
Everyone's going to have a different opinion, but in the end the reason there's a ref is because someone has to be trusted to make unbiased rulings on the play.
VAR should be there to offer the ref the help he might need to reach a fair decision when things are unclear, when his vision's been blocked, or things have happened too fast for him to be able to appreciate them in real time.
The key issue is that the governing bodies have sought to legislate for every single situation, and taken more power out of the hands of the ref than they should have, diminishing their authority in the process.
posted on 15/5/24
comment by Glazers Out (SE85) (U21241)
posted 15 minutes ago
Any goal that comes via a through ball or flick on hasn't been the same since VAR was introduced. You can't fully celebrate it until it's cleared. It's a huge issue for me and why technology works better in some sports than it does in others.
Scrap it. Football was more enjoyable without VAR.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I agree with you.
Not often I say that.
posted on 15/5/24
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 16 minutes ago
Is Cinci a shareholder at Wolves then?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Was thinking that. So precious.
posted on 15/5/24
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 54 seconds ago
The handball rule is an absolute farce, but I don't think it's because it's too complicated.
I think it's because in essence, it's supposed to prevent players from using their hands/arms to manipulate the play to their advantage.
IFAB has tried to be much too clever with this, trying to establish a set of conditions in which that intentionality can be evinced, but ave made a pig's dinner of it with the whole 'unnatural' position concept.
There are plenty of situations where you arms spread out away from the body as part of your natural balance.
I've seen penalties given where a player's been barged from behind mid-leap with a ball incoming. It's 100% natural for the arms to open out as the brain instinctively seeks to regain its centre of gravity, but the ball's hit the player on the arm and he's been punished with a penalty for it.
I think it's more a case that there are simply situations where it has to be down to the ref's discretion to make the call. That goes for many 'soft' fouls too.
Everyone's going to have a different opinion, but in the end the reason there's a ref is because someone has to be trusted to make unbiased rulings on the play.
VAR should be there to offer the ref the help he might need to reach a fair decision when things are unclear, when his vision's been blocked, or things have happened too fast for him to be able to appreciate them in real time.
The key issue is that the governing bodies have sought to legislate for every single situation, and taken more power out of the hands of the ref than they should have, diminishing their authority in the process.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sadly, too many idiots on here will argue that we can’t rely on interpretation and it has to be consistent, etc etc.
9 times out of 10, most normal people can agree with the player deliberately tried to affect the ball with his arms.
posted on 15/5/24
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 1 minute ago
The handball rule is an absolute farce, but I don't think it's because it's too complicated.
I think it's because in essence, it's supposed to prevent players from using their hands/arms to manipulate the play to their advantage.
IFAB has tried to be much too clever with this, trying to establish a set of conditions in which that intentionality can be evinced, but ave made a pig's dinner of it with the whole 'unnatural' position concept.
There are plenty of situations where you arms spread out away from the body as part of your natural balance.
I've seen penalties given where a player's been barged from behind mid-leap with a ball incoming. It's 100% natural for the arms to open out as the brain instinctively seeks to regain its centre of gravity, but the ball's hit the player on the arm and he's been punished with a penalty for it.
I think it's more a case that there are simply situations where it has to be down to the ref's discretion to make the call. That goes for many 'soft' fouls too.
Everyone's going to have a different opinion, but in the end the reason there's a ref is because someone has to be trusted to make unbiased rulings on the play.
VAR should be there to offer the ref the help he might need to reach a fair decision when things are unclear, when his vision's been blocked, or things have happened too fast for him to be able to appreciate them in real time.
The key issue is that the governing bodies have sought to legislate for every single situation, and taken more power out of the hands of the ref than they should have, diminishing their authority in the process.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Agree with all of this. As you know, what is given for handballs and penalties nowadays boils my piiiiiiss. And it’s the governing bodies enabling cheating and stupid decisions by the officials that have ruined it.
posted on 15/5/24
This is absolutely not the way forward. Facking hell.
posted on 15/5/24
I don't like it. Get rid.
posted on 15/5/24
comment by Boris 'Inky’ Gibson (U5901)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Glazers Out (SE85) (U21241)
posted 15 minutes ago
Any goal that comes via a through ball or flick on hasn't been the same since VAR was introduced. You can't fully celebrate it until it's cleared. It's a huge issue for me and why technology works better in some sports than it does in others.
Scrap it. Football was more enjoyable without VAR.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I agree with you.
Not often I say that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's not true. We agree on a lot of things.
You just don't agree with me on one particular high profile topic. 😂
posted on 15/5/24
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 18 minutes ago
comment by it'sonlyagame (U6426)
posted 54 seconds ago
The handball rule is an absolute farce, but I don't think it's because it's too complicated.
I think it's because in essence, it's supposed to prevent players from using their hands/arms to manipulate the play to their advantage.
IFAB has tried to be much too clever with this, trying to establish a set of conditions in which that intentionality can be evinced, but ave made a pig's dinner of it with the whole 'unnatural' position concept.
There are plenty of situations where you arms spread out away from the body as part of your natural balance.
I've seen penalties given where a player's been barged from behind mid-leap with a ball incoming. It's 100% natural for the arms to open out as the brain instinctively seeks to regain its centre of gravity, but the ball's hit the player on the arm and he's been punished with a penalty for it.
I think it's more a case that there are simply situations where it has to be down to the ref's discretion to make the call. That goes for many 'soft' fouls too.
Everyone's going to have a different opinion, but in the end the reason there's a ref is because someone has to be trusted to make unbiased rulings on the play.
VAR should be there to offer the ref the help he might need to reach a fair decision when things are unclear, when his vision's been blocked, or things have happened too fast for him to be able to appreciate them in real time.
The key issue is that the governing bodies have sought to legislate for every single situation, and taken more power out of the hands of the ref than they should have, diminishing their authority in the process.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sadly, too many idiots on here will argue that we can’t rely on interpretation and it has to be consistent, etc etc.
9 times out of 10, most normal people can agree with the player deliberately tried to affect the ball with his arms.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I do simultaneously think that there's often a high degree of inconsistency though. I just don't trust interested parties (fans of either side, fans invested because their club has some skin in the game, or fans who simply feel strongly about one of the sides/players involved).
Madrid had a game against Almería this season where not even a partisan fan like myself could deny that something was awry.
Turned out Madrid had long felt aggrieved by decisions made by this particular ref, and had run a week long campaign highlighting every big call they felt he'd given against them down the years. It didn't help that he'd gone on record when he was still starting out saying he was a Barça fan.
It seems likely they got into his head, because some of the calls he made that day were just inexplicably bad.
Generally though, it's easier to observe when it isn't your team involved. From that perspective, watching PL highlights this season, where I'm not really all that concerned by the outcome, some of the decisions where refs have had the benefit of being able to review the footage have left me well and truly baffled.
It's still only a small minority of all decisions though.
posted on 15/5/24
I agree about consistency.
But ultimately, we can’t have consistency. It’s impossible.
posted on 15/5/24
In 2018 or whichever year it was before VAR was introduced, most people were convinced that VAR would destroy Liverpool.
They won the league i think the following season.
So I am all for scrapping it.
posted on 15/5/24
It basically comes down to whether you want to have potentially tens of millions worth of decisions made by humans and continue to accept that some errors will be made (charm of the game).
Or fully lean on technology which in the long run will be perfected in conjunction with future rule changes to make situations black or white judgeable by AI.
Personally, after the Henry handball, some World Cup howlers by refs, I'm done with 'charm of the game' even if teams I supported/liked to watch profited most from them. On the other hand I wouldn't mind the FA being the only one to dismiss the VAR and just watch the Prem as a Mickey Mouse sh1tshow as long as they keep it in the CL/WC/EC's
Page 1 of 3