No.. don't think it's make or break I think Ange is here for the long term. Given how long it took us to replace Conte I don't think Spurs & working for Levy is viewed as a top job for the best managers.
I think for Levy's own credibility you can't sack Ange after 18 months after high profile & ugly departures of Conte and Jose.
I think Ange has got a job that his CV probably didn't warrant and not he's gotta back up the talk/hype
Levy needs to stay in the background for his and the clubs good.
Whether Ange is the right guy ?... Jury's out. I suspect not.... He's had a year, spent a lot money... He gonna need more than "all out attack" to justify the hire
comment by Diamondlights (U20501)
posted 4 minutes ago
No.. don't think it's make or break I think Ange is here for the long term. Given how long it took us to replace Conte I don't think Spurs & working for Levy is viewed as a top job for the best managers.
I think for Levy's own credibility you can't sack Ange after 18 months after high profile & ugly departures of Conte and Jose.
I think Ange has got a job that his CV probably didn't warrant and not he's gotta back up the talk/hype
Levy needs to stay in the background for his and the clubs good.
Whether Ange is the right guy ?... Jury's out. I suspect not.... He's had a year, spent a lot money... He gonna need more than "all out attack" to justify the hire
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Levy historically hasn't been so forgiving when top 4 has looked a long way off, particularly into a second season. AVB and Jose were let go of in their second seasons when we were in 7th. Perhaps you are right that he is changing his ways with Ange and giving him enough time to make his mark as possible, similar with Arteta at Arsenal. He has already given him the backing that other managers may have wished for
comment by Hengy (U9129)
posted 47 minutes ago
No
----------------------------------------------------------------------
But should be.
So obvious he ain’t the one, and clearly out of his depth at this level, but I guess we’ll just string it out a few more weeks/months to delay the inevitable.
comment by Automatic For The People (U21889)
posted 3 minutes ago
So obvious he ain’t the one, and clearly out of his depth at this level, but I guess we’ll just string it out a few more weeks/months to delay the inevitable.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well this is it isn't it, if he is the out of depth manager some people think, I expect this run of games won't do him any favours. If he does have something about him then you would expect us to give a good account of ourselves in this run of games.
With Solanke back we can see if he is the difference maker in games like the one against Newcastle where we have dominant spells and no real striker to capitalise. Didn't really work against Leicester but he might still be finding his feet at a new club.
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Automatic For The People (U21889)
posted 3 minutes ago
So obvious he ain’t the one, and clearly out of his depth at this level, but I guess we’ll just string it out a few more weeks/months to delay the inevitable.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well this is it isn't it, if he is the out of depth manager some people think, I expect this run of games won't do him any favours. If he does have something about him then you would expect us to give a good account of ourselves in this run of games.
With Solanke back we can see if he is the difference maker in games like the one against Newcastle where we have dominant spells and no real striker to capitalise. Didn't really work against Leicester but he might still be finding his feet at a new club.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not trying to be too negative and have barely posted, but as others have noted we’re just carrying over the $hite form from the second half of last season and it isn’t good enough.
No. Tottenham Hotspur have had 14 permanent managers since enic took ownership of the club in 2001.
That's approx a new coach every 20 months. That's silly and smacks of no long term strategy. Maybe we need to back the current coach and be patient.
I have faith that the club are doing everything they can🙏
I dont think so, most people in the real world aren't the same as the supporters on the forum. Match going fans - especially the away support - are pro-Ange.
The club are also aware that their investment went towards longer term players so it will take something drastic to lose faith in him
yeah whether we like the strategy or not we have to believe there is one and everyone is pulling together. ripping things up and starting all over so often doesnt help anything
saying that if we are bottom half at christmas its a different story
It would have to be an absolute disaster, like losing all our games for Ange to be anywhere near the sack at this point.
Considering where we have come from, 8th a season ago and no Europe, things are actually on track.
Yes there are issues to solve but season 2 is when you get those things done and start to build on and refine the work done in season 1.
If the results suck and we are going backwards then he's under pressure but he's nowhere near "2 points from 8 games territory".
Poch had 25 pts in 24 games across the end of 18/19 and start 19/20 seasons and no away wins since January when he was sacked in November.
Even with our disappointing end to the season, Ange has 39 in 24 since about Christmas. Its far from a disaster even if its not quite where we want to be.
I think it is make or break yes because a lot of people are not looking at the total form and pick out chunks of performances where we look bright but achieve nothing.
We had 20 shots against Newcastle yet only 6 on target and it was an own goal. Let alone playing Emil Krath at centre back. It was the exact same situation as having Davies/Emerson we should be criticising that we did not get a result. Kamikaze football/playground football is embarasing to watch in the same way it is embarrasing to watch 11 men behind the ball.
We have the toughest league cup draw which will not help situation.
I hand on heart believe in the premier league only Steve Cooper is worse tactically than Big Ange.
I do not want Big Ange gone, i cannot bare another upheavel, writing off another season, being promised we will make you proud.
However at no point have i seen anything to suggest he can change things.
comment by Edinspur (U1109)
posted 15 minutes ago
I dont think so, most people in the real world aren't the same as the supporters on the forum. Match going fans - especially the away support - are pro-Ange.
The club are also aware that their investment went towards longer term players so it will take something drastic to lose faith in him
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I really can't believe the reaction of some fans after just 3 games of the season!
However, whilst for me the answer is "no" it shouldn't be make or break for him over the next month, the reality is that it could be.
If results don't go our way then the negativity that is on display on this forum will be replicated on the terraces and that will make things difficult for Ange (and the team). The last thing that we need/want is a toxic environment.
From my perspective I am encouraged by the team's performances and I expect the results will follow (even against that lot up the road) in a couple of weeks.
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 51 seconds ago
I really can't believe the reaction of some fans after just 3 games of the season!
However, whilst for me the answer is "no" it shouldn't be make or break for him over the next month, the reality is that it could be.
If results don't go our way then the negativity that is on display on this forum will be replicated on the terraces and that will make things difficult for Ange (and the team). The last thing that we need/want is a toxic environment.
From my perspective I am encouraged by the team's performances and I expect the results will follow (even against that lot up the road) in a couple of weeks.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's not just the 3 games though is it? Can't ignore the poor form at the end of last season.
I agree that just 3 games into the season is too early to judge, that's why I think by the time we're in October we'll have had a bigger and testing period with which to assess how we're doing.
Fans might say now they're happy to give him time and that it's not a make or break moment but it will be interesting to see the reactions of these same people, if by the time we play Brighton we have lost 3 more games, suffered a pen shoot out exit to Coventry etc. That might be worst case scenario but when compared to the form of end of last season, not wholly unrealistic either.
I don’t take issue with Ange. He’s working with what he’s been given. A whole stream of experienced lads have been replaced by kids in order to get the wage bill down. Over the next month, that thin squad is going to get severely tested with games every 3 days. The fact that we’re so ill-prepared for a push on four fronts is down to one man and one man only, Daniel Levy. I don’t care whether it’s Ange, Pep, Klopp, Ferguson or Bill Shankly from the grave. No one is going to be able to compete without adequate financial backing.
Wage bill outlay across the history of the premier league is the best indicator of where you’ll finish. The best players earn the most and therefore see more success. In turn, the less you pay, the lower down you’ll finish. This isn’t about Ange. Our wage bill is now lower than Brighton’s and apparently it’s not about to slow down. I think we’ll finish between 7th-10th this year and none of that will be down to Ange.
anyone predicting/ putting money on Spurs to beat Arsenal ?
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 51 seconds ago
I really can't believe the reaction of some fans after just 3 games of the season!
However, whilst for me the answer is "no" it shouldn't be make or break for him over the next month, the reality is that it could be.
If results don't go our way then the negativity that is on display on this forum will be replicated on the terraces and that will make things difficult for Ange (and the team). The last thing that we need/want is a toxic environment.
From my perspective I am encouraged by the team's performances and I expect the results will follow (even against that lot up the road) in a couple of weeks.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's not just the 3 games though is it? Can't ignore the poor form at the end of last season.
I agree that just 3 games into the season is too early to judge, that's why I think by the time we're in October we'll have had a bigger and testing period with which to assess how we're doing.
Fans might say now they're happy to give him time and that it's not a make or break moment but it will be interesting to see the reactions of these same people, if by the time we play Brighton we have lost 3 more games, suffered a pen shoot out exit to Coventry etc. That might be worst case scenario but when compared to the form of end of last season, not wholly unrealistic either.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think our "form" has been much much better over the last three games than at the end of last season. The only difference is we have not got the results our performances have deserved.
Granted there have been individual errors (Romero) and bad finishing, but overall our form is very encouraging.
Newcastle would admit that they got away with one on Sunday (so too Leicester, if they are being honest). And I think that lot up the road will be very wary of playing us on current form. Let's just pray that our players come back from the international break unscathed.
Personally I cant see it. I think it will be a good game and a tight loss. They will come to play and that might actually help us. Will probably get a good performance from Romero (who'll be busy defending and not standing on the half way line. The fact Arsenal will attack will allow us to use our pace (Son & Odobert) on the break. Hopefully a more open game will give the likes of Madders room to play. Sadly I dont think we are clinical enough to trouble that back 4 despite Rice missing.
If Ange doubles down and goes all out attack with just Biss in that 4141 formation I think we'll get hammered but I think this might be the game he finally dials it back to save an embarrassment. I think he'll start Gray alongside Biss
*****************Vic*******************
***PP***Cuti***VDV*****Udogie***
**********Gray*****Biss******
****Odobert***Madders****Son***
************Solanke*********
2-1 Arsenal
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 51 seconds ago
I really can't believe the reaction of some fans after just 3 games of the season!
However, whilst for me the answer is "no" it shouldn't be make or break for him over the next month, the reality is that it could be.
If results don't go our way then the negativity that is on display on this forum will be replicated on the terraces and that will make things difficult for Ange (and the team). The last thing that we need/want is a toxic environment.
From my perspective I am encouraged by the team's performances and I expect the results will follow (even against that lot up the road) in a couple of weeks.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's not just the 3 games though is it? Can't ignore the poor form at the end of last season.
I agree that just 3 games into the season is too early to judge, that's why I think by the time we're in October we'll have had a bigger and testing period with which to assess how we're doing.
Fans might say now they're happy to give him time and that it's not a make or break moment but it will be interesting to see the reactions of these same people, if by the time we play Brighton we have lost 3 more games, suffered a pen shoot out exit to Coventry etc. That might be worst case scenario but when compared to the form of end of last season, not wholly unrealistic either.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think our "form" has been much much better over the last three games than at the end of last season. The only difference is we have not got the results our performances have deserved.
Granted there have been individual errors (Romero) and bad finishing, but overall our form is very encouraging.
Newcastle would admit that they got away with one on Sunday (so too Leicester, if they are being honest). And I think that lot up the road will be very wary of playing us on current form. Let's just pray that our players come back from the international break unscathed.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Isn't our Form defined by the outcome of the game ? Anything else is just an opinion
comment by Diamondlights (U20501)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 51 seconds ago
I really can't believe the reaction of some fans after just 3 games of the season!
However, whilst for me the answer is "no" it shouldn't be make or break for him over the next month, the reality is that it could be.
If results don't go our way then the negativity that is on display on this forum will be replicated on the terraces and that will make things difficult for Ange (and the team). The last thing that we need/want is a toxic environment.
From my perspective I am encouraged by the team's performances and I expect the results will follow (even against that lot up the road) in a couple of weeks.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's not just the 3 games though is it? Can't ignore the poor form at the end of last season.
I agree that just 3 games into the season is too early to judge, that's why I think by the time we're in October we'll have had a bigger and testing period with which to assess how we're doing.
Fans might say now they're happy to give him time and that it's not a make or break moment but it will be interesting to see the reactions of these same people, if by the time we play Brighton we have lost 3 more games, suffered a pen shoot out exit to Coventry etc. That might be worst case scenario but when compared to the form of end of last season, not wholly unrealistic either.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think our "form" has been much much better over the last three games than at the end of last season. The only difference is we have not got the results our performances have deserved.
Granted there have been individual errors (Romero) and bad finishing, but overall our form is very encouraging.
Newcastle would admit that they got away with one on Sunday (so too Leicester, if they are being honest). And I think that lot up the road will be very wary of playing us on current form. Let's just pray that our players come back from the international break unscathed.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Isn't our Form defined by the outcome of the game ? Anything else is just an opinion
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes, results are key. I don't dispute that.
But I also remember the start of the 22/23 season under Conte when we were winning games (and were top of the league), but most Spurs fans were saying that the performances were dreadful and that the results were flattering us. They were right and the wheels came off.
It feels like the reverse to me this season. But that's just my opinion.
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 20 minutes ago
I don’t take issue with Ange. He’s working with what he’s been given. A whole stream of experienced lads have been replaced by kids in order to get the wage bill down. Over the next month, that thin squad is going to get severely tested with games every 3 days. The fact that we’re so ill-prepared for a push on four fronts is down to one man and one man only, Daniel Levy. I don’t care whether it’s Ange, Pep, Klopp, Ferguson or Bill Shankly from the grave. No one is going to be able to compete without adequate financial backing.
Wage bill outlay across the history of the premier league is the best indicator of where you’ll finish. The best players earn the most and therefore see more success. In turn, the less you pay, the lower down you’ll finish. This isn’t about Ange. Our wage bill is now lower than Brighton’s and apparently it’s not about to slow down. I think we’ll finish between 7th-10th this year and none of that will be down to Ange.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The idea that a manager can only work with what he's given can only be used in his defence if he didn't in part want a lot of these players he's been given. The fact is he did. Weren't Solanke and BJ earmarked by him for signing? I accept that he and we may have wanted other players to help strengthen in areas but the man has been given in excess of £300m to spend in 3 windows. He's spent almost the equivalent of what Poch spent in 11 windows.
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Diamondlights (U20501)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 51 seconds ago
I really can't believe the reaction of some fans after just 3 games of the season!
However, whilst for me the answer is "no" it shouldn't be make or break for him over the next month, the reality is that it could be.
If results don't go our way then the negativity that is on display on this forum will be replicated on the terraces and that will make things difficult for Ange (and the team). The last thing that we need/want is a toxic environment.
From my perspective I am encouraged by the team's performances and I expect the results will follow (even against that lot up the road) in a couple of weeks.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's not just the 3 games though is it? Can't ignore the poor form at the end of last season.
I agree that just 3 games into the season is too early to judge, that's why I think by the time we're in October we'll have had a bigger and testing period with which to assess how we're doing.
Fans might say now they're happy to give him time and that it's not a make or break moment but it will be interesting to see the reactions of these same people, if by the time we play Brighton we have lost 3 more games, suffered a pen shoot out exit to Coventry etc. That might be worst case scenario but when compared to the form of end of last season, not wholly unrealistic either.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think our "form" has been much much better over the last three games than at the end of last season. The only difference is we have not got the results our performances have deserved.
Granted there have been individual errors (Romero) and bad finishing, but overall our form is very encouraging.
Newcastle would admit that they got away with one on Sunday (so too Leicester, if they are being honest). And I think that lot up the road will be very wary of playing us on current form. Let's just pray that our players come back from the international break unscathed.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Isn't our Form defined by the outcome of the game ? Anything else is just an opinion
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes, results are key. I don't dispute that.
But I also remember the start of the 22/23 season under Conte when we were winning games (and were top of the league), but most Spurs fans were saying that the performances were dreadful and that the results were flattering us. They were right and the wheels came off.
It feels like the reverse to me this season. But that's just my opinion.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I hear ya but I think you have to be careful making excuses for a team that doesn't win anything and doesn't have a winning culture. Man City playing well but not getting the result is one thing coz you know they will get their shlt together.... Thats not Spurs..... Im all for Optimism and having faith but you gotta put it in context with whats right in front of you.
Spurs form dating back to last season is woeful, Solanke aint Haaland and we we've signed 2 kids who Ange is not starting. The rest of the team, the manager, the tactics and the results are the same.
All Im saying is how long can you take Ange seriously when he keeps calling it a process and everyone has to buy in. If thats not working.... Isn't it down to Ange to do something different ?.... Thats what we are paying him for !
If Spurs cant play like Celtic in a pub league with the competition we have in the PL then he has to change because so far (to go from 1st to 5th and play like crap makes him a failure).... as you said, its about results... nothing else
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Diamondlights (U20501)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 51 seconds ago
I really can't believe the reaction of some fans after just 3 games of the season!
However, whilst for me the answer is "no" it shouldn't be make or break for him over the next month, the reality is that it could be.
If results don't go our way then the negativity that is on display on this forum will be replicated on the terraces and that will make things difficult for Ange (and the team). The last thing that we need/want is a toxic environment.
From my perspective I am encouraged by the team's performances and I expect the results will follow (even against that lot up the road) in a couple of weeks.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's not just the 3 games though is it? Can't ignore the poor form at the end of last season.
I agree that just 3 games into the season is too early to judge, that's why I think by the time we're in October we'll have had a bigger and testing period with which to assess how we're doing.
Fans might say now they're happy to give him time and that it's not a make or break moment but it will be interesting to see the reactions of these same people, if by the time we play Brighton we have lost 3 more games, suffered a pen shoot out exit to Coventry etc. That might be worst case scenario but when compared to the form of end of last season, not wholly unrealistic either.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think our "form" has been much much better over the last three games than at the end of last season. The only difference is we have not got the results our performances have deserved.
Granted there have been individual errors (Romero) and bad finishing, but overall our form is very encouraging.
Newcastle would admit that they got away with one on Sunday (so too Leicester, if they are being honest). And I think that lot up the road will be very wary of playing us on current form. Let's just pray that our players come back from the international break unscathed.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Isn't our Form defined by the outcome of the game ? Anything else is just an opinion
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes, results are key. I don't dispute that.
But I also remember the start of the 22/23 season under Conte when we were winning games (and were top of the league), but most Spurs fans were saying that the performances were dreadful and that the results were flattering us. They were right and the wheels came off.
It feels like the reverse to me this season. But that's just my opinion.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You might be right and with Conte the results eventually caught up with performances. As I said in my OP, if we are still showing dominant performances yet the results still haven't caught up after so many games, then I'd say there's more to it than us just being unlucky and there is a problem within the team, something we are doing wrong.
If we aren't producing the necessary results time and time again, then performances are largely irrelevant. Results will always be the fundamental part of a team's form.
Sign in if you want to comment
Is the next month make or break for Ange?
Page 1 of 4
posted on 3/9/24
No
posted on 3/9/24
No.. don't think it's make or break I think Ange is here for the long term. Given how long it took us to replace Conte I don't think Spurs & working for Levy is viewed as a top job for the best managers.
I think for Levy's own credibility you can't sack Ange after 18 months after high profile & ugly departures of Conte and Jose.
I think Ange has got a job that his CV probably didn't warrant and not he's gotta back up the talk/hype
Levy needs to stay in the background for his and the clubs good.
Whether Ange is the right guy ?... Jury's out. I suspect not.... He's had a year, spent a lot money... He gonna need more than "all out attack" to justify the hire
posted on 3/9/24
comment by Diamondlights (U20501)
posted 4 minutes ago
No.. don't think it's make or break I think Ange is here for the long term. Given how long it took us to replace Conte I don't think Spurs & working for Levy is viewed as a top job for the best managers.
I think for Levy's own credibility you can't sack Ange after 18 months after high profile & ugly departures of Conte and Jose.
I think Ange has got a job that his CV probably didn't warrant and not he's gotta back up the talk/hype
Levy needs to stay in the background for his and the clubs good.
Whether Ange is the right guy ?... Jury's out. I suspect not.... He's had a year, spent a lot money... He gonna need more than "all out attack" to justify the hire
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Levy historically hasn't been so forgiving when top 4 has looked a long way off, particularly into a second season. AVB and Jose were let go of in their second seasons when we were in 7th. Perhaps you are right that he is changing his ways with Ange and giving him enough time to make his mark as possible, similar with Arteta at Arsenal. He has already given him the backing that other managers may have wished for
posted on 3/9/24
Definitely not
posted on 3/9/24
comment by Hengy (U9129)
posted 47 minutes ago
No
----------------------------------------------------------------------
But should be.
posted on 3/9/24
So obvious he ain’t the one, and clearly out of his depth at this level, but I guess we’ll just string it out a few more weeks/months to delay the inevitable.
posted on 3/9/24
comment by Automatic For The People (U21889)
posted 3 minutes ago
So obvious he ain’t the one, and clearly out of his depth at this level, but I guess we’ll just string it out a few more weeks/months to delay the inevitable.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well this is it isn't it, if he is the out of depth manager some people think, I expect this run of games won't do him any favours. If he does have something about him then you would expect us to give a good account of ourselves in this run of games.
With Solanke back we can see if he is the difference maker in games like the one against Newcastle where we have dominant spells and no real striker to capitalise. Didn't really work against Leicester but he might still be finding his feet at a new club.
posted on 3/9/24
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Automatic For The People (U21889)
posted 3 minutes ago
So obvious he ain’t the one, and clearly out of his depth at this level, but I guess we’ll just string it out a few more weeks/months to delay the inevitable.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well this is it isn't it, if he is the out of depth manager some people think, I expect this run of games won't do him any favours. If he does have something about him then you would expect us to give a good account of ourselves in this run of games.
With Solanke back we can see if he is the difference maker in games like the one against Newcastle where we have dominant spells and no real striker to capitalise. Didn't really work against Leicester but he might still be finding his feet at a new club.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not trying to be too negative and have barely posted, but as others have noted we’re just carrying over the $hite form from the second half of last season and it isn’t good enough.
posted on 3/9/24
No. Tottenham Hotspur have had 14 permanent managers since enic took ownership of the club in 2001.
That's approx a new coach every 20 months. That's silly and smacks of no long term strategy. Maybe we need to back the current coach and be patient.
I have faith that the club are doing everything they can🙏
posted on 3/9/24
I dont think so, most people in the real world aren't the same as the supporters on the forum. Match going fans - especially the away support - are pro-Ange.
The club are also aware that their investment went towards longer term players so it will take something drastic to lose faith in him
posted on 3/9/24
yeah whether we like the strategy or not we have to believe there is one and everyone is pulling together. ripping things up and starting all over so often doesnt help anything
saying that if we are bottom half at christmas its a different story
posted on 3/9/24
It would have to be an absolute disaster, like losing all our games for Ange to be anywhere near the sack at this point.
Considering where we have come from, 8th a season ago and no Europe, things are actually on track.
Yes there are issues to solve but season 2 is when you get those things done and start to build on and refine the work done in season 1.
If the results suck and we are going backwards then he's under pressure but he's nowhere near "2 points from 8 games territory".
Poch had 25 pts in 24 games across the end of 18/19 and start 19/20 seasons and no away wins since January when he was sacked in November.
Even with our disappointing end to the season, Ange has 39 in 24 since about Christmas. Its far from a disaster even if its not quite where we want to be.
posted on 3/9/24
I think it is make or break yes because a lot of people are not looking at the total form and pick out chunks of performances where we look bright but achieve nothing.
We had 20 shots against Newcastle yet only 6 on target and it was an own goal. Let alone playing Emil Krath at centre back. It was the exact same situation as having Davies/Emerson we should be criticising that we did not get a result. Kamikaze football/playground football is embarasing to watch in the same way it is embarrasing to watch 11 men behind the ball.
We have the toughest league cup draw which will not help situation.
I hand on heart believe in the premier league only Steve Cooper is worse tactically than Big Ange.
I do not want Big Ange gone, i cannot bare another upheavel, writing off another season, being promised we will make you proud.
However at no point have i seen anything to suggest he can change things.
posted on 3/9/24
comment by Edinspur (U1109)
posted 15 minutes ago
I dont think so, most people in the real world aren't the same as the supporters on the forum. Match going fans - especially the away support - are pro-Ange.
The club are also aware that their investment went towards longer term players so it will take something drastic to lose faith in him
----------------------------------------------------------------------
posted on 3/9/24
I really can't believe the reaction of some fans after just 3 games of the season!
However, whilst for me the answer is "no" it shouldn't be make or break for him over the next month, the reality is that it could be.
If results don't go our way then the negativity that is on display on this forum will be replicated on the terraces and that will make things difficult for Ange (and the team). The last thing that we need/want is a toxic environment.
From my perspective I am encouraged by the team's performances and I expect the results will follow (even against that lot up the road) in a couple of weeks.
posted on 3/9/24
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 51 seconds ago
I really can't believe the reaction of some fans after just 3 games of the season!
However, whilst for me the answer is "no" it shouldn't be make or break for him over the next month, the reality is that it could be.
If results don't go our way then the negativity that is on display on this forum will be replicated on the terraces and that will make things difficult for Ange (and the team). The last thing that we need/want is a toxic environment.
From my perspective I am encouraged by the team's performances and I expect the results will follow (even against that lot up the road) in a couple of weeks.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's not just the 3 games though is it? Can't ignore the poor form at the end of last season.
I agree that just 3 games into the season is too early to judge, that's why I think by the time we're in October we'll have had a bigger and testing period with which to assess how we're doing.
Fans might say now they're happy to give him time and that it's not a make or break moment but it will be interesting to see the reactions of these same people, if by the time we play Brighton we have lost 3 more games, suffered a pen shoot out exit to Coventry etc. That might be worst case scenario but when compared to the form of end of last season, not wholly unrealistic either.
posted on 3/9/24
I don’t take issue with Ange. He’s working with what he’s been given. A whole stream of experienced lads have been replaced by kids in order to get the wage bill down. Over the next month, that thin squad is going to get severely tested with games every 3 days. The fact that we’re so ill-prepared for a push on four fronts is down to one man and one man only, Daniel Levy. I don’t care whether it’s Ange, Pep, Klopp, Ferguson or Bill Shankly from the grave. No one is going to be able to compete without adequate financial backing.
Wage bill outlay across the history of the premier league is the best indicator of where you’ll finish. The best players earn the most and therefore see more success. In turn, the less you pay, the lower down you’ll finish. This isn’t about Ange. Our wage bill is now lower than Brighton’s and apparently it’s not about to slow down. I think we’ll finish between 7th-10th this year and none of that will be down to Ange.
posted on 3/9/24
anyone predicting/ putting money on Spurs to beat Arsenal ?
posted on 3/9/24
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 51 seconds ago
I really can't believe the reaction of some fans after just 3 games of the season!
However, whilst for me the answer is "no" it shouldn't be make or break for him over the next month, the reality is that it could be.
If results don't go our way then the negativity that is on display on this forum will be replicated on the terraces and that will make things difficult for Ange (and the team). The last thing that we need/want is a toxic environment.
From my perspective I am encouraged by the team's performances and I expect the results will follow (even against that lot up the road) in a couple of weeks.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's not just the 3 games though is it? Can't ignore the poor form at the end of last season.
I agree that just 3 games into the season is too early to judge, that's why I think by the time we're in October we'll have had a bigger and testing period with which to assess how we're doing.
Fans might say now they're happy to give him time and that it's not a make or break moment but it will be interesting to see the reactions of these same people, if by the time we play Brighton we have lost 3 more games, suffered a pen shoot out exit to Coventry etc. That might be worst case scenario but when compared to the form of end of last season, not wholly unrealistic either.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think our "form" has been much much better over the last three games than at the end of last season. The only difference is we have not got the results our performances have deserved.
Granted there have been individual errors (Romero) and bad finishing, but overall our form is very encouraging.
Newcastle would admit that they got away with one on Sunday (so too Leicester, if they are being honest). And I think that lot up the road will be very wary of playing us on current form. Let's just pray that our players come back from the international break unscathed.
posted on 3/9/24
Personally I cant see it. I think it will be a good game and a tight loss. They will come to play and that might actually help us. Will probably get a good performance from Romero (who'll be busy defending and not standing on the half way line. The fact Arsenal will attack will allow us to use our pace (Son & Odobert) on the break. Hopefully a more open game will give the likes of Madders room to play. Sadly I dont think we are clinical enough to trouble that back 4 despite Rice missing.
If Ange doubles down and goes all out attack with just Biss in that 4141 formation I think we'll get hammered but I think this might be the game he finally dials it back to save an embarrassment. I think he'll start Gray alongside Biss
*****************Vic*******************
***PP***Cuti***VDV*****Udogie***
**********Gray*****Biss******
****Odobert***Madders****Son***
************Solanke*********
2-1 Arsenal
posted on 3/9/24
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 51 seconds ago
I really can't believe the reaction of some fans after just 3 games of the season!
However, whilst for me the answer is "no" it shouldn't be make or break for him over the next month, the reality is that it could be.
If results don't go our way then the negativity that is on display on this forum will be replicated on the terraces and that will make things difficult for Ange (and the team). The last thing that we need/want is a toxic environment.
From my perspective I am encouraged by the team's performances and I expect the results will follow (even against that lot up the road) in a couple of weeks.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's not just the 3 games though is it? Can't ignore the poor form at the end of last season.
I agree that just 3 games into the season is too early to judge, that's why I think by the time we're in October we'll have had a bigger and testing period with which to assess how we're doing.
Fans might say now they're happy to give him time and that it's not a make or break moment but it will be interesting to see the reactions of these same people, if by the time we play Brighton we have lost 3 more games, suffered a pen shoot out exit to Coventry etc. That might be worst case scenario but when compared to the form of end of last season, not wholly unrealistic either.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think our "form" has been much much better over the last three games than at the end of last season. The only difference is we have not got the results our performances have deserved.
Granted there have been individual errors (Romero) and bad finishing, but overall our form is very encouraging.
Newcastle would admit that they got away with one on Sunday (so too Leicester, if they are being honest). And I think that lot up the road will be very wary of playing us on current form. Let's just pray that our players come back from the international break unscathed.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Isn't our Form defined by the outcome of the game ? Anything else is just an opinion
posted on 3/9/24
comment by Diamondlights (U20501)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 51 seconds ago
I really can't believe the reaction of some fans after just 3 games of the season!
However, whilst for me the answer is "no" it shouldn't be make or break for him over the next month, the reality is that it could be.
If results don't go our way then the negativity that is on display on this forum will be replicated on the terraces and that will make things difficult for Ange (and the team). The last thing that we need/want is a toxic environment.
From my perspective I am encouraged by the team's performances and I expect the results will follow (even against that lot up the road) in a couple of weeks.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's not just the 3 games though is it? Can't ignore the poor form at the end of last season.
I agree that just 3 games into the season is too early to judge, that's why I think by the time we're in October we'll have had a bigger and testing period with which to assess how we're doing.
Fans might say now they're happy to give him time and that it's not a make or break moment but it will be interesting to see the reactions of these same people, if by the time we play Brighton we have lost 3 more games, suffered a pen shoot out exit to Coventry etc. That might be worst case scenario but when compared to the form of end of last season, not wholly unrealistic either.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think our "form" has been much much better over the last three games than at the end of last season. The only difference is we have not got the results our performances have deserved.
Granted there have been individual errors (Romero) and bad finishing, but overall our form is very encouraging.
Newcastle would admit that they got away with one on Sunday (so too Leicester, if they are being honest). And I think that lot up the road will be very wary of playing us on current form. Let's just pray that our players come back from the international break unscathed.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Isn't our Form defined by the outcome of the game ? Anything else is just an opinion
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes, results are key. I don't dispute that.
But I also remember the start of the 22/23 season under Conte when we were winning games (and were top of the league), but most Spurs fans were saying that the performances were dreadful and that the results were flattering us. They were right and the wheels came off.
It feels like the reverse to me this season. But that's just my opinion.
posted on 3/9/24
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 20 minutes ago
I don’t take issue with Ange. He’s working with what he’s been given. A whole stream of experienced lads have been replaced by kids in order to get the wage bill down. Over the next month, that thin squad is going to get severely tested with games every 3 days. The fact that we’re so ill-prepared for a push on four fronts is down to one man and one man only, Daniel Levy. I don’t care whether it’s Ange, Pep, Klopp, Ferguson or Bill Shankly from the grave. No one is going to be able to compete without adequate financial backing.
Wage bill outlay across the history of the premier league is the best indicator of where you’ll finish. The best players earn the most and therefore see more success. In turn, the less you pay, the lower down you’ll finish. This isn’t about Ange. Our wage bill is now lower than Brighton’s and apparently it’s not about to slow down. I think we’ll finish between 7th-10th this year and none of that will be down to Ange.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The idea that a manager can only work with what he's given can only be used in his defence if he didn't in part want a lot of these players he's been given. The fact is he did. Weren't Solanke and BJ earmarked by him for signing? I accept that he and we may have wanted other players to help strengthen in areas but the man has been given in excess of £300m to spend in 3 windows. He's spent almost the equivalent of what Poch spent in 11 windows.
posted on 3/9/24
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Diamondlights (U20501)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 51 seconds ago
I really can't believe the reaction of some fans after just 3 games of the season!
However, whilst for me the answer is "no" it shouldn't be make or break for him over the next month, the reality is that it could be.
If results don't go our way then the negativity that is on display on this forum will be replicated on the terraces and that will make things difficult for Ange (and the team). The last thing that we need/want is a toxic environment.
From my perspective I am encouraged by the team's performances and I expect the results will follow (even against that lot up the road) in a couple of weeks.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's not just the 3 games though is it? Can't ignore the poor form at the end of last season.
I agree that just 3 games into the season is too early to judge, that's why I think by the time we're in October we'll have had a bigger and testing period with which to assess how we're doing.
Fans might say now they're happy to give him time and that it's not a make or break moment but it will be interesting to see the reactions of these same people, if by the time we play Brighton we have lost 3 more games, suffered a pen shoot out exit to Coventry etc. That might be worst case scenario but when compared to the form of end of last season, not wholly unrealistic either.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think our "form" has been much much better over the last three games than at the end of last season. The only difference is we have not got the results our performances have deserved.
Granted there have been individual errors (Romero) and bad finishing, but overall our form is very encouraging.
Newcastle would admit that they got away with one on Sunday (so too Leicester, if they are being honest). And I think that lot up the road will be very wary of playing us on current form. Let's just pray that our players come back from the international break unscathed.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Isn't our Form defined by the outcome of the game ? Anything else is just an opinion
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes, results are key. I don't dispute that.
But I also remember the start of the 22/23 season under Conte when we were winning games (and were top of the league), but most Spurs fans were saying that the performances were dreadful and that the results were flattering us. They were right and the wheels came off.
It feels like the reverse to me this season. But that's just my opinion.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I hear ya but I think you have to be careful making excuses for a team that doesn't win anything and doesn't have a winning culture. Man City playing well but not getting the result is one thing coz you know they will get their shlt together.... Thats not Spurs..... Im all for Optimism and having faith but you gotta put it in context with whats right in front of you.
Spurs form dating back to last season is woeful, Solanke aint Haaland and we we've signed 2 kids who Ange is not starting. The rest of the team, the manager, the tactics and the results are the same.
All Im saying is how long can you take Ange seriously when he keeps calling it a process and everyone has to buy in. If thats not working.... Isn't it down to Ange to do something different ?.... Thats what we are paying him for !
If Spurs cant play like Celtic in a pub league with the competition we have in the PL then he has to change because so far (to go from 1st to 5th and play like crap makes him a failure).... as you said, its about results... nothing else
posted on 3/9/24
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Diamondlights (U20501)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Gezza-Spurs (U18952)
posted 51 seconds ago
I really can't believe the reaction of some fans after just 3 games of the season!
However, whilst for me the answer is "no" it shouldn't be make or break for him over the next month, the reality is that it could be.
If results don't go our way then the negativity that is on display on this forum will be replicated on the terraces and that will make things difficult for Ange (and the team). The last thing that we need/want is a toxic environment.
From my perspective I am encouraged by the team's performances and I expect the results will follow (even against that lot up the road) in a couple of weeks.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's not just the 3 games though is it? Can't ignore the poor form at the end of last season.
I agree that just 3 games into the season is too early to judge, that's why I think by the time we're in October we'll have had a bigger and testing period with which to assess how we're doing.
Fans might say now they're happy to give him time and that it's not a make or break moment but it will be interesting to see the reactions of these same people, if by the time we play Brighton we have lost 3 more games, suffered a pen shoot out exit to Coventry etc. That might be worst case scenario but when compared to the form of end of last season, not wholly unrealistic either.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think our "form" has been much much better over the last three games than at the end of last season. The only difference is we have not got the results our performances have deserved.
Granted there have been individual errors (Romero) and bad finishing, but overall our form is very encouraging.
Newcastle would admit that they got away with one on Sunday (so too Leicester, if they are being honest). And I think that lot up the road will be very wary of playing us on current form. Let's just pray that our players come back from the international break unscathed.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Isn't our Form defined by the outcome of the game ? Anything else is just an opinion
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes, results are key. I don't dispute that.
But I also remember the start of the 22/23 season under Conte when we were winning games (and were top of the league), but most Spurs fans were saying that the performances were dreadful and that the results were flattering us. They were right and the wheels came off.
It feels like the reverse to me this season. But that's just my opinion.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You might be right and with Conte the results eventually caught up with performances. As I said in my OP, if we are still showing dominant performances yet the results still haven't caught up after so many games, then I'd say there's more to it than us just being unlucky and there is a problem within the team, something we are doing wrong.
If we aren't producing the necessary results time and time again, then performances are largely irrelevant. Results will always be the fundamental part of a team's form.
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