comment by Robben Amorim (U22716)
posted 13 minutes ago
VC is the type of moron who never watches anything outside of Manchester United and thinks anyone who actually has any knowledge of football outside of his comfort zone must be weird. It’s his insecurity that makes him so negative and honestly it’s facking boring. Filtered for life as he’s such a cancer on the site.
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He's not wrong though. You latch onto something and bang out about it constantly.

It was a no-brainer when he was available for £17m from Coventry.

It's absolutely not a no-brainer to bring in a striker at 60-€70m when we already have one at that price, who is younger and ahead of where Gyokeres was at the same age.

The bigger conundrum for an Amorim Man Utd team is the wing-back positions and the two players in behind the CF. We definitely need a quality LWB as a minimum (Dalot & Mazraoui should suffice as RWB's for now).

I would say Bruno, Amad and Mount can definitely play those roles (though the latter will never get over his injury issues so should probably be written off at this point), which leaves us very light. I imagine Garnacho could play one of them depending on exactly what Amorim wants from those positions. But I'd have thought we definitely need a quality player who can operate both inside and outside equally as well, offer a goal threat, improve the athletic profile of the forward line and create chances. Dare I say we should go in for Kudus in the summer?

Also, filtering is for babies.

It's absolutely not a no-brainer to bring in a striker at 60-€70m when we already have one at that price, who is younger and ahead of where Gyokeres was at the same age.

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This. We aren't in a position to start spending loads more money on players than we do. The technical and athletic level of our squad is below that of City, Liverpool and Arsenal. If we are going to bridge any of the gap between ourselves and the top teams, we need to start getting better ROI on the players we invest in. Buying one prolific striker will improve us, but it won't bridge the gap, and if it costs a large % of our budget, then it will be at the cost of making improvements in other parts of the team. The only way to do this is to keep buying players who are/will become very good at favourable prices.

The same objection applied to buying Harry Kane, and I never saw Robb provide a convincing counter-argument.

comment by Robben Amorim (U22716)
posted 43 minutes ago
VC is the type of moron who never watches anything outside of Manchester United and thinks anyone who actually has any knowledge of football outside of his comfort zone must be weird. It’s his insecurity that makes him so negative and honestly it’s facking boring. Filtered for life as he’s such a cancer on the site.
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How did that comment wind you up so much ffs...it's probably the nicest thing VC has ever said to you

comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 49 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿 JA606 Class Act (U2462)
posted 1 hour, 20 minutes ago
Last season Hojlund got 16 goals in 43 games. Gyökeres, when he was 24, got 22 goals in 50 games in his last season in the Championship.

If Amorim joins, and he's as good a coach as we hope he is, perhaps he can help Hojlund to reach the heights Gyökeres hit last season in Portugal so we don't need to spend 100m to sign him. Hojlund is pretty good when he gets the chances. It's just, at present, he doesn't get too many!
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An absolutely huge point that everyone seems to completely overlook. Hojlund has a good conversion rate. He just doesn't get many chances.

Hopefully the new manager can sort the midfield out and we can start creating more chances. I certainly wouldn't be looking to spend a fortune on a new number 9 before we have seen what Hojlund can do in a functional team.
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I guess the other side of that coin is whether there are deficiencies in Hojlund's movement that prevent him from getting chances. I don't think that's particularly the case, and he's in a team where he's often flanked by wingers who are better at running into space than facilitating. But it's often said that it can be easier to work on the finishing of a player who is good at getting on the end of chances than vice versa.

comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 49 minutes ago
comment by FFS Mike. (U1170)
posted 43 minutes ago
The best way of moving forward as a club is to get a new manager and start buying players that he’s worked with before in that inferior league and knows well.

That can’t fail.
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Its amazing isn't it? ETH gets slated for only buying players he has worked with. New manager comes in and fans demand he signs a player he has worked with.
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To be fair, I think Robb wanted Gyökeres before the Amorim link

comment by BerbaKing11 (U6256)
posted 30 minutes ago
It was a no-brainer when he was available for £17m from Coventry.

It's absolutely not a no-brainer to bring in a striker at 60-€70m when we already have one at that price, who is younger and ahead of where Gyokeres was at the same age.

The bigger conundrum for an Amorim Man Utd team is the wing-back positions and the two players in behind the CF. We definitely need a quality LWB as a minimum (Dalot & Mazraoui should suffice as RWB's for now).

I would say Bruno, Amad and Mount can definitely play those roles (though the latter will never get over his injury issues so should probably be written off at this point), which leaves us very light. I imagine Garnacho could play one of them depending on exactly what Amorim wants from those positions. But I'd have thought we definitely need a quality player who can operate both inside and outside equally as well, offer a goal threat, improve the athletic profile of the forward line and create chances. Dare I say we should go in for Kudus in the summer?

Also, filtering is for babies.
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We should sign more "17 million strikers" than buy a 100 million striker.

I don't think we need another lumbering oaf in all honesty.
We already have 2 of them.
Id rather a short speedy fella, aguero for example.

comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 36 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 49 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿 JA606 Class Act (U2462)
posted 1 hour, 20 minutes ago
Last season Hojlund got 16 goals in 43 games. Gyökeres, when he was 24, got 22 goals in 50 games in his last season in the Championship.

If Amorim joins, and he's as good a coach as we hope he is, perhaps he can help Hojlund to reach the heights Gyökeres hit last season in Portugal so we don't need to spend 100m to sign him. Hojlund is pretty good when he gets the chances. It's just, at present, he doesn't get too many!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
An absolutely huge point that everyone seems to completely overlook. Hojlund has a good conversion rate. He just doesn't get many chances.

Hopefully the new manager can sort the midfield out and we can start creating more chances. I certainly wouldn't be looking to spend a fortune on a new number 9 before we have seen what Hojlund can do in a functional team.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I guess the other side of that coin is whether there are deficiencies in Hojlund's movement that prevent him from getting chances. I don't think that's particularly the case, and he's in a team where he's often flanked by wingers who are better at running into space than facilitating. But it's often said that it can be easier to work on the finishing of a player who is good at getting on the end of chances than vice versa.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

It is something that I have tried to pay attention to when watching us. My impressions last season, certainly in the early part, was that Hojlund was making decent runs and the ball was getting played to him. Rashford was especially guilty of this and you could see the frustration from Hojlund's body language. When Shaw returned to the team and we had a more balanced team, we did start creating a few more chances for Hojlund (not loads) and he had a good scoring run.

I'm not saying that he doesn't need to work on his movement as I am sure that it needs some work. At the same time, I really don't think that it is a huge problem either.

comment by Ali - 🇪🇦 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿 (U1192)
posted 13 minutes ago
I don't think we need another lumbering oaf in all honesty.
We already have 2 of them.
Id rather a short speedy fella, aguero for example.
----------------------------------------------------------------------



Are you including Hojlund in those 2?

comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Ali - 🇪🇦 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿 (U1192)
posted 13 minutes ago
I don't think we need another lumbering oaf in all honesty.
We already have 2 of them.
Id rather a short speedy fella, aguero for example.
----------------------------------------------------------------------



Are you including Hojlund in those 2?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I like Hoilund a lot, he has a lot of skill. The comment was in jest but we need to switch it up a bit. Can't have 3 towers as strikers. Need something different no?

comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 30 minutes ago
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 36 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 49 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿 JA606 Class Act (U2462)
posted 1 hour, 20 minutes ago
Last season Hojlund got 16 goals in 43 games. Gyökeres, when he was 24, got 22 goals in 50 games in his last season in the Championship.

If Amorim joins, and he's as good a coach as we hope he is, perhaps he can help Hojlund to reach the heights Gyökeres hit last season in Portugal so we don't need to spend 100m to sign him. Hojlund is pretty good when he gets the chances. It's just, at present, he doesn't get too many!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
An absolutely huge point that everyone seems to completely overlook. Hojlund has a good conversion rate. He just doesn't get many chances.

Hopefully the new manager can sort the midfield out and we can start creating more chances. I certainly wouldn't be looking to spend a fortune on a new number 9 before we have seen what Hojlund can do in a functional team.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I guess the other side of that coin is whether there are deficiencies in Hojlund's movement that prevent him from getting chances. I don't think that's particularly the case, and he's in a team where he's often flanked by wingers who are better at running into space than facilitating. But it's often said that it can be easier to work on the finishing of a player who is good at getting on the end of chances than vice versa.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

It is something that I have tried to pay attention to when watching us. My impressions last season, certainly in the early part, was that Hojlund was making decent runs and the ball was getting played to him. Rashford was especially guilty of this and you could see the frustration from Hojlund's body language. When Shaw returned to the team and we had a more balanced team, we did start creating a few more chances for Hojlund (not loads) and he had a good scoring run.

I'm not saying that he doesn't need to work on his movement as I am sure that it needs some work. At the same time, I really don't think that it is a huge problem either.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

yeah, I don't see any major deficiencies in his movement either, though I wouldn't class myself as a great judge of these things (as a bit of a static goal hanger myself). I guess there have been more times than I'd have liked when he has made the right move but not quite got to the ball on time / not quite ahead of the defender. I appreciate that this happens to all centre forwards plenty, and also that it's probably not fair to compare him to Garnacho, who seems to have a knack of getting into shooting positions (though less of a knack of finishing them) because it's easier for wide players to get into space.

Speaking of which, is it mad to wonder whether Garnacho might end up playing centrally?

comment by Ali - 🇪🇦 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿 (U1192)
posted 18 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Ali - 🇪🇦 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿 (U1192)
posted 13 minutes ago
I don't think we need another lumbering oaf in all honesty.
We already have 2 of them.
Id rather a short speedy fella, aguero for example.
----------------------------------------------------------------------



Are you including Hojlund in those 2?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I like Hoilund a lot, he has a lot of skill. The comment was in jest but we need to switch it up a bit. Can't have 3 towers as strikers. Need something different no?
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Hojlund is fast. I remember shortly after he signed that he recorded an in-game speed that was only 0.5km slower than our fastest speed in the whole of the previous season - which had been achieved by Rashford.

I really feel that Hojlund has the skillset and physical attributes to be an excellent striker for us. Give him the service and he will be just fine. He is a good finisher.

Below are the top 7 Pl scorers last season and the number of shots/goals they had

Haaland
shots - 121
goals - 27
conversion rate = 22.31%

Palmer
shots - 109
goals - 22
conversion rate = 20.18%

Isak
shots - 78
goals - 21
conversion rate = 26.92%

Foden
shots - 105
goals - 19
conversion rate = 18.09%

Solanke
shots - 109
goals - 19
conversion rate = 17.43 %

Watkins
shots - 107
goals - 19
conversion rate = 17.75%

Salah
shots - 114
goals - 18
conversion rate = 15.79%

Hojlund
shots - 38
goals - 10
conversion rate = 26.31%


Only Isak has a (marginally) better conversion rate.

Rather than worrying about getting a new number 9, we should be working out how to provide the one we already have with more chances. Including coaching him on his movement.

comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 2 hours, 21 minutes ago
comment by Ali - 🇪🇦 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿 (U1192)
posted 18 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Ali - 🇪🇦 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿 (U1192)
posted 13 minutes ago
I don't think we need another lumbering oaf in all honesty.
We already have 2 of them.
Id rather a short speedy fella, aguero for example.
----------------------------------------------------------------------



Are you including Hojlund in those 2?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I like Hoilund a lot, he has a lot of skill. The comment was in jest but we need to switch it up a bit. Can't have 3 towers as strikers. Need something different no?
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Hojlund is fast. I remember shortly after he signed that he recorded an in-game speed that was only 0.5km slower than our fastest speed in the whole of the previous season - which had been achieved by Rashford.

I really feel that Hojlund has the skillset and physical attributes to be an excellent striker for us. Give him the service and he will be just fine. He is a good finisher.

Below are the top 7 Pl scorers last season and the number of shots/goals they had

Haaland
shots - 121
goals - 27
conversion rate = 22.31%

Palmer
shots - 109
goals - 22
conversion rate = 20.18%

Isak
shots - 78
goals - 21
conversion rate = 26.92%

Foden
shots - 105
goals - 19
conversion rate = 18.09%

Solanke
shots - 109
goals - 19
conversion rate = 17.43 %

Watkins
shots - 107
goals - 19
conversion rate = 17.75%

Salah
shots - 114
goals - 18
conversion rate = 15.79%

Hojlund
shots - 38
goals - 10
conversion rate = 26.31%


Only Isak has a (marginally) better conversion rate.

Rather than worrying about getting a new number 9, we should be working out how to provide the one we already have with more chances. Including coaching him on his movement.


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Nunez
shots - 3947
goals - 6

Elvis, you used all these stats when it came to you arguing we shouldn’t sign Toney. Here we are with 8 goals in 9 games. We should certainly have more striking choices than a hit and miss player in Hojlund and a useless player in Zirkhorst who can’t cope with the pace of English football.

Gyokeres is on fire - not just in the Portuguese league but for his national team and in the CL.

But we have invested lots of money in those players recently, so it seems unlikely we’ll go out and spaff stupid money on Gyokeres. You’d imagine that part of his remit is to get more out of the players we currently have, and help gradually build the squad up.

comment by Joshua The King Of Kings Zirkzee (U10026)
posted 3 minutes ago
But we have invested lots of money in those players recently, so it seems unlikely we’ll go out and spaff stupid money on Gyokeres. You’d imagine that part of his remit is to get more out of the players we currently have, and help gradually build the squad up.

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I hear what you’re saying but if you can’t get blood from a stone then the manager - as is always the case when a manager takes over a struggling big club - will be allowed to sign players he needs to get the improvement needed. I very much doubt he’s going to leave somewhere he’s doing well with the chance to manage City if he waited to join a club that isn’t going to give him big money to compete.

It might not be January - fair enough. But no sane manager will hang his reputation on just Hojlund and Zirkhorst. He’s obviously worked wonders with Gyorkeres and if there’s a way to get him to the club - and €60 million is peanuts if we wait until the end of the season - then it’s a no brainer.

€60m? Sporting would want a lot more than that.

I don’t know that much about Amorim, but from what I can gather it’s going to be a number of other areas that he’ll need to fix to get the team functioning in his image.

I’m not sure that it will need to revolve around a striker like Gyokeres given Amorin was successful before he even went to Sporting, but it seems there’s a blueprint for the shape of the team and the style of the defence, midfield and wing backs - looks like there’s been a few different profiles of attackers that have worked under him.

€60 million is his release clause at the end of the season. It’s €100 million if anyone tries to buy him in Jan.

Logically speaking you’d think he’d want to bring in a couple of his players as that always happens and fair enough if so. He’s got another player called Max Araujo who is a left winger/wingback who would be perfect for us as a Shaw replacement. Not just because he’s a good player but also as he knows Ugarte from Uruguay but also as I don’t think he’d cost that much.

Those two players from Sporting would be a huge improvement and we can gradually work on other things.

He should work his magic with the players he has.

We've spent a decade with every manager coming in and bringing in "their players" only to leave and then the next guy does the same. It's why we have a mish mash of mediocrity that suits no one.

INEOS supposedly came in to establish an ethos on the style of football the club is committed to, then buy the players and recruit a manager who fits this.

It's early days for INEOS but the worst thing they can do is recruit players based on who suits the manager, rather than who suits the long-term ethos. It would be an absolute fck up! You might as well bring back Woodward.

I’d be very surprised if he has a release clause that low.

I’d normally agree that United would let managers bring players in they know, but it remains to be seen what things will look like on the transfer front this summer.

Plus it’s not always the case that a manager wants to bring in a player they know from an old club when they’ve been in a smaller league. United do have the money to spend top dollar, after all.

For example, it may be that there’s just better wing backs available on the market than what he’s used at Sporting.

I wouldn’t be opposed to selling one of the strikers we have and signing Gyokeres, but I’m just not sure if we’ll do that. We’ll have to wait and see.

It's early days for INEOS but the worst thing they can do is recruit players based on who suits the manager

———

Ten Hag is the first manager we had (since SAF) who’s gotten the players he wanted and that shouldn’t be the reason we don’t repeat that, it’s just that Ten Hag has terrible taste. Now I agree no manager should have carte Blanche to only sign players on a whim but at the same time you have some players who suit the manager or else you’re handicapping them.

comment by Joshua The King Of Kings Zirkzee (U10026)
posted 14 minutes ago
I’d be very surprised if he has a release clause that low.

I’d normally agree that United would let managers bring players in they know, but it remains to be seen what things will look like on the transfer front this summer.

Plus it’s not always the case that a manager wants to bring in a player they know from an old club when they’ve been in a smaller league. United do have the money to spend top dollar, after all.

For example, it may be that there’s just better wing backs available on the market than what he’s used at Sporting.

I wouldn’t be opposed to selling one of the strikers we have and signing Gyokeres, but I’m just not sure if we’ll do that. We’ll have to wait and see.
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👍

comment by Robben Amorim (U22716)
posted 3 minutes ago
It's early days for INEOS but the worst thing they can do is recruit players based on who suits the manager

———

Ten Hag is the first manager we had (since SAF) who’s gotten the players he wanted and that shouldn’t be the reason we don’t repeat that, it’s just that Ten Hag has terrible taste. Now I agree no manager should have carte Blanche to only sign players on a whim but at the same time you have some players who suit the manager or else you’re handicapping them.


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Van Gaal and Mourhino both bought players they wanted.

For long periods we had a mish mash of players stretching back 3-4 managers.

Then prior to INEOS, the likes of the clueless Murtough just decided to buy who Ten Hag wanted because he was inept and out of his depth at recruitment himself.

It might just have been enough for INEOS to work with had Ten Hag come good. But now he's sacked the last thing we should do, is go with the players Amorim want or we'll just be back to where we were before.

INEOS, Ashworth, the new CEO should all have a strategy based on the style of the football the club is going to commit to. Amorim with some license needs to fit within that and gradually the squad will reflect this. But the players we sign should be provided by Ashworth et al, and the best Amorim should hope for is choose which ones he wants from a selection he's
provided.

Van Gaal and Mourhino both bought players they wanted.
————

Not to the insane extent that Ten Hag received

There of course should be some strategy from the top down as to what players are brought in but if Amorim walks into United this week, looks at his squad and feels - for example - that Gyokeres is much much better than what he’s inherited and a deal can be done then it has to be done. Not some situation where 10 data people sit in a room for 100 days analysing 1000 strikers from around the world and give the manager a list of 50 names to partially choose from. Sometimes the simplest solution is the simplest solution.