Chronic, have you visited the Chelsea board lately? I here some big news was announced yesterday...
I'm not supporting it you mug. You have no idea what colour or creed I am.
Why should he know what is acceptable having lived in Holland. Its a different country to England. Have you been to Spain? Another European country, but they still boo black players over there.
You clearly don't see the bigger picture here. All countries are different when it comes to race. Opinions are different and race is dealt with differently. Now I'm not saying what is better or worse, I'm glad that in this country, racism is not accepted.
Stopping racism is about accepting the differences between races and cultures. Accepting that a black man from Jamaica is no different to a white man from Norway. Culturally they are different and that's where the education comes in. We learn about each other but we can't be expected to know straight away what is acceptable in those countries.
A simple example - a thumbs up sign in this country means ok/fine. In Iran its the equivalent of giving the middle finger. The ok sign in South America refers to homosexulity and is found offensive. In our country both these hand signals are considered fne. You wouldn't be expected ot know these things straight away, why should you, but through education or the odd mistake you'd find out.
What the FA have failed to do here is not accept cultural differences. What Suarez said is acceptable in his country. Black people accept it A friend of mine who is black lived in Brazil for a few years and said that word is used commonly and he had to get used to the idea that it was accepted, and he was never offended by it. THE Fa hjave messed up by confsuing cultutral differences with racism and have therefore trivialised the debate.
Out of the Suarez and Terry sceanrios,m whcih do i think is worse. John Terry with out a doubt. He is born and bred in this country and should know better. Suarez is from a diferent country and we should accept that. That's what makes us a better country than most paces in the world. UNfortunately there are far to many peple who have already thrown the book at him. Suarez is not a racist, yet he has been labelled it because of ignorant people like you Thudd.
So if I go to Spain and called someone a N word just because I saw his friend do it and he laughed its acceptable??
Get over yourself Fatjan
The FA labled him a racist not us
He used a word which is unacceptable and he got banned and fined!
Get over it, we need to kick this out of football for good
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
Sorry, I don't buy it....He knew what he was doing was there to wind him up...and unfortunately for him, he was doing it in a country that doesn't stand for racism anymore.
Spot on
I'm white, and I don't stand for any sort of racism, and I think what the FA has done is spot on!
If this had happened to a Spurs player there would be no way in hell I would defend it!
Oh, i see, now fatjan has decided to tell us what is and isn't racism.
he made a racist remark. be it out of ignorance or malice is irrellevent. he did it, and must now face the punishment for doing it. personally i feel the fact that Liverpool aren't just accepting it and moving on and making sure it never happens again reflects incredibly badly on the club, as they appear to be condoning it.
Yes, he made a mistake - but even mistakes need to be punished when they cause offence.
-----------------
Where exactly did i say that it shouldnt be punished. In fact I said that i don't condone what Suarez said and that he should be punished accordingly.
This was an opportunty for the FA to do something good. What they should have done is banned Suarez for a couple of games, fined him and then sent him on a citizenship course. And then maybe they should have implemeted a strategy where they ask PL teams to educate the foreign players they buy with these citizenship courses.
Instead what they've done is handed out an overly harsh ban which Liverpool are quite rightly going toappeal. Had the ban been 3 or 4 games, Liverpool would have stepped aside and accepted it. But because it was overly harsh they are now in a posiiton where they have to appeal. If they appeal and the FA end up decreasing the ban it makes the FA look inept.
The FA made an example of Suarez due to Blatter's comments, and also what Terry has done. They've made out that they will not accept racism which is quite right but they've gone about it in completely the wrong way.
If this had happened to a Spurs player there would be no way in hell I would defend it!
_________________________________
This is the thing for me. Suarez has been banned for saying words which Evra took as being racist. Who cares what cultural difference there may or may not be. The outcome is that Evra felt it was racist and it was said to him at least 10 times therefore meaning Suarez or whoever it may be in the future should be punished.
Even if my some miracle he thought he wasnt being racist, which just doesnt wash at all, he should have known better to bring colour into his gamesmanship in the first place. He deserves everything he gets and I definitely wouldnt defend a spurs player if the situation occurred at WHL.
BahamasSpur
Liverpool fans and the club are just digging themselves a deeper hole in not accepting the decision. Their stubborness will only serve to further damage their stuttering season and the sooner they accept the ban, the sooner they can move on.
It's just teaching us to suck eggs
-------------
Then why is it you don't know any better? I've read some of your comments here on this matter and you don't seem to have a clue.
Evra speaks Spanish as does Suarez. Suarez spoke to him in Spanish. Porque Negro. Its something that he would have said to a Spanish speaking black man before without it being considered racist.
Suarez should be charged with making a racial slur there is no argument there but cultural differences should be taken into consideration. Otherwise you're undermining the race argument totally. Its about acceptance and education but what the FA have done is shown no acceptance of a word that is acceptable in his own language and culture. I understand that its not accepted in our language, but in Spanish speaking countries the word Negro is the word for the colour black and there are no racial connotations behind it, furthermore it is used with black people and is not found to be offesnive. Does that mean we've got to the point where we can't even say black anymore. Its ridiculous. In my opinion the FA have shown more ingnorance than Suarez, and as a support of anti-racism campaigns I really do believe that they have taken us a few steps backwards.
Suarez has made a mistake, I'm sure lots of pople have made mistakes, I know I have. This should have been dealt with in a completely different way.
All of my black friends don't think this is racist. But some of my white friends do. Strange that the people who should be offended aren't. Another example of white guilt to me.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
In my opinion the FA have shown more ingnorance than Suarez, and as a support of anti-racism campaigns I really do believe that they have taken us a few steps backwards.
-------------------------------------------
i strongly disagree. what they have done is to send out a message clearly that under no circumstances is any racial abuse acceptable.
As i said earlier, even in South America that word/phrase IS racist unless it's used in a particularly friendly way, and it's difficult to see how in the circumstances it could ever be argued he was using it in a particularly friendly way, considering the two of them had been going at it the entire game.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
"Evra speaks Spanish as does Suarez. Suarez spoke to him in Spanish. Porque Negro. Its something that he would have said to a Spanish speaking black man before without it being considered racist."
--------------
So who raised the alarm then?
"All of my black friends don't think this is racist. But some of my white friends do. Strange that the people who should be offended aren't. Another example of white guilt to me."
But Suarez is black, no?
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
But Suarez is black, no?
--------------------------------------
he has one black grandparent.
It's amazing how many "experts" in Spanish there are cropping up these days
Liverpool are a disgrace
Oh right.
It's just that there were swarms of Pool fans on here the other day saying that 'technically he is black' therefore it is acceptable.
Funny how an argument can get twisted to suit them
I'll drink openly while she wears nothing but a thong on the beach, we will then make passionate love in front of the local constabulary.
When he tries to arrest me, I will merely say that this isn't the end of the world in my country and I'll get off, as long he speaks English.
--------------------
Why is it you know that those things aren't allowed in Dubai? Because stupid English people have been and got done for it over there. We've been made aware that these things shouldn't be done over there. And this is my whole point. Its about education. The first person to be arrested in Dubai for showing a bit of skin could probably get away with the ignorance arguement. But everyone else who goes there now knows not to do it.
Suarez was brought up in a culture where the Negro word is not only accepted but is used in everyday life. He didn't know any better. He used it here and is now being labelled a racist for it when there is no proof that he holds any racists beliefs at all.
I'll say it one more time, Suarez shouldn't have used it in this country, but I can also understand why he did and why he didn't think it was wrong.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
So what is your argument, exactly?
Why is a player alluding to the colour of someone's skin on a football pitch or anywhere for that matter?
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
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Suarez/Liverpool fans <doh>
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posted on 22/12/11
Chronic, have you visited the Chelsea board lately? I here some big news was announced yesterday...
posted on 22/12/11
I'm not supporting it you mug. You have no idea what colour or creed I am.
Why should he know what is acceptable having lived in Holland. Its a different country to England. Have you been to Spain? Another European country, but they still boo black players over there.
You clearly don't see the bigger picture here. All countries are different when it comes to race. Opinions are different and race is dealt with differently. Now I'm not saying what is better or worse, I'm glad that in this country, racism is not accepted.
Stopping racism is about accepting the differences between races and cultures. Accepting that a black man from Jamaica is no different to a white man from Norway. Culturally they are different and that's where the education comes in. We learn about each other but we can't be expected to know straight away what is acceptable in those countries.
A simple example - a thumbs up sign in this country means ok/fine. In Iran its the equivalent of giving the middle finger. The ok sign in South America refers to homosexulity and is found offensive. In our country both these hand signals are considered fne. You wouldn't be expected ot know these things straight away, why should you, but through education or the odd mistake you'd find out.
What the FA have failed to do here is not accept cultural differences. What Suarez said is acceptable in his country. Black people accept it A friend of mine who is black lived in Brazil for a few years and said that word is used commonly and he had to get used to the idea that it was accepted, and he was never offended by it. THE Fa hjave messed up by confsuing cultutral differences with racism and have therefore trivialised the debate.
Out of the Suarez and Terry sceanrios,m whcih do i think is worse. John Terry with out a doubt. He is born and bred in this country and should know better. Suarez is from a diferent country and we should accept that. That's what makes us a better country than most paces in the world. UNfortunately there are far to many peple who have already thrown the book at him. Suarez is not a racist, yet he has been labelled it because of ignorant people like you Thudd.
posted on 22/12/11
So if I go to Spain and called someone a N word just because I saw his friend do it and he laughed its acceptable??
Get over yourself Fatjan
The FA labled him a racist not us
He used a word which is unacceptable and he got banned and fined!
Get over it, we need to kick this out of football for good
posted on 22/12/11
Fat Jan Molby
posted on 22/12/11
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 22/12/11
Sorry, I don't buy it....He knew what he was doing was there to wind him up...and unfortunately for him, he was doing it in a country that doesn't stand for racism anymore.
Spot on
I'm white, and I don't stand for any sort of racism, and I think what the FA has done is spot on!
If this had happened to a Spurs player there would be no way in hell I would defend it!
posted on 22/12/11
Oh, i see, now fatjan has decided to tell us what is and isn't racism.
he made a racist remark. be it out of ignorance or malice is irrellevent. he did it, and must now face the punishment for doing it. personally i feel the fact that Liverpool aren't just accepting it and moving on and making sure it never happens again reflects incredibly badly on the club, as they appear to be condoning it.
Yes, he made a mistake - but even mistakes need to be punished when they cause offence.
-----------------
Where exactly did i say that it shouldnt be punished. In fact I said that i don't condone what Suarez said and that he should be punished accordingly.
This was an opportunty for the FA to do something good. What they should have done is banned Suarez for a couple of games, fined him and then sent him on a citizenship course. And then maybe they should have implemeted a strategy where they ask PL teams to educate the foreign players they buy with these citizenship courses.
Instead what they've done is handed out an overly harsh ban which Liverpool are quite rightly going toappeal. Had the ban been 3 or 4 games, Liverpool would have stepped aside and accepted it. But because it was overly harsh they are now in a posiiton where they have to appeal. If they appeal and the FA end up decreasing the ban it makes the FA look inept.
The FA made an example of Suarez due to Blatter's comments, and also what Terry has done. They've made out that they will not accept racism which is quite right but they've gone about it in completely the wrong way.
posted on 22/12/11
If this had happened to a Spurs player there would be no way in hell I would defend it!
_________________________________
This is the thing for me. Suarez has been banned for saying words which Evra took as being racist. Who cares what cultural difference there may or may not be. The outcome is that Evra felt it was racist and it was said to him at least 10 times therefore meaning Suarez or whoever it may be in the future should be punished.
Even if my some miracle he thought he wasnt being racist, which just doesnt wash at all, he should have known better to bring colour into his gamesmanship in the first place. He deserves everything he gets and I definitely wouldnt defend a spurs player if the situation occurred at WHL.
posted on 22/12/11
BahamasSpur
Liverpool fans and the club are just digging themselves a deeper hole in not accepting the decision. Their stubborness will only serve to further damage their stuttering season and the sooner they accept the ban, the sooner they can move on.
posted on 22/12/11
Bahamas
posted on 22/12/11
It's just teaching us to suck eggs
-------------
Then why is it you don't know any better? I've read some of your comments here on this matter and you don't seem to have a clue.
Evra speaks Spanish as does Suarez. Suarez spoke to him in Spanish. Porque Negro. Its something that he would have said to a Spanish speaking black man before without it being considered racist.
Suarez should be charged with making a racial slur there is no argument there but cultural differences should be taken into consideration. Otherwise you're undermining the race argument totally. Its about acceptance and education but what the FA have done is shown no acceptance of a word that is acceptable in his own language and culture. I understand that its not accepted in our language, but in Spanish speaking countries the word Negro is the word for the colour black and there are no racial connotations behind it, furthermore it is used with black people and is not found to be offesnive. Does that mean we've got to the point where we can't even say black anymore. Its ridiculous. In my opinion the FA have shown more ingnorance than Suarez, and as a support of anti-racism campaigns I really do believe that they have taken us a few steps backwards.
Suarez has made a mistake, I'm sure lots of pople have made mistakes, I know I have. This should have been dealt with in a completely different way.
All of my black friends don't think this is racist. But some of my white friends do. Strange that the people who should be offended aren't. Another example of white guilt to me.
posted on 22/12/11
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 22/12/11
In my opinion the FA have shown more ingnorance than Suarez, and as a support of anti-racism campaigns I really do believe that they have taken us a few steps backwards.
-------------------------------------------
i strongly disagree. what they have done is to send out a message clearly that under no circumstances is any racial abuse acceptable.
As i said earlier, even in South America that word/phrase IS racist unless it's used in a particularly friendly way, and it's difficult to see how in the circumstances it could ever be argued he was using it in a particularly friendly way, considering the two of them had been going at it the entire game.
posted on 22/12/11
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 22/12/11
"Evra speaks Spanish as does Suarez. Suarez spoke to him in Spanish. Porque Negro. Its something that he would have said to a Spanish speaking black man before without it being considered racist."
--------------
So who raised the alarm then?
"All of my black friends don't think this is racist. But some of my white friends do. Strange that the people who should be offended aren't. Another example of white guilt to me."
But Suarez is black, no?
posted on 22/12/11
Galvin
posted on 22/12/11
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 22/12/11
But Suarez is black, no?
--------------------------------------
he has one black grandparent.
posted on 22/12/11
It's amazing how many "experts" in Spanish there are cropping up these days
Liverpool are a disgrace
posted on 22/12/11
Oh right.
It's just that there were swarms of Pool fans on here the other day saying that 'technically he is black' therefore it is acceptable.
Funny how an argument can get twisted to suit them
posted on 22/12/11
I'll drink openly while she wears nothing but a thong on the beach, we will then make passionate love in front of the local constabulary.
When he tries to arrest me, I will merely say that this isn't the end of the world in my country and I'll get off, as long he speaks English.
--------------------
Why is it you know that those things aren't allowed in Dubai? Because stupid English people have been and got done for it over there. We've been made aware that these things shouldn't be done over there. And this is my whole point. Its about education. The first person to be arrested in Dubai for showing a bit of skin could probably get away with the ignorance arguement. But everyone else who goes there now knows not to do it.
Suarez was brought up in a culture where the Negro word is not only accepted but is used in everyday life. He didn't know any better. He used it here and is now being labelled a racist for it when there is no proof that he holds any racists beliefs at all.
I'll say it one more time, Suarez shouldn't have used it in this country, but I can also understand why he did and why he didn't think it was wrong.
posted on 22/12/11
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 22/12/11
So what is your argument, exactly?
posted on 22/12/11
Why is a player alluding to the colour of someone's skin on a football pitch or anywhere for that matter?
posted on 22/12/11
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
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