Yeah, not many nations can claim to have a top class striker. Not too long ago you could easily get a top striker in some 2nd tier club but at the moment it is just impossible! That is why I was telling folks on the Arsenal board to expect disappointment if they want "a world class striker"

Is it because the game has changed a bit too much or what?

I actually disagree that there is an 'acute' dearth of top strikers. There is just a bigger group of relatively 'big' clubs and hence it is spread thin.

What there is an acute shortage of worldwide ( and i have been saying this for almost two years now) is 'top centre-backs' and 'top managers'. There is a shortage worldwide.

Agreed, Wump. Look at England's strikers now compared to about 15 years ago.

Not too sure really. Could just be a bad cycle. The number 9 does seen to be dying out a bit, though, because teams want more from their striker nowadays.

To an extent, TRC. But just looking at France, Italy, Holland, England, Germany, Brazil and Spain they have a lack of depth and or quality in the cf position compares to 10-15 years ago.

I actually disagree that there is an 'acute' dearth of top strikers. There is just a bigger group of relatively 'big' clubs and hence it is spread thin.
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I agree with this.

I also agree there's a relative shortage of top drawer CBs, but at the same time I fell the game has evolved in a way it favours attacking play more. Particularly, there seem to be a lot more goals coming from in-cutting wingers, and, just speculating mind you, perhaps the CBs around nowadays weren't developed in their youth to cope with this.

I actually disagree that there is an 'acute' dearth of top strikers. There is just a bigger group of relatively 'big' clubs and hence it is spread thin.
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Now that I disagree. You used to have the likes of Juve, Milan, Inter, Madrid, Valencia, Barcelona, Liverpool, Arsenal, Utd, Chelsea, and that is just to mention the 3 big leagues. Alll those teams had at least 2 quality strikers.

Also, don't you think the lack of quality upfront in the national teams to be just reflecting the situation in the clubs. Remember even that teams used to play 2 upfront and both options were top class with another on the bench. Nowadays, you will be hard pressed to find 5 teams with 2 quality strikers in their ranks.

Interesting point regarding the wingers, ioag.

One of the caveats about looking at past eras is that we look back on player's entire careers, so we tend to put a lot of players in the same bag even though they might not all have been at their peak at the same time.

Nowadays, you wouldn't consider people like Torres or Villa as top strikers, whereas they'd have been in most people's lists not that long ago. In a few years' time, we might well look back and remember them as being top strikers in the late 00s/early '10s.

Agreed, Wump. The list of nations I gave earlier are clearly lacking in the striker department compared to before.

That's true, ioag. I guess a better way of comparing would be to look at the strikers going into world cups, though still having its flaws, as it wouldn't be grouping then by era but by the quality at that time.

One of the caveats about looking at past eras is that we look back on player's entire careers, so we tend to put a lot of players in the same bag even though they might not all have been at their peak at the same time.
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I actually did not overlook that but you raise a good point.

comment by Darren The King Fletcher (U10026)
posted 32 seconds ago
That's true, ioag. I guess a better way of comparing would be to look at the strikers going into world cups, though still having its flaws, as it wouldn't be grouping then by era but by the quality at that time.
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Yeah that will be a great way to look at it.

Like IOAG said, the play these days seems to favour attacking play more. To an extent, though i'd say it mainly favours control more - mainly by possession and by deploying one man up front.

Hence, the surfeit of midfielders ( funnily enough, which my dear United seems to not take advantage of). Looking at the world game, there is both a dearth and depth of top-centre backs.

I think a lot of it is down to two main reasons: tactics and personnel.

Nobody man-marks anymore. Top centre-backs of yesteryear where schooled in the art of man-marking which IMO, raises your defensive skill-set. Even in the PL, which derides 'zonal marking' (or its derivatives); IMO, it is mainly practised in the PL. Just not as rigidly as elsewhere in the continent. 'Zonal marking' raises allayers tactical awareness but does little in cultivate defensive skills.

Also, few teams build from the back anymore. The 'libbers' and their ilk of Beckenbaeur are a rarity and the closest things to them ( David Luiz and Pique) are average defenders at best.

Most teams have a defensive/ sitting midfielder whose mandate is to build up play through the middle or through attacking full backs and hence, less space for central-defenders to step up.

On personnel : You see more and more older center halves sticking around and getting playing time despite declining skills (Rio and Vidic of 2012; ditto Carragher, Puyol, Nesta, Carvalho and Terry of today ) simply because they're better than what's coming through pipeline. The talent pool is simply not there. Looking at English national team, one thing we were good at producing was centre-backs. Now, we have Jagielka, Cahill, Smalling, Jones - who years ago would not even be on the fringes of the national team.

A part of it may have to do with the fact that clubs once sought to develop outstanding athletes into center backs but now prefer to turn them -- where possible -- into fullbacks or midfielders.

Even without looking at eras per say, and just think about it on a surface level. In past eras, was there really a time where many top teams lacked a top striker or two like the situation there is now? I don't think so. For the first time in a long time, Arsenal are missing a top striker, Madrid have one who has his critics to say the least, Barca have none(?), none of the Italian teams can say to possess a top striker really maybe except Napoli with Higuain and Juve with Tevez. These are just a few examples. I am sure there is plenty more.

Absolutely right.

Good post, TRC.

The strength of the league and its style are also something worth considering.

Serie A being a great example. In the 80's and 90's it was probably the strongest league in the world. It had some of the best strikers and cb's in the game.

Of course Italy has typically had a strong affiliation with defence, but their strikers were class as well. Now they're lacking in both departments. But you'd have to say that their defenders also became better as they were being regularly tested by the world's finest, and as a result you could make the point that the strikers would become better for this also.

On the zonal thing I think it's worth considering how it's becoming more and more common as a result of the game not being as physical or dirty, by that I mean tackling is almost becoming illegal, so it favours the attackers.

The great defenders of the past probably wouldn't be able to get away with half of what they did before. So it's not encouraging these attributes, whether that's a good thing or not is another debate, but it could explain why these class of defenders aren't as prevalent.

I think with regards to CBs the game has changed quite a lot! A defender like Luiz would be the perfect modern CB but he has just too low a concentration level and just too erratic.

I think that so much about defending is about performing as a unit and the system of play. Does anyone remember watching John Terry under Villas Boas and he looked League One standard due to the higher line? Yet this season he was the best defender in the league for me.

Even Arsenal, when Steve Bould solidified the defence the defenders became much more highly thought of.

Very true, DTKF and Wumpatrol.

Whilst i agree that a centre-back's game has changed so much these days, but the drop in quality has been a free-fall not a steady stream of decline.

We only have to look back five years ago to see top centre-backs - not to mention the early noughties, 90s and 80s.

I look around and i would struggle to list two top-of-the-line centre backs and even that would be controversial.

You are spot on. The likes of Kompany get overrated in my opinion.

Benatia is the best defender in the World for me, and it now looks like he could be heading to Manchester City!

What I will say is we are in a golden period of midfield players- the majority of them are Spanish though!

Henrik
I do remember Terry under AVB. He was shambolic! Even Vidic used to take a beating against quick strikers when they played a high line. Also, people like to berate Arsenal defenders but I think they are brilliant. Take any penalty-box type CB and play them with an Arsenal style high line and they would be torn apart! Kos = Boss!

What I will say is we are in a golden period of midfield players- the majority of them are Spanish though!

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And German.

Henrik
How has Oliver Torres played for you since you took him. I haven't watched a single Villarreal game since.

Good point about the systems, Henrik.

TRC, yep there has been a sharp decline. Terry is the only one from that period performing at a very high level.