Didnt mercedes confirm that Hamilton's account of what was said was accurate?
Yes sid, thats exactly what they said. But u cant use that as support for ur argument, otherwise ur a hamilton fanboy
That's what's known as "quote mining", where you take one snippet of a longer piece of speech and ignore the context in order to try and prove a point.
If you read Wolff's full comments, you'll see he completely dismisses the idea that Rosberg deliberately crashed. But you're all ignoring that bit for some reason.
Was the collision Rosberg's fault? Yes or No
Could Rosberg have pulled out and avoided contact? Yes or No
Did Rosberg admit that he could have pulled out to avoid contact but didn't in order to prove a point? Yes or No
Simple really.
comment by WTCBU (U13662)
posted 1 minute ago
Was the collision Rosberg's fault? Yes or No
Could Rosberg have pulled out and avoided contact? Yes or No
Did Rosberg admit that he could have pulled out to avoid contact but didn't in order to prove a point? Yes or No
Simple really.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
As above for every time Hamilton has hit someone from behind.
phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
So you don't know the answers then.
comment by WTCBU (U13662)
posted 1 minute ago
phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
So you don't know the answers then.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I am saying why is such a big issue made out of this racing incident.
Hamilton on many occasions has done exactly the same as Rosberg and nothing has been mentioned.Now its happened to Hamilton and he's been wronged then its the worse thing ever.
If it was that obvious then the stewards would have reviewed the incident,did they review it?
To avoid "quote mining" I will reproduce the autosport article in full
Mercedes Formula 1 team boss Toto Wolff believes Nico Rosberg's comments about his Belgian Grand Prix collision with Lewis Hamilton have been misconstrued.
The 2014 F1 title battle erupted into a new controversy at Spa when Hamilton alleged that Rosberg had admitted to deliberately triggering their lap-two tangle to "prove a point".
But while confirming that Hamilton's account of Rosberg's phrasing was correct, Wolff said the German was suggesting he had simply not backed down when they were wheel-to-wheel, rather than confessing to deliberately hitting his team-mate and championship rival.
"Nico felt he needed to hold his line. He needed to make a point, and for Lewis, it was clearly not him who needed to be aware of Nico," said Wolff.
"[Rosberg] didn't give in. He thought it was for Lewis to leave him space, and that Lewis didn't leave him space.
"So they agreed to disagree in a very heated discussion amongst ourselves, but it wasn't deliberately crashing. That is nonsense."
Although he dismissed the allegation that Rosberg had hit Hamilton on purpose, Wolff said that did not mean his fury towards his driver had subsided.
"It doesn't change the scenario at all because the incident, as I see it, is not acceptable for us," he said.
"What we saw there was that Nico was not prepared to take the exit, and that caused the collision.
"That is not something we want to happen.
"We had a collision that could have been avoided, a second-lap collision, it was Nico who attacked and he shouldn't have done it.
"It was also to show he was not prepared to give in.
"With hindsight, if he could turn back time, Nico would probably not do it again in the way he did."
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/115558
phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
The stewards did look at it and decided no further action. The FIA could look at if they want to.
It is a big deal for a lot of reasons which I don't think I really need to explain to anyone. Certainly the bosses at Mercedes think so too.
comment by WTCBU (U13662)
posted 3 minutes ago
phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
The stewards did look at it and decided no further action. The FIA could look at if they want to.
It is a big deal for a lot of reasons which I don't think I really need to explain to anyone. Certainly the bosses at Mercedes think so too.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
On the footage I seen I can't remember seeing that the incident was being viewed by the stewards.Can you enlighten me what lap it flashed up on the screen so I can watch the recording to verify this.Saves me having to search
I was going off a comment made in the following article
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/28922696
“Race stewards judged the clash as a racing incident and decided to take no further action.” Whether that comment can be accurately described as “investigating” I don't know. I certainly do not recall seeing any message on the screen.
comment by WTCBU (U13662)
posted 14 seconds ago
I was going off a comment made in the following article
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/28922696
“Race stewards judged the clash as a racing incident and decided to take no further action.” Whether that comment can be accurately described as “investigating” I don't know. I certainly do not recall seeing any message on the screen.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So someone asked a race steward 'did you see the incident' and the race steward probably said something like 'yes it was a racing incident and was not worthy of investigation'
That's the sort of scenario that probably took place.
Phil nev, u have some points, and most of it seems to lie on why is it such a big deal. Wtcbu shudnt have to clarify this, but i think i will.
World championship at stake, both driver and constructors
2 team mates both want to gain favourability, a driver who is seen to yield, is seen to be weak, not intelligent.
Both guys where sposed to be best of friends, so if anything provides great theatre, something f1 desparately needs
The divisive nature of the incident creates a more interesting spectacle
Thats why its a bigger deal than lewis and any other driver having a minor scrape with a max Chilton.
Phil neville, whose tyyres did Hamilton hit in Austria? Did it end their races?
To also suggest Hamilton gets away with stff is not only a blatant lie but an amazingly silly comment to make.
I appreciate you do not like the guy but there's no need to tell lies
comment by MUDD - me and Wazza are tight. (U9612)
posted 2 minutes ago
Phil neville, whose tyyres did Hamilton hit in Austria? Did it end their races?
To also suggest Hamilton gets away with stff is not only a blatant lie but an amazingly silly comment to make.
I appreciate you do not like the guy but there's no need to tell lies
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Hamilton ran into the rear tyres of 2 cars in Austria and on both occasions this did not cause a puncture to the driver in front but it did cause damage to Hamiltons front wing.
This suggests to me that all you Hamilton fans claiming that Rosberg knew what he was doing and deliberately attempted to cause a puncture to Hamilton's tyres haven't got a clue about motor racing.Most of the time the driver who's front wing gets damaged ends worse off.
Hamilton was unlucky to get a puncture,but these things happen whether its the 2nd lap or 2nd lap from the end like in Hungary when Rosberg had to take evasive action to not hit Hamilton who basically pushed him off the track.
Some have selective memory when it comes to Hamilton.I certainly do as I remember all the times he's been in the wrong only for the sycophants on the sky Hamilton channel to come out on his side.
I have no feeling towards Rosberg,but to me he will be a more worthy World Champion than that spoilt brat of a team mate
Who are the 2 cars he ran into in Austria?
I have no real issue with what Rosberg did, I just want people to stop making out that he's this innocent goody two shoes. He is not.
What makes Hamilton a spoilt brat?
Whether Nico Rosberg knew what he was doing is irrelevant. He simply can not handle close quarter racing with anyone and especially when up against Lewis Hamilton.
If he had any sense he would have done what he always does and gain places because he has DRS and the car in front does not. Or the car in front is at least 2 secs slower. He should have waited until lap 4.
To be a worthy champion you have to do something yourself that is worthy. Not because some JA606 member has taken an irrational dislike to another driver.
comment by WTCBU (U13662)
posted 46 minutes ago
Whether Nico Rosberg knew what he was doing is irrelevant. He simply can not handle close quarter racing with anyone and especially when up against Lewis Hamilton.
If he had any sense he would have done what he always does and gain places because he has DRS and the car in front does not. Or the car in front is at least 2 secs slower. He should have waited until lap 4.
To be a worthy champion you have to do something yourself that is worthy. Not because some JA606 member has taken an irrational dislike to another driver.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Are you implying Rosberg is only where he is down to the vast superiority of the car.The same car that Hamilton a supposed better driver has who trails him by 29 points.
comment by MUDD - me and Wazza are tight. (U9612)
posted 1 hour, 6 minutes ago
Who are the 2 cars he ran into in Austria?
I have no real issue with what Rosberg did, I just want people to stop making out that he's this innocent goody two shoes. He is not.
What makes Hamilton a spoilt brat?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I can't remember who they where,I think one of them was Perez and the other might have been Magnesson,but he did damage his front wing twice due to doing the same thing that Rosberg did
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 12 minutes ago
comment by MUDD - me and Wazza are tight. (U9612)
posted 1 hour, 6 minutes ago
Who are the 2 cars he ran into in Austria?
I have no real issue with what Rosberg did, I just want people to stop making out that he's this innocent goody two shoes. He is not.
What makes Hamilton a spoilt brat?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I can't remember who they where,I think one of them was Perez and the other might have been Magnesson,but he did damage his front wing twice due to doing the same thing that Rosberg did
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Actually that is not true. He did not hit anyone in Austria. The race you are thinking of is Germany where he had an incident with Kimi and Button.
Kimi's incident was a mistake by all parties including Hamilton and he hit button, that damaged his front wing. He apologised to him on track and after the race and Button initially was upset but when he saw the footage, it looked like he gave Hamilton room.
Didn't stop Hamilton from apologising to him. The true behaviour of a spoilt brat, right?
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 21 minutes ago
comment by WTCBU (U13662)
posted 46 minutes ago
Whether Nico Rosberg knew what he was doing is irrelevant. He simply can not handle close quarter racing with anyone and especially when up against Lewis Hamilton.
If he had any sense he would have done what he always does and gain places because he has DRS and the car in front does not. Or the car in front is at least 2 secs slower. He should have waited until lap 4.
To be a worthy champion you have to do something yourself that is worthy. Not because some JA606 member has taken an irrational dislike to another driver.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Are you implying Rosberg is only where he is down to the vast superiority of the car.The same car that Hamilton a supposed better driver has who trails him by 29 points.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why does Hamilton trail him by 29 points? The statement you posted above implies you may not know why, so before we deal with it, can we just be sure we are on the same page.
Why does Hamilton trail him by 29 points?
comment by MUDD - me and Wazza are tight. (U9612)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 21 minutes ago
comment by WTCBU (U13662)
posted 46 minutes ago
Whether Nico Rosberg knew what he was doing is irrelevant. He simply can not handle close quarter racing with anyone and especially when up against Lewis Hamilton.
If he had any sense he would have done what he always does and gain places because he has DRS and the car in front does not. Or the car in front is at least 2 secs slower. He should have waited until lap 4.
To be a worthy champion you have to do something yourself that is worthy. Not because some JA606 member has taken an irrational dislike to another driver.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Are you implying Rosberg is only where he is down to the vast superiority of the car.The same car that Hamilton a supposed better driver has who trails him by 29 points.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why does Hamilton trail him by 29 points? The statement you posted above implies you may not know why, so before we deal with it, can we just be sure we are on the same page.
Why does Hamilton trail him by 29 points?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because Rosberg has accumulated 29 more points to this stage of the season.
This is due to a number of factors which include being able to manage problems with his car far better than Hamilton (Canada comes to mind).Also Rosberg has been more consistent in qualifying and Rosberg being less prone to crashing out(past and present Hamilton has always pushed his car to his disadvantage but he never seems to learn).
comment by BWFCCLEGG (U7583)
posted 5 minutes ago
Thats ill informed
----------------------------------------------------------------------
In what way?
Rosberg is 29 points ahead of hamilton because Hamilton has had 3 DNFs to Rosbergs 1 and Hamilton has had issues in quali out of his control.
That actually highlights the superiority of Hamilton, because considering the dominance of the Mercs he would have at worst finished on the podium in all those races. Even if he finished behind Rosberg in them all, that's an additional 60 points to his tally.
To be honest, your post above is nonsense. I thought you were here to have a sensible discussion. That is clearly not the case
Sign in if you want to comment
Rosberg admits to deliberately causing acci
Page 6 of 9
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posted on 25/8/14
Didnt mercedes confirm that Hamilton's account of what was said was accurate?
posted on 25/8/14
Yes sid, thats exactly what they said. But u cant use that as support for ur argument, otherwise ur a hamilton fanboy
posted on 25/8/14
That's what's known as "quote mining", where you take one snippet of a longer piece of speech and ignore the context in order to try and prove a point.
If you read Wolff's full comments, you'll see he completely dismisses the idea that Rosberg deliberately crashed. But you're all ignoring that bit for some reason.
posted on 25/8/14
Was the collision Rosberg's fault? Yes or No
Could Rosberg have pulled out and avoided contact? Yes or No
Did Rosberg admit that he could have pulled out to avoid contact but didn't in order to prove a point? Yes or No
Simple really.
posted on 25/8/14
comment by WTCBU (U13662)
posted 1 minute ago
Was the collision Rosberg's fault? Yes or No
Could Rosberg have pulled out and avoided contact? Yes or No
Did Rosberg admit that he could have pulled out to avoid contact but didn't in order to prove a point? Yes or No
Simple really.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
As above for every time Hamilton has hit someone from behind.
posted on 25/8/14
phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
So you don't know the answers then.
posted on 25/8/14
comment by WTCBU (U13662)
posted 1 minute ago
phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
So you don't know the answers then.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I am saying why is such a big issue made out of this racing incident.
Hamilton on many occasions has done exactly the same as Rosberg and nothing has been mentioned.Now its happened to Hamilton and he's been wronged then its the worse thing ever.
If it was that obvious then the stewards would have reviewed the incident,did they review it?
posted on 25/8/14
To avoid "quote mining" I will reproduce the autosport article in full
Mercedes Formula 1 team boss Toto Wolff believes Nico Rosberg's comments about his Belgian Grand Prix collision with Lewis Hamilton have been misconstrued.
The 2014 F1 title battle erupted into a new controversy at Spa when Hamilton alleged that Rosberg had admitted to deliberately triggering their lap-two tangle to "prove a point".
But while confirming that Hamilton's account of Rosberg's phrasing was correct, Wolff said the German was suggesting he had simply not backed down when they were wheel-to-wheel, rather than confessing to deliberately hitting his team-mate and championship rival.
"Nico felt he needed to hold his line. He needed to make a point, and for Lewis, it was clearly not him who needed to be aware of Nico," said Wolff.
"[Rosberg] didn't give in. He thought it was for Lewis to leave him space, and that Lewis didn't leave him space.
"So they agreed to disagree in a very heated discussion amongst ourselves, but it wasn't deliberately crashing. That is nonsense."
Although he dismissed the allegation that Rosberg had hit Hamilton on purpose, Wolff said that did not mean his fury towards his driver had subsided.
"It doesn't change the scenario at all because the incident, as I see it, is not acceptable for us," he said.
"What we saw there was that Nico was not prepared to take the exit, and that caused the collision.
"That is not something we want to happen.
"We had a collision that could have been avoided, a second-lap collision, it was Nico who attacked and he shouldn't have done it.
"It was also to show he was not prepared to give in.
"With hindsight, if he could turn back time, Nico would probably not do it again in the way he did."
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/115558
posted on 25/8/14
phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
The stewards did look at it and decided no further action. The FIA could look at if they want to.
It is a big deal for a lot of reasons which I don't think I really need to explain to anyone. Certainly the bosses at Mercedes think so too.
posted on 25/8/14
comment by WTCBU (U13662)
posted 3 minutes ago
phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
The stewards did look at it and decided no further action. The FIA could look at if they want to.
It is a big deal for a lot of reasons which I don't think I really need to explain to anyone. Certainly the bosses at Mercedes think so too.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
On the footage I seen I can't remember seeing that the incident was being viewed by the stewards.Can you enlighten me what lap it flashed up on the screen so I can watch the recording to verify this.Saves me having to search
posted on 25/8/14
I was going off a comment made in the following article
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/28922696
“Race stewards judged the clash as a racing incident and decided to take no further action.” Whether that comment can be accurately described as “investigating” I don't know. I certainly do not recall seeing any message on the screen.
posted on 25/8/14
comment by WTCBU (U13662)
posted 14 seconds ago
I was going off a comment made in the following article
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/28922696
“Race stewards judged the clash as a racing incident and decided to take no further action.” Whether that comment can be accurately described as “investigating” I don't know. I certainly do not recall seeing any message on the screen.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So someone asked a race steward 'did you see the incident' and the race steward probably said something like 'yes it was a racing incident and was not worthy of investigation'
That's the sort of scenario that probably took place.
posted on 25/8/14
Phil nev, u have some points, and most of it seems to lie on why is it such a big deal. Wtcbu shudnt have to clarify this, but i think i will.
World championship at stake, both driver and constructors
2 team mates both want to gain favourability, a driver who is seen to yield, is seen to be weak, not intelligent.
Both guys where sposed to be best of friends, so if anything provides great theatre, something f1 desparately needs
The divisive nature of the incident creates a more interesting spectacle
Thats why its a bigger deal than lewis and any other driver having a minor scrape with a max Chilton.
posted on 25/8/14
Phil neville, whose tyyres did Hamilton hit in Austria? Did it end their races?
To also suggest Hamilton gets away with stff is not only a blatant lie but an amazingly silly comment to make.
I appreciate you do not like the guy but there's no need to tell lies
posted on 25/8/14
comment by MUDD - me and Wazza are tight. (U9612)
posted 2 minutes ago
Phil neville, whose tyyres did Hamilton hit in Austria? Did it end their races?
To also suggest Hamilton gets away with stff is not only a blatant lie but an amazingly silly comment to make.
I appreciate you do not like the guy but there's no need to tell lies
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Hamilton ran into the rear tyres of 2 cars in Austria and on both occasions this did not cause a puncture to the driver in front but it did cause damage to Hamiltons front wing.
This suggests to me that all you Hamilton fans claiming that Rosberg knew what he was doing and deliberately attempted to cause a puncture to Hamilton's tyres haven't got a clue about motor racing.Most of the time the driver who's front wing gets damaged ends worse off.
Hamilton was unlucky to get a puncture,but these things happen whether its the 2nd lap or 2nd lap from the end like in Hungary when Rosberg had to take evasive action to not hit Hamilton who basically pushed him off the track.
Some have selective memory when it comes to Hamilton.I certainly do as I remember all the times he's been in the wrong only for the sycophants on the sky Hamilton channel to come out on his side.
I have no feeling towards Rosberg,but to me he will be a more worthy World Champion than that spoilt brat of a team mate
posted on 25/8/14
Who are the 2 cars he ran into in Austria?
I have no real issue with what Rosberg did, I just want people to stop making out that he's this innocent goody two shoes. He is not.
What makes Hamilton a spoilt brat?
posted on 25/8/14
Whether Nico Rosberg knew what he was doing is irrelevant. He simply can not handle close quarter racing with anyone and especially when up against Lewis Hamilton.
If he had any sense he would have done what he always does and gain places because he has DRS and the car in front does not. Or the car in front is at least 2 secs slower. He should have waited until lap 4.
To be a worthy champion you have to do something yourself that is worthy. Not because some JA606 member has taken an irrational dislike to another driver.
posted on 25/8/14
comment by WTCBU (U13662)
posted 46 minutes ago
Whether Nico Rosberg knew what he was doing is irrelevant. He simply can not handle close quarter racing with anyone and especially when up against Lewis Hamilton.
If he had any sense he would have done what he always does and gain places because he has DRS and the car in front does not. Or the car in front is at least 2 secs slower. He should have waited until lap 4.
To be a worthy champion you have to do something yourself that is worthy. Not because some JA606 member has taken an irrational dislike to another driver.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Are you implying Rosberg is only where he is down to the vast superiority of the car.The same car that Hamilton a supposed better driver has who trails him by 29 points.
posted on 25/8/14
comment by MUDD - me and Wazza are tight. (U9612)
posted 1 hour, 6 minutes ago
Who are the 2 cars he ran into in Austria?
I have no real issue with what Rosberg did, I just want people to stop making out that he's this innocent goody two shoes. He is not.
What makes Hamilton a spoilt brat?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I can't remember who they where,I think one of them was Perez and the other might have been Magnesson,but he did damage his front wing twice due to doing the same thing that Rosberg did
posted on 25/8/14
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 12 minutes ago
comment by MUDD - me and Wazza are tight. (U9612)
posted 1 hour, 6 minutes ago
Who are the 2 cars he ran into in Austria?
I have no real issue with what Rosberg did, I just want people to stop making out that he's this innocent goody two shoes. He is not.
What makes Hamilton a spoilt brat?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I can't remember who they where,I think one of them was Perez and the other might have been Magnesson,but he did damage his front wing twice due to doing the same thing that Rosberg did
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Actually that is not true. He did not hit anyone in Austria. The race you are thinking of is Germany where he had an incident with Kimi and Button.
Kimi's incident was a mistake by all parties including Hamilton and he hit button, that damaged his front wing. He apologised to him on track and after the race and Button initially was upset but when he saw the footage, it looked like he gave Hamilton room.
Didn't stop Hamilton from apologising to him. The true behaviour of a spoilt brat, right?
posted on 25/8/14
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 21 minutes ago
comment by WTCBU (U13662)
posted 46 minutes ago
Whether Nico Rosberg knew what he was doing is irrelevant. He simply can not handle close quarter racing with anyone and especially when up against Lewis Hamilton.
If he had any sense he would have done what he always does and gain places because he has DRS and the car in front does not. Or the car in front is at least 2 secs slower. He should have waited until lap 4.
To be a worthy champion you have to do something yourself that is worthy. Not because some JA606 member has taken an irrational dislike to another driver.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Are you implying Rosberg is only where he is down to the vast superiority of the car.The same car that Hamilton a supposed better driver has who trails him by 29 points.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why does Hamilton trail him by 29 points? The statement you posted above implies you may not know why, so before we deal with it, can we just be sure we are on the same page.
Why does Hamilton trail him by 29 points?
posted on 25/8/14
comment by MUDD - me and Wazza are tight. (U9612)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by phil neville has three left feet (U13806)
posted 21 minutes ago
comment by WTCBU (U13662)
posted 46 minutes ago
Whether Nico Rosberg knew what he was doing is irrelevant. He simply can not handle close quarter racing with anyone and especially when up against Lewis Hamilton.
If he had any sense he would have done what he always does and gain places because he has DRS and the car in front does not. Or the car in front is at least 2 secs slower. He should have waited until lap 4.
To be a worthy champion you have to do something yourself that is worthy. Not because some JA606 member has taken an irrational dislike to another driver.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Are you implying Rosberg is only where he is down to the vast superiority of the car.The same car that Hamilton a supposed better driver has who trails him by 29 points.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why does Hamilton trail him by 29 points? The statement you posted above implies you may not know why, so before we deal with it, can we just be sure we are on the same page.
Why does Hamilton trail him by 29 points?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because Rosberg has accumulated 29 more points to this stage of the season.
This is due to a number of factors which include being able to manage problems with his car far better than Hamilton (Canada comes to mind).Also Rosberg has been more consistent in qualifying and Rosberg being less prone to crashing out(past and present Hamilton has always pushed his car to his disadvantage but he never seems to learn).
posted on 25/8/14
Thats ill informed
posted on 25/8/14
comment by BWFCCLEGG (U7583)
posted 5 minutes ago
Thats ill informed
----------------------------------------------------------------------
In what way?
posted on 25/8/14
Rosberg is 29 points ahead of hamilton because Hamilton has had 3 DNFs to Rosbergs 1 and Hamilton has had issues in quali out of his control.
That actually highlights the superiority of Hamilton, because considering the dominance of the Mercs he would have at worst finished on the podium in all those races. Even if he finished behind Rosberg in them all, that's an additional 60 points to his tally.
To be honest, your post above is nonsense. I thought you were here to have a sensible discussion. That is clearly not the case
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