comment by Melt (U22362)
posted 1 minute ago
Everyone after Italy should have been prepared
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Which is why it’s stupid to say people are only criticising in hindsight. Italy was our hindsight.
comment by Joe The King Exotic (U10026)
posted 13 seconds ago
comment by Melt (U22362)
posted 1 minute ago
Everyone after Italy should have been prepared
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Which is why it’s stupid to say people are only criticising in hindsight. Italy was our hindsight.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Pretty much.. we even had reports out if Italy detailing what was happening and what we should do.
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 5 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 18 seconds ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 44 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 16 seconds ago
comment by ThE ReVoLuTiOn Is HeRe (U22182)
posted 26 seconds ago
How can anyone say he didn’t take it seriously enough
What a pathetic, immature and silly comment to make
We were facing an unknown virus in an unprecedented situation- he made all his decision on the expert advice given to him at the time
Hindsight is an amazing thing and you can make such better decisions with it - but that doesn’t mean he didn’t do his best and make the best choice given to him at the time
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If he took it more seriously he would have locked down sooner.
It's pretty elementary really.
Unless you're saying he took it as seriously as he possibly could...
Then of course it's his abilities in question.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yep really simple to lock the whole country down - there’s absolutely no effects of that whatsoever. Economically we will be fine, there’s loads more money where the £330bn came from an absolutely no vulnerable lives will be lost due to mass unemployment and the resulting poverty
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You do realise that the lockdown will be longer because of the delay, due to the huge number of cases. Your go to argument seems to be the economic impact, but you completely ignore that this impact will be greater if you allow the virus to spread further; therefore causing more of a disruption when measures have to be taken.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The lockdown will be longer if people don’t adhere to it. People will stop adhering to it if you bring in the measures way too early - e.g February, because they get fed up of being stuck indoors for weeks and weeks on end. You’d already have people on the streets by now thinking this is probably all over.if the lockdown had been brought in much earlier than it was.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I dont think you understand this. Bring in the lockdown earlier and it becomes easier to test and trace. The lock down is shorter, as cases reduce and measure can be lifted. Containment becomes easier.
Bring in the lockdown later and it last longer; as it becomes impossible to trace contact to contain and test all those with symptoms. The number of cases is high, the numbers in hospitals are high etc.
If you wanted a shorter lockdown, then it needed to be brought it sooner and testing needed to be increased. Unless you think this lockdown is now permanent until we have a vaccine, something you have vehemently argues against. Either way, you seem to disagree with the government approach despite rabidly attacking anyone who has an opinion that contrasts with the government strategy.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We didn’t have anywhere near enough testing capability to test and trace effectively during a lockdown initiated in February. In theory I totally get what you’re saying - in practice, very few western countries were effectively prepared for such a scenario
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wtf?
So your view is that we would definitely have enough testing capability once the virus has gone on and is spreading exponentially?
Fecking hell, this guy..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What?! No that’s not what I’ve said. It’s a simple fact that we didn’t have the testing capability to do what Tamwolf has suggested. We are still well short of being able to track this virus effectively
comment by Gillespie Road. (U18361)
posted 9 seconds ago
comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Edward Elizabeth Hitler. (U14393)
posted 24 seconds ago
Anyone else planning on wfh till a cure is found ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think this will be the biggest long term change from this; more people will wfh. That being said, after a few years people tend to go back to the norm
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Quite a few employers are going to have a very hard time justifying all the office space they currently rent when this is over.
I'd be shaking in my boots right now if I was in the business of renting out office space.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Working on a pharma data project at the moment with folk in Netherlands and Ireland. All face to face meetings have been cancelled, and things are definitely moving slower. Don't see too many closing offices for good as that is disruptive but I suppose if cashflow becomes an issue people might.
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 12 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 25 seconds ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 40 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 26 minutes ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 8 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Robb, the fourth husband of Joe Exotic (U22311)
posted 34 seconds ago
Blackstarr’s MO..
Call everyone who disagrees with him a ‘medical expert’ and say that unless they really are one they couldn’t possibly be right.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s not me you’re disagreeing with - it’s epidemiologists and chief medical officers, not only in this country but in many others in terms of timing interventions to flatten the curve
I think it’s fair to say that a load of football fans (myself included) maybe aren’t best placed to calling the shots on an infectious disease outbreak.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because scientists and data modelling experts can't be football fans, and certainly can't go on sports forums. (!)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’m sure they can but I’m pretty sure none of you actually are
----------------------------------------------------------------------
... That's what you said. Deny it again if you must.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I haven’t seen anyone post their medical or scientific credentials on here which would back up what they are saying. If they care to elaborate then fair play I’m all ears
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You presumed to know everyone's vocation... when in fact you know jacksheet.
I haven't seen you post your birth certificate on here ergo you must be a bastrd.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Normally when someone makes a concerted argument about a subject that’s within their field of expertise - they tend to back it up. I’ll say it again, I don’t think Sandy, Sizzle, Robb, Edward (the leading lights on this debate) are experts in the spread of infectious diseases
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I guess according to you the views of those scientists that signed the letter calling for far more wide reaching and swifter action shouldn't be cited either then..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
They published that article a week before a full lockdown was implemented. They were right to post the article. They weren’t calling for that lockdown back in February though let’s be honest. They didn’t even post that at the beginning of March
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ah, so they only had that view a week before lockdown.. it just came go them in an epiphany and wasn't the result of any study or modelling. Just boom, one week before lockdown they all had the same mass epiphany.
Ok then.. if that's what you say you believe.
There's an awful amount of people looking at this crisis in the short term,which in some ways is understandable.
What is happening now,the timing of the lockdown,the daily death tolls,the stresses on the NHS etc will in probability be an afterthought in years to come.
The long term effects of this virus will kill more people than the 5,000 or so poor lost souls that it's already claimed.
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
This pandemic could go down in history as the biggest cause of deaths in modern times,but I would imagine a vast majority of those deaths will be due to the social and financial impacts that will happen in the years to come.
comment by Edward Elizabeth Hitler. (U14393)
posted 50 seconds ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 56 seconds ago
comment by Edward Elizabeth Hitler. (U14393)
posted 5 minutes ago
Anyone else planning on wfh till a cure is found ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I can't as I work in critical medical supply. WFH some of the time but have to be on site a lot. Will be working throughout this.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Stay Safe
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Cheers. My company are pretty good. Implemented social distancing around the site, give us free breakfasts from the canteen, have a shopping list (with essentials like toilet roll, cheese etc) which we can order three items from each week and have delivered to our desks for free, increased PPE and bought in coronavirus testing for us (despite the government telling us they can't get it), they're installing thermal imaging on the turnstiles into site to test us before we enter etc.
Our development Lab have manufactured a massive batch of hand sanitizer (something they have never done before) and we all got a bottle, with the rest being donated to care homes and the NHS. The site have also donated 15 pallets of PPE (including masks with respirators) to the local hospital too.
I am actually much better treated by my multi national pharma company than the NHS staff are by the government, which is quite sad really.
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
---
Not sure on the 2015 total, but a 'flu season' is typically from late Autumn to early spring. The UK has recorded nearly 5,00 deaths from Covid in a month.
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 12 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 25 seconds ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 40 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 26 minutes ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 8 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Robb, the fourth husband of Joe Exotic (U22311)
posted 34 seconds ago
Blackstarr’s MO..
Call everyone who disagrees with him a ‘medical expert’ and say that unless they really are one they couldn’t possibly be right.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s not me you’re disagreeing with - it’s epidemiologists and chief medical officers, not only in this country but in many others in terms of timing interventions to flatten the curve
I think it’s fair to say that a load of football fans (myself included) maybe aren’t best placed to calling the shots on an infectious disease outbreak.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because scientists and data modelling experts can't be football fans, and certainly can't go on sports forums. (!)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’m sure they can but I’m pretty sure none of you actually are
----------------------------------------------------------------------
... That's what you said. Deny it again if you must.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I haven’t seen anyone post their medical or scientific credentials on here which would back up what they are saying. If they care to elaborate then fair play I’m all ears
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You presumed to know everyone's vocation... when in fact you know jacksheet.
I haven't seen you post your birth certificate on here ergo you must be a bastrd.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Normally when someone makes a concerted argument about a subject that’s within their field of expertise - they tend to back it up. I’ll say it again, I don’t think Sandy, Sizzle, Robb, Edward (the leading lights on this debate) are experts in the spread of infectious diseases
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I guess according to you the views of those scientists that signed the letter calling for far more wide reaching and swifter action shouldn't be cited either then..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
They published that article a week before a full lockdown was implemented. They were right to post the article. They weren’t calling for that lockdown back in February though let’s be honest. They didn’t even post that at the beginning of March
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ah, so they only had that view a week before lockdown.. it just came go them in an epiphany and wasn't the result of any study or modelling. Just boom, one week before lockdown they all had the same mass epiphany.
Ok then.. if that's what you say you believe.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’m saying if they had that view weeks before why not publish it weeks before?
comment by Bales (U22081)
posted 27 seconds ago
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
---
Not sure on the 2015 total, but a 'flu season' is typically from late Autumn to early spring. The UK has recorded nearly 5,00 deaths from Covid in a month.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
2015 flu season claimed 44,000 lives attributed to the flu,they reckon that more lives would have been lost as most often pnuemonia is often cited as cause of death to flu.This covid19 all deaths are attributed to this coronvirus strain and not down to secondary reasons of deaths,so the cause of death is skewed towards covid than flu
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 4 seconds ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 12 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 25 seconds ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 40 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 26 minutes ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 8 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Robb, the fourth husband of Joe Exotic (U22311)
posted 34 seconds ago
Blackstarr’s MO..
Call everyone who disagrees with him a ‘medical expert’ and say that unless they really are one they couldn’t possibly be right.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s not me you’re disagreeing with - it’s epidemiologists and chief medical officers, not only in this country but in many others in terms of timing interventions to flatten the curve
I think it’s fair to say that a load of football fans (myself included) maybe aren’t best placed to calling the shots on an infectious disease outbreak.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because scientists and data modelling experts can't be football fans, and certainly can't go on sports forums. (!)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’m sure they can but I’m pretty sure none of you actually are
----------------------------------------------------------------------
... That's what you said. Deny it again if you must.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I haven’t seen anyone post their medical or scientific credentials on here which would back up what they are saying. If they care to elaborate then fair play I’m all ears
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You presumed to know everyone's vocation... when in fact you know jacksheet.
I haven't seen you post your birth certificate on here ergo you must be a bastrd.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Normally when someone makes a concerted argument about a subject that’s within their field of expertise - they tend to back it up. I’ll say it again, I don’t think Sandy, Sizzle, Robb, Edward (the leading lights on this debate) are experts in the spread of infectious diseases
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I guess according to you the views of those scientists that signed the letter calling for far more wide reaching and swifter action shouldn't be cited either then..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
They published that article a week before a full lockdown was implemented. They were right to post the article. They weren’t calling for that lockdown back in February though let’s be honest. They didn’t even post that at the beginning of March
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ah, so they only had that view a week before lockdown.. it just came go them in an epiphany and wasn't the result of any study or modelling. Just boom, one week before lockdown they all had the same mass epiphany.
Ok then.. if that's what you say you believe.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’m saying if they had that view weeks before why not publish it weeks before?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So you're still contending that they may not have had those views before and just voiced them en masse without knowing how or why?
Do you know how ridiculous you sound? They voiced those concerns a full week before the government took action, they already had those views anyway.
You still maintain the government took the correct action, therefore you say these scientists (who's credentials haven't been displayed) were wrong in their timing, but then ask why they didn't voice their concerns even earlier.
You are facking 100% all over the place, aside from presuming to know every contributors competency on this thread, you want to maintain the government decisions were right and that wilfully shaking hands with corona patients is a wholly sensible thing to do and Boris Johnson shouldn't be criticised for it.
That he is in ICU taking up a bed space is right and proper and is in no way Boris Johnson's fault despite him having been one of the most informed people in Britain on this topic.
Jeezus facking christ.
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Bales (U22081)
posted 27 seconds ago
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
---
Not sure on the 2015 total, but a 'flu season' is typically from late Autumn to early spring. The UK has recorded nearly 5,00 deaths from Covid in a month.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
2015 flu season claimed 44,000 lives attributed to the flu,they reckon that more lives would have been lost as most often pnuemonia is often cited as cause of death to flu.This covid19 all deaths are attributed to this coronvirus strain and not down to secondary reasons of deaths,so the cause of death is skewed towards covid than flu
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh dear, not this again. During regular flu season ICUs don't collapse with blanket rules on the age of people who are worth treating brought in. This has already happened in Italy and Spain and appears to be happening in the UK despite the fact we're not at our initial peek yet.
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Bales (U22081)
posted 27 seconds ago
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
---
Not sure on the 2015 total, but a 'flu season' is typically from late Autumn to early spring. The UK has recorded nearly 5,00 deaths from Covid in a month.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
2015 flu season claimed 44,000 lives attributed to the flu,they reckon that more lives would have been lost as most often pnuemonia is often cited as cause of death to flu.This covid19 all deaths are attributed to this coronvirus strain and not down to secondary reasons of deaths,so the cause of death is skewed towards covid than flu
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh dear, not this again. During regular flu season ICUs don't collapse with blanket rules on the age of people who are worth treating brought in. This has already happened in Italy and Spain and appears to be happening in the UK despite the fact we're not at our initial peek yet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And if you want to be anecdotal, our PM is in an ICU. Which I've never seen with a seasonal flu.
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 4 seconds ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 12 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 25 seconds ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 40 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 26 minutes ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 8 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Robb, the fourth husband of Joe Exotic (U22311)
posted 34 seconds ago
Blackstarr’s MO..
Call everyone who disagrees with him a ‘medical expert’ and say that unless they really are one they couldn’t possibly be right.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s not me you’re disagreeing with - it’s epidemiologists and chief medical officers, not only in this country but in many others in terms of timing interventions to flatten the curve
I think it’s fair to say that a load of football fans (myself included) maybe aren’t best placed to calling the shots on an infectious disease outbreak.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because scientists and data modelling experts can't be football fans, and certainly can't go on sports forums. (!)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’m sure they can but I’m pretty sure none of you actually are
----------------------------------------------------------------------
... That's what you said. Deny it again if you must.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I haven’t seen anyone post their medical or scientific credentials on here which would back up what they are saying. If they care to elaborate then fair play I’m all ears
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You presumed to know everyone's vocation... when in fact you know jacksheet.
I haven't seen you post your birth certificate on here ergo you must be a bastrd.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Normally when someone makes a concerted argument about a subject that’s within their field of expertise - they tend to back it up. I’ll say it again, I don’t think Sandy, Sizzle, Robb, Edward (the leading lights on this debate) are experts in the spread of infectious diseases
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I guess according to you the views of those scientists that signed the letter calling for far more wide reaching and swifter action shouldn't be cited either then..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
They published that article a week before a full lockdown was implemented. They were right to post the article. They weren’t calling for that lockdown back in February though let’s be honest. They didn’t even post that at the beginning of March
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ah, so they only had that view a week before lockdown.. it just came go them in an epiphany and wasn't the result of any study or modelling. Just boom, one week before lockdown they all had the same mass epiphany.
Ok then.. if that's what you say you believe.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’m saying if they had that view weeks before why not publish it weeks before?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So you're still contending that they may not have had those views before and just voiced them en masse without knowing how or why?
Do you know how ridiculous you sound? They voiced those concerns a full week before the government took action, they already had those views anyway.
You still maintain the government took the correct action, therefore you say these scientists (who's credentials haven't been displayed) were wrong in their timing, but then ask why they didn't voice their concerns even earlier.
You are facking 100% all over the place, aside from presuming to know every contributors competency on this thread, you want to maintain the government decisions were right and that wilfully shaking hands with corona patients is a wholly sensible thing to do and Boris Johnson shouldn't be criticised for it.
That he is in ICU taking up a bed space is right and proper and is in no way Boris Johnson's fault despite him having been one of the most informed people in Britain on this topic.
Jeezus facking christ.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And you’re putting dozens of words in my mouth and leaping to ridiculous conclusions because you’re too busy trying to win an argument rather than debating in a reasoned way.
I think the scientists views were informed by a change in the modelling - very similar to the governments shift in strategy when Neil Ferguson advised on the huge impact on the NHS based on new and updated modelling. Back in February - it wasn’t as obvious as you now make it out to be, hence the reason very few leading experts (if any) were calling for a nationwide lockdown back then. Something changed - they realised the virus couldn’t be contained and traced any longer
Not saying the government got this all spot on, they didn’t, but they were advised by scientists (including behavioural scientists) and were probably a week too late with their measures. I don’t think that calls for a hysterical criticism of the government though and I can only conclude that party politics is behind that
We are dealing with something not seen in 100 years. Italy, France, Spain, now the US and today Japan are all behind the curve in tackling this disease. They are all badly prepared.
too damned bad whats happened to Boris won't happen to Trump.
On the other hand, since Trump won't wear a mask over his big mouth,.....maybe it will
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Bales (U22081)
posted 27 seconds ago
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
---
Not sure on the 2015 total, but a 'flu season' is typically from late Autumn to early spring. The UK has recorded nearly 5,00 deaths from Covid in a month.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
2015 flu season claimed 44,000 lives attributed to the flu,they reckon that more lives would have been lost as most often pnuemonia is often cited as cause of death to flu.This covid19 all deaths are attributed to this coronvirus strain and not down to secondary reasons of deaths,so the cause of death is skewed towards covid than flu
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh dear, not this again. During regular flu season ICUs don't collapse with blanket rules on the age of people who are worth treating brought in. This has already happened in Italy and Spain and appears to be happening in the UK despite the fact we're not at our initial peek yet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
As I said earlier,short term thinking.Look back to 5 years ago and look at the NHS being in crisis over the flu that Winter.
44,000 died,no industry was shut down,no schools either,millions weren't on furlough.
I hope I am wrong,but long term many more are going to suffer than those that will succomb to covid-19
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 5 seconds ago
There's an awful amount of people looking at this crisis in the short term,which in some ways is understandable.
What is happening now,the timing of the lockdown,the daily death tolls,the stresses on the NHS etc will in probability be an afterthought in years to come.
The long term effects of this virus will kill more people than the 5,000 or so poor lost souls that it's already claimed.
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
This pandemic could go down in history as the biggest cause of deaths in modern times,but I would imagine a vast majority of those deaths will be due to the social and financial impacts that will happen in the years to come.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Now imagine if we simply half-arsed our response and let the virus run rampant.
First thing to grind to a halt would be our healthcare infrastructure. We wouldn't even have a peak situation to speak of. Just an exponentially rising death tally. Made worse by medical staff turning every non-Covid case away.
The rest of the population that stayed alive would then have to deal with being out of commission for 3-4 weeks at a time. Only to fall sick again as soon as they felt good enough to walk out the door. Progressively damaging their organs with every subsequent infection.
How long would the country be able to keep the lights on? How long before the military or the police ran out of men and ground to a halt? How long before no one is able to stay fit long enough to farm, man our power generation and water supply infrastructure or even collect the rubbish?
etc, etc
comment by Admin1 (U1)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Bales (U22081)
posted 27 seconds ago
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
---
Not sure on the 2015 total, but a 'flu season' is typically from late Autumn to early spring. The UK has recorded nearly 5,00 deaths from Covid in a month.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
2015 flu season claimed 44,000 lives attributed to the flu,they reckon that more lives would have been lost as most often pnuemonia is often cited as cause of death to flu.This covid19 all deaths are attributed to this coronvirus strain and not down to secondary reasons of deaths,so the cause of death is skewed towards covid than flu
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh dear, not this again. During regular flu season ICUs don't collapse with blanket rules on the age of people who are worth treating brought in. This has already happened in Italy and Spain and appears to be happening in the UK despite the fact we're not at our initial peek yet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And if you want to be anecdotal, our PM is in an ICU. Which I've never seen with a seasonal flu.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not seen a whole Country shut down to seasonal flu even when 44,000 people recorded(many not recorded)deaths in a single Winter
comment by Gillespie Road. (U18361)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 5 seconds ago
There's an awful amount of people looking at this crisis in the short term,which in some ways is understandable.
What is happening now,the timing of the lockdown,the daily death tolls,the stresses on the NHS etc will in probability be an afterthought in years to come.
The long term effects of this virus will kill more people than the 5,000 or so poor lost souls that it's already claimed.
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
This pandemic could go down in history as the biggest cause of deaths in modern times,but I would imagine a vast majority of those deaths will be due to the social and financial impacts that will happen in the years to come.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Now imagine if we simply half-arsed our response and let the virus run rampant.
First thing to grind to a halt would be our healthcare infrastructure. We wouldn't even have a peak situation to speak of. Just an exponentially rising death tally. Made worse by medical staff turning every non-Covid case away.
The rest of the population that stayed alive would then have to deal with being out of commission for 3-4 weeks at a time. Only to fall sick again as soon as they felt good enough to walk out the door. Progressively damaging their organs with every subsequent infection.
How long would the country be able to keep the lights on? How long before the military or the police ran out of men and ground to a halt? How long before no one is able to stay fit long enough to farm, man our power generation and water supply infrastructure or even collect the rubbish?
etc, etc
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Where have I said just let the virus run rampant!!!!
Don't attribute me to saying things that I haven't.I have just said that looking at things short term and arguing about putting a lock down a week earlier is neither here nor there.
Long term will be where the biggest effects of this virus will be felt.
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Admin1 (U1)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Bales (U22081)
posted 27 seconds ago
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
---
Not sure on the 2015 total, but a 'flu season' is typically from late Autumn to early spring. The UK has recorded nearly 5,00 deaths from Covid in a month.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
2015 flu season claimed 44,000 lives attributed to the flu,they reckon that more lives would have been lost as most often pnuemonia is often cited as cause of death to flu.This covid19 all deaths are attributed to this coronvirus strain and not down to secondary reasons of deaths,so the cause of death is skewed towards covid than flu
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh dear, not this again. During regular flu season ICUs don't collapse with blanket rules on the age of people who are worth treating brought in. This has already happened in Italy and Spain and appears to be happening in the UK despite the fact we're not at our initial peek yet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And if you want to be anecdotal, our PM is in an ICU. Which I've never seen with a seasonal flu.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not seen a whole Country shut down to seasonal flu even when 44,000 people recorded(many not recorded)deaths in a single Winter
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Around 22,000 'extra' deaths than the previous year.
I don't think it's useful to compare the two directly though, as you would have to run an experiment where we're not all social distancing etc.
Also, it's worth noting that it was a particularly bad year for the effectiveness of the vaccine, and news reports around that probably lowered the number of people having it that shouldve.
Still, the numbers do provide context which will hopefully ease some people's fears that this is some kind of apocalypse.
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 4 seconds ago
comment by Admin1 (U1)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Bales (U22081)
posted 27 seconds ago
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
---
Not sure on the 2015 total, but a 'flu season' is typically from late Autumn to early spring. The UK has recorded nearly 5,00 deaths from Covid in a month.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
2015 flu season claimed 44,000 lives attributed to the flu,they reckon that more lives would have been lost as most often pnuemonia is often cited as cause of death to flu.This covid19 all deaths are attributed to this coronvirus strain and not down to secondary reasons of deaths,so the cause of death is skewed towards covid than flu
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh dear, not this again. During regular flu season ICUs don't collapse with blanket rules on the age of people who are worth treating brought in. This has already happened in Italy and Spain and appears to be happening in the UK despite the fact we're not at our initial peek yet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And if you want to be anecdotal, our PM is in an ICU. Which I've never seen with a seasonal flu.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not seen a whole Country shut down to seasonal flu even when 44,000 people recorded(many not recorded)deaths in a single Winter
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah this is because covid is five to ten times more deadly. Is more infectious and has a higher incidence of complication requiring medical attention. It's a shiitsandwich for any government to handle. My brother in law just spent half a million quid on roughly 15 ventilators for his hospital. And those who are hooked up don't even have a 50/50 chance. It's grim.
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Admin1 (U1)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Bales (U22081)
posted 27 seconds ago
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
---
Not sure on the 2015 total, but a 'flu season' is typically from late Autumn to early spring. The UK has recorded nearly 5,00 deaths from Covid in a month.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
2015 flu season claimed 44,000 lives attributed to the flu,they reckon that more lives would have been lost as most often pnuemonia is often cited as cause of death to flu.This covid19 all deaths are attributed to this coronvirus strain and not down to secondary reasons of deaths,so the cause of death is skewed towards covid than flu
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh dear, not this again. During regular flu season ICUs don't collapse with blanket rules on the age of people who are worth treating brought in. This has already happened in Italy and Spain and appears to be happening in the UK despite the fact we're not at our initial peek yet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And if you want to be anecdotal, our PM is in an ICU. Which I've never seen with a seasonal flu.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not seen a whole Country shut down to seasonal flu even when 44,000 people recorded(many not recorded)deaths in a single Winter
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Now imagine how bad the mortality rate of the flu, road accidents, cancer, diabetes ...etc would be if our healthcare infrastructure ground to a halt because we allowed some new untreatable virus to run amok.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
comment by Poolmyfinger (U12438)
posted 1 second ago
ANYWAY...I hope Boris pulls through and gets back on his feet soon
Isn't he going to be a father soon? It would be quite sad if he doesn't make it and never gets to meet his child.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It would be a huge blow to the UK to his family and his children. I'm hopeful he will be back in number ten soon.
Sign in if you want to comment
Boris In Intensive Care
Page 14 of 21
15 | 16 | 17 | 18 | 19
posted on 6/4/20
comment by Melt (U22362)
posted 1 minute ago
Everyone after Italy should have been prepared
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Which is why it’s stupid to say people are only criticising in hindsight. Italy was our hindsight.
posted on 6/4/20
comment by Joe The King Exotic (U10026)
posted 13 seconds ago
comment by Melt (U22362)
posted 1 minute ago
Everyone after Italy should have been prepared
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Which is why it’s stupid to say people are only criticising in hindsight. Italy was our hindsight.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Pretty much.. we even had reports out if Italy detailing what was happening and what we should do.
posted on 6/4/20
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 5 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 18 seconds ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 44 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 16 seconds ago
comment by ThE ReVoLuTiOn Is HeRe (U22182)
posted 26 seconds ago
How can anyone say he didn’t take it seriously enough
What a pathetic, immature and silly comment to make
We were facing an unknown virus in an unprecedented situation- he made all his decision on the expert advice given to him at the time
Hindsight is an amazing thing and you can make such better decisions with it - but that doesn’t mean he didn’t do his best and make the best choice given to him at the time
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If he took it more seriously he would have locked down sooner.
It's pretty elementary really.
Unless you're saying he took it as seriously as he possibly could...
Then of course it's his abilities in question.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yep really simple to lock the whole country down - there’s absolutely no effects of that whatsoever. Economically we will be fine, there’s loads more money where the £330bn came from an absolutely no vulnerable lives will be lost due to mass unemployment and the resulting poverty
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You do realise that the lockdown will be longer because of the delay, due to the huge number of cases. Your go to argument seems to be the economic impact, but you completely ignore that this impact will be greater if you allow the virus to spread further; therefore causing more of a disruption when measures have to be taken.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The lockdown will be longer if people don’t adhere to it. People will stop adhering to it if you bring in the measures way too early - e.g February, because they get fed up of being stuck indoors for weeks and weeks on end. You’d already have people on the streets by now thinking this is probably all over.if the lockdown had been brought in much earlier than it was.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I dont think you understand this. Bring in the lockdown earlier and it becomes easier to test and trace. The lock down is shorter, as cases reduce and measure can be lifted. Containment becomes easier.
Bring in the lockdown later and it last longer; as it becomes impossible to trace contact to contain and test all those with symptoms. The number of cases is high, the numbers in hospitals are high etc.
If you wanted a shorter lockdown, then it needed to be brought it sooner and testing needed to be increased. Unless you think this lockdown is now permanent until we have a vaccine, something you have vehemently argues against. Either way, you seem to disagree with the government approach despite rabidly attacking anyone who has an opinion that contrasts with the government strategy.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We didn’t have anywhere near enough testing capability to test and trace effectively during a lockdown initiated in February. In theory I totally get what you’re saying - in practice, very few western countries were effectively prepared for such a scenario
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wtf?
So your view is that we would definitely have enough testing capability once the virus has gone on and is spreading exponentially?
Fecking hell, this guy..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
What?! No that’s not what I’ve said. It’s a simple fact that we didn’t have the testing capability to do what Tamwolf has suggested. We are still well short of being able to track this virus effectively
posted on 6/4/20
comment by Gillespie Road. (U18361)
posted 9 seconds ago
comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Edward Elizabeth Hitler. (U14393)
posted 24 seconds ago
Anyone else planning on wfh till a cure is found ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think this will be the biggest long term change from this; more people will wfh. That being said, after a few years people tend to go back to the norm
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Quite a few employers are going to have a very hard time justifying all the office space they currently rent when this is over.
I'd be shaking in my boots right now if I was in the business of renting out office space.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Working on a pharma data project at the moment with folk in Netherlands and Ireland. All face to face meetings have been cancelled, and things are definitely moving slower. Don't see too many closing offices for good as that is disruptive but I suppose if cashflow becomes an issue people might.
posted on 6/4/20
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 12 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 25 seconds ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 40 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 26 minutes ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 8 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Robb, the fourth husband of Joe Exotic (U22311)
posted 34 seconds ago
Blackstarr’s MO..
Call everyone who disagrees with him a ‘medical expert’ and say that unless they really are one they couldn’t possibly be right.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s not me you’re disagreeing with - it’s epidemiologists and chief medical officers, not only in this country but in many others in terms of timing interventions to flatten the curve
I think it’s fair to say that a load of football fans (myself included) maybe aren’t best placed to calling the shots on an infectious disease outbreak.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because scientists and data modelling experts can't be football fans, and certainly can't go on sports forums. (!)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’m sure they can but I’m pretty sure none of you actually are
----------------------------------------------------------------------
... That's what you said. Deny it again if you must.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I haven’t seen anyone post their medical or scientific credentials on here which would back up what they are saying. If they care to elaborate then fair play I’m all ears
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You presumed to know everyone's vocation... when in fact you know jacksheet.
I haven't seen you post your birth certificate on here ergo you must be a bastrd.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Normally when someone makes a concerted argument about a subject that’s within their field of expertise - they tend to back it up. I’ll say it again, I don’t think Sandy, Sizzle, Robb, Edward (the leading lights on this debate) are experts in the spread of infectious diseases
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I guess according to you the views of those scientists that signed the letter calling for far more wide reaching and swifter action shouldn't be cited either then..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
They published that article a week before a full lockdown was implemented. They were right to post the article. They weren’t calling for that lockdown back in February though let’s be honest. They didn’t even post that at the beginning of March
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ah, so they only had that view a week before lockdown.. it just came go them in an epiphany and wasn't the result of any study or modelling. Just boom, one week before lockdown they all had the same mass epiphany.
Ok then.. if that's what you say you believe.
posted on 6/4/20
There's an awful amount of people looking at this crisis in the short term,which in some ways is understandable.
What is happening now,the timing of the lockdown,the daily death tolls,the stresses on the NHS etc will in probability be an afterthought in years to come.
The long term effects of this virus will kill more people than the 5,000 or so poor lost souls that it's already claimed.
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
This pandemic could go down in history as the biggest cause of deaths in modern times,but I would imagine a vast majority of those deaths will be due to the social and financial impacts that will happen in the years to come.
posted on 6/4/20
comment by Edward Elizabeth Hitler. (U14393)
posted 50 seconds ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 56 seconds ago
comment by Edward Elizabeth Hitler. (U14393)
posted 5 minutes ago
Anyone else planning on wfh till a cure is found ?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I can't as I work in critical medical supply. WFH some of the time but have to be on site a lot. Will be working throughout this.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Stay Safe
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Cheers. My company are pretty good. Implemented social distancing around the site, give us free breakfasts from the canteen, have a shopping list (with essentials like toilet roll, cheese etc) which we can order three items from each week and have delivered to our desks for free, increased PPE and bought in coronavirus testing for us (despite the government telling us they can't get it), they're installing thermal imaging on the turnstiles into site to test us before we enter etc.
Our development Lab have manufactured a massive batch of hand sanitizer (something they have never done before) and we all got a bottle, with the rest being donated to care homes and the NHS. The site have also donated 15 pallets of PPE (including masks with respirators) to the local hospital too.
I am actually much better treated by my multi national pharma company than the NHS staff are by the government, which is quite sad really.
posted on 6/4/20
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
---
Not sure on the 2015 total, but a 'flu season' is typically from late Autumn to early spring. The UK has recorded nearly 5,00 deaths from Covid in a month.
posted on 6/4/20
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 12 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 25 seconds ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 40 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 26 minutes ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 8 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Robb, the fourth husband of Joe Exotic (U22311)
posted 34 seconds ago
Blackstarr’s MO..
Call everyone who disagrees with him a ‘medical expert’ and say that unless they really are one they couldn’t possibly be right.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s not me you’re disagreeing with - it’s epidemiologists and chief medical officers, not only in this country but in many others in terms of timing interventions to flatten the curve
I think it’s fair to say that a load of football fans (myself included) maybe aren’t best placed to calling the shots on an infectious disease outbreak.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because scientists and data modelling experts can't be football fans, and certainly can't go on sports forums. (!)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’m sure they can but I’m pretty sure none of you actually are
----------------------------------------------------------------------
... That's what you said. Deny it again if you must.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I haven’t seen anyone post their medical or scientific credentials on here which would back up what they are saying. If they care to elaborate then fair play I’m all ears
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You presumed to know everyone's vocation... when in fact you know jacksheet.
I haven't seen you post your birth certificate on here ergo you must be a bastrd.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Normally when someone makes a concerted argument about a subject that’s within their field of expertise - they tend to back it up. I’ll say it again, I don’t think Sandy, Sizzle, Robb, Edward (the leading lights on this debate) are experts in the spread of infectious diseases
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I guess according to you the views of those scientists that signed the letter calling for far more wide reaching and swifter action shouldn't be cited either then..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
They published that article a week before a full lockdown was implemented. They were right to post the article. They weren’t calling for that lockdown back in February though let’s be honest. They didn’t even post that at the beginning of March
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ah, so they only had that view a week before lockdown.. it just came go them in an epiphany and wasn't the result of any study or modelling. Just boom, one week before lockdown they all had the same mass epiphany.
Ok then.. if that's what you say you believe.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’m saying if they had that view weeks before why not publish it weeks before?
posted on 6/4/20
comment by Bales (U22081)
posted 27 seconds ago
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
---
Not sure on the 2015 total, but a 'flu season' is typically from late Autumn to early spring. The UK has recorded nearly 5,00 deaths from Covid in a month.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
2015 flu season claimed 44,000 lives attributed to the flu,they reckon that more lives would have been lost as most often pnuemonia is often cited as cause of death to flu.This covid19 all deaths are attributed to this coronvirus strain and not down to secondary reasons of deaths,so the cause of death is skewed towards covid than flu
posted on 6/4/20
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 4 seconds ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 12 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 25 seconds ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 40 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 26 minutes ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 8 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Robb, the fourth husband of Joe Exotic (U22311)
posted 34 seconds ago
Blackstarr’s MO..
Call everyone who disagrees with him a ‘medical expert’ and say that unless they really are one they couldn’t possibly be right.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s not me you’re disagreeing with - it’s epidemiologists and chief medical officers, not only in this country but in many others in terms of timing interventions to flatten the curve
I think it’s fair to say that a load of football fans (myself included) maybe aren’t best placed to calling the shots on an infectious disease outbreak.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because scientists and data modelling experts can't be football fans, and certainly can't go on sports forums. (!)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’m sure they can but I’m pretty sure none of you actually are
----------------------------------------------------------------------
... That's what you said. Deny it again if you must.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I haven’t seen anyone post their medical or scientific credentials on here which would back up what they are saying. If they care to elaborate then fair play I’m all ears
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You presumed to know everyone's vocation... when in fact you know jacksheet.
I haven't seen you post your birth certificate on here ergo you must be a bastrd.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Normally when someone makes a concerted argument about a subject that’s within their field of expertise - they tend to back it up. I’ll say it again, I don’t think Sandy, Sizzle, Robb, Edward (the leading lights on this debate) are experts in the spread of infectious diseases
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I guess according to you the views of those scientists that signed the letter calling for far more wide reaching and swifter action shouldn't be cited either then..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
They published that article a week before a full lockdown was implemented. They were right to post the article. They weren’t calling for that lockdown back in February though let’s be honest. They didn’t even post that at the beginning of March
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ah, so they only had that view a week before lockdown.. it just came go them in an epiphany and wasn't the result of any study or modelling. Just boom, one week before lockdown they all had the same mass epiphany.
Ok then.. if that's what you say you believe.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’m saying if they had that view weeks before why not publish it weeks before?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So you're still contending that they may not have had those views before and just voiced them en masse without knowing how or why?
Do you know how ridiculous you sound? They voiced those concerns a full week before the government took action, they already had those views anyway.
You still maintain the government took the correct action, therefore you say these scientists (who's credentials haven't been displayed) were wrong in their timing, but then ask why they didn't voice their concerns even earlier.
You are facking 100% all over the place, aside from presuming to know every contributors competency on this thread, you want to maintain the government decisions were right and that wilfully shaking hands with corona patients is a wholly sensible thing to do and Boris Johnson shouldn't be criticised for it.
That he is in ICU taking up a bed space is right and proper and is in no way Boris Johnson's fault despite him having been one of the most informed people in Britain on this topic.
Jeezus facking christ.
posted on 6/4/20
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Bales (U22081)
posted 27 seconds ago
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
---
Not sure on the 2015 total, but a 'flu season' is typically from late Autumn to early spring. The UK has recorded nearly 5,00 deaths from Covid in a month.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
2015 flu season claimed 44,000 lives attributed to the flu,they reckon that more lives would have been lost as most often pnuemonia is often cited as cause of death to flu.This covid19 all deaths are attributed to this coronvirus strain and not down to secondary reasons of deaths,so the cause of death is skewed towards covid than flu
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh dear, not this again. During regular flu season ICUs don't collapse with blanket rules on the age of people who are worth treating brought in. This has already happened in Italy and Spain and appears to be happening in the UK despite the fact we're not at our initial peek yet.
posted on 6/4/20
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Bales (U22081)
posted 27 seconds ago
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
---
Not sure on the 2015 total, but a 'flu season' is typically from late Autumn to early spring. The UK has recorded nearly 5,00 deaths from Covid in a month.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
2015 flu season claimed 44,000 lives attributed to the flu,they reckon that more lives would have been lost as most often pnuemonia is often cited as cause of death to flu.This covid19 all deaths are attributed to this coronvirus strain and not down to secondary reasons of deaths,so the cause of death is skewed towards covid than flu
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh dear, not this again. During regular flu season ICUs don't collapse with blanket rules on the age of people who are worth treating brought in. This has already happened in Italy and Spain and appears to be happening in the UK despite the fact we're not at our initial peek yet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And if you want to be anecdotal, our PM is in an ICU. Which I've never seen with a seasonal flu.
posted on 6/4/20
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 4 seconds ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 12 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 25 seconds ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 40 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 26 minutes ago
comment by Redinthehead - FreeGaza - فلسطين (U1860)
posted 8 seconds ago
comment by Black Starr (U12353)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Robb, the fourth husband of Joe Exotic (U22311)
posted 34 seconds ago
Blackstarr’s MO..
Call everyone who disagrees with him a ‘medical expert’ and say that unless they really are one they couldn’t possibly be right.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s not me you’re disagreeing with - it’s epidemiologists and chief medical officers, not only in this country but in many others in terms of timing interventions to flatten the curve
I think it’s fair to say that a load of football fans (myself included) maybe aren’t best placed to calling the shots on an infectious disease outbreak.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because scientists and data modelling experts can't be football fans, and certainly can't go on sports forums. (!)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’m sure they can but I’m pretty sure none of you actually are
----------------------------------------------------------------------
... That's what you said. Deny it again if you must.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I haven’t seen anyone post their medical or scientific credentials on here which would back up what they are saying. If they care to elaborate then fair play I’m all ears
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You presumed to know everyone's vocation... when in fact you know jacksheet.
I haven't seen you post your birth certificate on here ergo you must be a bastrd.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Normally when someone makes a concerted argument about a subject that’s within their field of expertise - they tend to back it up. I’ll say it again, I don’t think Sandy, Sizzle, Robb, Edward (the leading lights on this debate) are experts in the spread of infectious diseases
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I guess according to you the views of those scientists that signed the letter calling for far more wide reaching and swifter action shouldn't be cited either then..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
They published that article a week before a full lockdown was implemented. They were right to post the article. They weren’t calling for that lockdown back in February though let’s be honest. They didn’t even post that at the beginning of March
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ah, so they only had that view a week before lockdown.. it just came go them in an epiphany and wasn't the result of any study or modelling. Just boom, one week before lockdown they all had the same mass epiphany.
Ok then.. if that's what you say you believe.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’m saying if they had that view weeks before why not publish it weeks before?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So you're still contending that they may not have had those views before and just voiced them en masse without knowing how or why?
Do you know how ridiculous you sound? They voiced those concerns a full week before the government took action, they already had those views anyway.
You still maintain the government took the correct action, therefore you say these scientists (who's credentials haven't been displayed) were wrong in their timing, but then ask why they didn't voice their concerns even earlier.
You are facking 100% all over the place, aside from presuming to know every contributors competency on this thread, you want to maintain the government decisions were right and that wilfully shaking hands with corona patients is a wholly sensible thing to do and Boris Johnson shouldn't be criticised for it.
That he is in ICU taking up a bed space is right and proper and is in no way Boris Johnson's fault despite him having been one of the most informed people in Britain on this topic.
Jeezus facking christ.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And you’re putting dozens of words in my mouth and leaping to ridiculous conclusions because you’re too busy trying to win an argument rather than debating in a reasoned way.
I think the scientists views were informed by a change in the modelling - very similar to the governments shift in strategy when Neil Ferguson advised on the huge impact on the NHS based on new and updated modelling. Back in February - it wasn’t as obvious as you now make it out to be, hence the reason very few leading experts (if any) were calling for a nationwide lockdown back then. Something changed - they realised the virus couldn’t be contained and traced any longer
Not saying the government got this all spot on, they didn’t, but they were advised by scientists (including behavioural scientists) and were probably a week too late with their measures. I don’t think that calls for a hysterical criticism of the government though and I can only conclude that party politics is behind that
We are dealing with something not seen in 100 years. Italy, France, Spain, now the US and today Japan are all behind the curve in tackling this disease. They are all badly prepared.
posted on 6/4/20
too damned bad whats happened to Boris won't happen to Trump.
On the other hand, since Trump won't wear a mask over his big mouth,.....maybe it will
posted on 6/4/20
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Bales (U22081)
posted 27 seconds ago
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
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Not sure on the 2015 total, but a 'flu season' is typically from late Autumn to early spring. The UK has recorded nearly 5,00 deaths from Covid in a month.
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2015 flu season claimed 44,000 lives attributed to the flu,they reckon that more lives would have been lost as most often pnuemonia is often cited as cause of death to flu.This covid19 all deaths are attributed to this coronvirus strain and not down to secondary reasons of deaths,so the cause of death is skewed towards covid than flu
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Oh dear, not this again. During regular flu season ICUs don't collapse with blanket rules on the age of people who are worth treating brought in. This has already happened in Italy and Spain and appears to be happening in the UK despite the fact we're not at our initial peek yet.
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As I said earlier,short term thinking.Look back to 5 years ago and look at the NHS being in crisis over the flu that Winter.
44,000 died,no industry was shut down,no schools either,millions weren't on furlough.
I hope I am wrong,but long term many more are going to suffer than those that will succomb to covid-19
posted on 6/4/20
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 5 seconds ago
There's an awful amount of people looking at this crisis in the short term,which in some ways is understandable.
What is happening now,the timing of the lockdown,the daily death tolls,the stresses on the NHS etc will in probability be an afterthought in years to come.
The long term effects of this virus will kill more people than the 5,000 or so poor lost souls that it's already claimed.
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
This pandemic could go down in history as the biggest cause of deaths in modern times,but I would imagine a vast majority of those deaths will be due to the social and financial impacts that will happen in the years to come.
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Now imagine if we simply half-arsed our response and let the virus run rampant.
First thing to grind to a halt would be our healthcare infrastructure. We wouldn't even have a peak situation to speak of. Just an exponentially rising death tally. Made worse by medical staff turning every non-Covid case away.
The rest of the population that stayed alive would then have to deal with being out of commission for 3-4 weeks at a time. Only to fall sick again as soon as they felt good enough to walk out the door. Progressively damaging their organs with every subsequent infection.
How long would the country be able to keep the lights on? How long before the military or the police ran out of men and ground to a halt? How long before no one is able to stay fit long enough to farm, man our power generation and water supply infrastructure or even collect the rubbish?
etc, etc
posted on 6/4/20
comment by Admin1 (U1)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Bales (U22081)
posted 27 seconds ago
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
---
Not sure on the 2015 total, but a 'flu season' is typically from late Autumn to early spring. The UK has recorded nearly 5,00 deaths from Covid in a month.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
2015 flu season claimed 44,000 lives attributed to the flu,they reckon that more lives would have been lost as most often pnuemonia is often cited as cause of death to flu.This covid19 all deaths are attributed to this coronvirus strain and not down to secondary reasons of deaths,so the cause of death is skewed towards covid than flu
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh dear, not this again. During regular flu season ICUs don't collapse with blanket rules on the age of people who are worth treating brought in. This has already happened in Italy and Spain and appears to be happening in the UK despite the fact we're not at our initial peek yet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And if you want to be anecdotal, our PM is in an ICU. Which I've never seen with a seasonal flu.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not seen a whole Country shut down to seasonal flu even when 44,000 people recorded(many not recorded)deaths in a single Winter
posted on 6/4/20
comment by Gillespie Road. (U18361)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 5 seconds ago
There's an awful amount of people looking at this crisis in the short term,which in some ways is understandable.
What is happening now,the timing of the lockdown,the daily death tolls,the stresses on the NHS etc will in probability be an afterthought in years to come.
The long term effects of this virus will kill more people than the 5,000 or so poor lost souls that it's already claimed.
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
This pandemic could go down in history as the biggest cause of deaths in modern times,but I would imagine a vast majority of those deaths will be due to the social and financial impacts that will happen in the years to come.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Now imagine if we simply half-arsed our response and let the virus run rampant.
First thing to grind to a halt would be our healthcare infrastructure. We wouldn't even have a peak situation to speak of. Just an exponentially rising death tally. Made worse by medical staff turning every non-Covid case away.
The rest of the population that stayed alive would then have to deal with being out of commission for 3-4 weeks at a time. Only to fall sick again as soon as they felt good enough to walk out the door. Progressively damaging their organs with every subsequent infection.
How long would the country be able to keep the lights on? How long before the military or the police ran out of men and ground to a halt? How long before no one is able to stay fit long enough to farm, man our power generation and water supply infrastructure or even collect the rubbish?
etc, etc
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Where have I said just let the virus run rampant!!!!
Don't attribute me to saying things that I haven't.I have just said that looking at things short term and arguing about putting a lock down a week earlier is neither here nor there.
Long term will be where the biggest effects of this virus will be felt.
posted on 6/4/20
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Admin1 (U1)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Bales (U22081)
posted 27 seconds ago
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
---
Not sure on the 2015 total, but a 'flu season' is typically from late Autumn to early spring. The UK has recorded nearly 5,00 deaths from Covid in a month.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
2015 flu season claimed 44,000 lives attributed to the flu,they reckon that more lives would have been lost as most often pnuemonia is often cited as cause of death to flu.This covid19 all deaths are attributed to this coronvirus strain and not down to secondary reasons of deaths,so the cause of death is skewed towards covid than flu
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh dear, not this again. During regular flu season ICUs don't collapse with blanket rules on the age of people who are worth treating brought in. This has already happened in Italy and Spain and appears to be happening in the UK despite the fact we're not at our initial peek yet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And if you want to be anecdotal, our PM is in an ICU. Which I've never seen with a seasonal flu.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not seen a whole Country shut down to seasonal flu even when 44,000 people recorded(many not recorded)deaths in a single Winter
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Around 22,000 'extra' deaths than the previous year.
I don't think it's useful to compare the two directly though, as you would have to run an experiment where we're not all social distancing etc.
Also, it's worth noting that it was a particularly bad year for the effectiveness of the vaccine, and news reports around that probably lowered the number of people having it that shouldve.
Still, the numbers do provide context which will hopefully ease some people's fears that this is some kind of apocalypse.
posted on 6/4/20
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 4 seconds ago
comment by Admin1 (U1)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Bales (U22081)
posted 27 seconds ago
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
---
Not sure on the 2015 total, but a 'flu season' is typically from late Autumn to early spring. The UK has recorded nearly 5,00 deaths from Covid in a month.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
2015 flu season claimed 44,000 lives attributed to the flu,they reckon that more lives would have been lost as most often pnuemonia is often cited as cause of death to flu.This covid19 all deaths are attributed to this coronvirus strain and not down to secondary reasons of deaths,so the cause of death is skewed towards covid than flu
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh dear, not this again. During regular flu season ICUs don't collapse with blanket rules on the age of people who are worth treating brought in. This has already happened in Italy and Spain and appears to be happening in the UK despite the fact we're not at our initial peek yet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And if you want to be anecdotal, our PM is in an ICU. Which I've never seen with a seasonal flu.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not seen a whole Country shut down to seasonal flu even when 44,000 people recorded(many not recorded)deaths in a single Winter
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah this is because covid is five to ten times more deadly. Is more infectious and has a higher incidence of complication requiring medical attention. It's a shiitsandwich for any government to handle. My brother in law just spent half a million quid on roughly 15 ventilators for his hospital. And those who are hooked up don't even have a 50/50 chance. It's grim.
posted on 6/4/20
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Admin1 (U1)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Colemanballs (U22246)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Bales (U22081)
posted 27 seconds ago
The increase in the normal rate of death for this country over the last 8-10 weeks is barely a blip.It's actually less than the last bad flu season of 2015.
---
Not sure on the 2015 total, but a 'flu season' is typically from late Autumn to early spring. The UK has recorded nearly 5,00 deaths from Covid in a month.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
2015 flu season claimed 44,000 lives attributed to the flu,they reckon that more lives would have been lost as most often pnuemonia is often cited as cause of death to flu.This covid19 all deaths are attributed to this coronvirus strain and not down to secondary reasons of deaths,so the cause of death is skewed towards covid than flu
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh dear, not this again. During regular flu season ICUs don't collapse with blanket rules on the age of people who are worth treating brought in. This has already happened in Italy and Spain and appears to be happening in the UK despite the fact we're not at our initial peek yet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And if you want to be anecdotal, our PM is in an ICU. Which I've never seen with a seasonal flu.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not seen a whole Country shut down to seasonal flu even when 44,000 people recorded(many not recorded)deaths in a single Winter
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Now imagine how bad the mortality rate of the flu, road accidents, cancer, diabetes ...etc would be if our healthcare infrastructure ground to a halt because we allowed some new untreatable virus to run amok.
posted on 6/4/20
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 6/4/20
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 6/4/20
comment by Poolmyfinger (U12438)
posted 1 second ago
ANYWAY...I hope Boris pulls through and gets back on his feet soon
Isn't he going to be a father soon? It would be quite sad if he doesn't make it and never gets to meet his child.
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It would be a huge blow to the UK to his family and his children. I'm hopeful he will be back in number ten soon.
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