comment by CurrentlyIntheUK (U11181)
posted 32 seconds ago
The silencing of the whistleblower doctors was a royal fackup, but it was ordered by local authorities, not the central government: as soon as the story emerged, Beijing sacked the local head of the CCP responsible for the arrests.
------
China has local, regional/provincial, and national/central levels of government. Usually, those in positions of power try to contain or cover up such things in order to position in power.
There was an issue not too long ago with pigs from one area affected with a disease covered up the illness until others noticed it. The local government, in order to protect the locals economy didn't say anything until too late. This seems a common thing with the local governments in China.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Then you can imagine what its like for foreign or international institutions when dealing with China. They do it to themselves, they'll do it worse to others. With WHO having no real powers to enable them to proceed on their own then things will never change.
comment by ttliv87 (U11882)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by ttliv87 (U11882)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 46 seconds ago
comment by ttliv87 (U11882)
posted 15 seconds ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by ttliv87 (U11882)
posted 13 minutes ago
China is the closest thing to National Socialist we have seen since Hitler, but because it's minorities doing it, the left is completely fine with it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Goodwin's Law
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nice deflection
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not deflection at all. There is no point entering a discussion with someone who thinks Hitler was a socialist.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok that's not Goodwin's law anyway. I'm not calling him a socialist he was more of a centrist I'm calling him by the party he was in which was National Socialist party.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Hitler was a centrist?
So nothing like China then? They are national socialists who aren't in a party called that. Hitler was in a party called the national socialist party but wasn't a socialist. So your admitting your comparison was bollox.
It is Godwin's Law. If a discussion goes on for long enough, someone will make a comparison to Hitler. You win.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You actually think China are socialist? They wouldn't have so many footballers earning tens of millions per year if that were the case. Like the Na zis they call themselves socialists or Communist but are not, they have fully embraced the free market where it suits them. China are like the Na zis in that they are an actual fascist country.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You probably need to go back and read my original post, where I answered someone calling them communist. I stated that they were not communist because the private sector earns the majority of their GDP, however the private sector is also more open to government intervention than elsewhere in the world (which is a socialist priniciple). I actually called them nationalist with socialist tendencies; as their main aim is to make China great.
Modern socialism is generally defined by government intervention into private markets. If you think it owns all the means of production then you are actually thinking of communism. Interesting that you think Corbyn is a socialist though, but not China.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
Trump v Biden debates are gonna be great, 2 senile rapists, it really is a choice between a douche and a tuurd.
comment by CurrentlyIntheUK (U11181)
posted 11 minutes ago
The silencing of the whistleblower doctors was a royal fackup, but it was ordered by local authorities, not the central government: as soon as the story emerged, Beijing sacked the local head of the CCP responsible for the arrests.
------
China has local, regional/provincial, and national/central levels of government. Usually, those in positions of power try to contain or cover up such things in order to position in power.
There was an issue not too long ago with pigs from one area affected with a disease covered up the illness until others noticed it. The local government, in order to protect the locals economy didn't say anything until too late. This seems a common thing with the local governments in China.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I imagine that lower level officials are eager to please those higher up, who will in turn look for someone lower down the chain of command to blame for any cock-ups.
I suppose too that the ones lower down will often act on their own initiative so as not to inconvenience their superiors or simply to point score.
Up to that point, it's probably a common trait in human behavior and you'll find similar happening in our societies.
The big difference is that, even though they don't always work, we have checks and balances in place aimed at reducing abuse of power and at encouraging transparency in decision-making. The same checks and balances that some of our more authoritarian leaders are desperate to dismantle.
comment by ttliv87 (U11882)
posted 38 minutes ago
comment by Sergio Marquina (U11781)
posted 9 minutes ago
Tiittty isn’t the brightest when it comes to politics, he’s your bog standard Tory that infest the country these days.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Tamwolf is a much better debater than me. He is an expert at picking the irrelevant things that have nothing to do with the main argument, then fully going down that path to disrupt the debate. I'm not practised in that trickery yet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You mean I'm an expert in answering your posts based on what you say?
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 5 minutes ago
If the WHO have no real powers and just copy and paste what countries tell them, why were the US paying them 400 million dollars?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The US doesn't "pay them" It is financed by contributions from members and donors.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Health_Organization#Financing_and_partnerships
https://www.who.int/about/who-we-are/structure
comment by Scouze Doggie Dog (U22357)
posted 22 minutes ago
comment by CurrentlyIntheUK (U11181)
posted 32 seconds ago
The silencing of the whistleblower doctors was a royal fackup, but it was ordered by local authorities, not the central government: as soon as the story emerged, Beijing sacked the local head of the CCP responsible for the arrests.
------
China has local, regional/provincial, and national/central levels of government. Usually, those in positions of power try to contain or cover up such things in order to position in power.
There was an issue not too long ago with pigs from one area affected with a disease covered up the illness until others noticed it. The local government, in order to protect the locals economy didn't say anything until too late. This seems a common thing with the local governments in China.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Then you can imagine what its like for foreign or international institutions when dealing with China. They do it to themselves, they'll do it worse to others. With WHO having no real powers to enable them to proceed on their own then things will never change.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think the lack of knowledge of how the Chinese government functions at different levels is an issue for some discussing this issue.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 15 minutes ago
Trump v Biden debates are gonna be great, 2 senile rapists, it really is a choice between a douche and a tuurd.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And Biden
I think it’s best to focus on the here and now and we can save all the finger pointing and difficult questions once we get through this.
-
Sizzle comes through with the most ironic comment in the history of JA606
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 34 minutes ago
If the WHO have no real powers and just copy and paste what countries tell them, why were the US paying them 400 million dollars?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because there's other diseases apart from Covid. The WHO has dealt excellently with diseases like Malaria. We even have a chance of eliminating Malaria. They are doing a great job all over the world when allowed to do so. They have the will
When it comes to stuff like Covid, the conversation is infested and infected by politics and we all know what politics does. They bring out the statutes and charters, made by them to take away control from the WHO and to give them said control over such situations. You're suddenly toeing a fine line.
Politics is how China can control the leadership of the WHO, which the Chinese see as expanding their influence when really they are playing with the health of the world.
Most concerning thing is that this virus - from what we currently know - isn't THAT deadly yet after a month several major nations are crippled and considering sending their lambs back for slaughter way before the first lot have all been killed. We've got projections already suggesting the economic impact will be almost unimaginably severe.
Our current model is clearly not fit for purpose at all, it's stupidly fragile. In the likely event something more deadly comes along it'll crumble over night (assuming it survives this current crisis)
comment by The Lambeau Leap (U21050)
posted 18 minutes ago
I think it’s best to focus on the here and now and we can save all the finger pointing and difficult questions once we get through this.
-
Sizzle comes through with the most ironic comment in the history of JA606
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah...like anyone wants for facts on here
his caaaaantiness knows no bounds. its remarkable really
He'll 100% get a second term
....
No he won’t.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
WHO under their previous leadership vigorously contested any figures during the SARS outbreak, and clearly didn't do so with this outbreak.
They did fail to address Taiwan's concerns and that is an issue, noting China's funding and the current China/Taiwan situation. Would further validation have prevented some deaths? Almost certainly.
Is trump a moron who has made countless errors? Sure
comment by ttliv87 (U11882)
posted 2 hours, 13 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 46 seconds ago
comment by ttliv87 (U11882)
posted 15 seconds ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by ttliv87 (U11882)
posted 13 minutes ago
China is the closest thing to National Socialist we have seen since Hitler, but because it's minorities doing it, the left is completely fine with it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Goodwin's Law
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nice deflection
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not deflection at all. There is no point entering a discussion with someone who thinks Hitler was a socialist.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok that's not Goodwin's law anyway. I'm not calling him a socialist he was more of a centrist I'm calling him by the party he was in which was National Socialist party.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Are you serious here? Hitler a centrist….embarrassing.
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 2 minutes ago
He'll 100% get a second term
....
No he won’t.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
He will. He’s the Mourinho of the world leaders. The rest of the league and their fans hates him but his own followers will back him to the hilt.
How this will pan out in my opinion is as follows.
- Trump cuts funding to WHO and blames them for the number of deaths worldwide. The money saved will either stay in the treasury or be spent on additional PPE for the US saving lives
- WHO with a reduced income can no longer supply poorer countries with vital PPE when they are inevitably hit by Covid19
- Hundred’s of thousands more die outside of the US
- Trump is “justified” in his decision over the “corrupt” WHO
comment by CurrentlyIntheUK (U11181)
posted 2 hours ago
Tamwolf has made many sensible comments here.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
He will definitely get re-elected.
Despite his every action requiring accountability, he has managed to bend reality to his will. His behaviour has become so acceptable, it's frightening.
His propaganda video will be updated and played throughout the next few months, while the stimulus cheques will have his name forced on there.
I detest everything he does, but he knows what his supporters will absorb.
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 9 minutes ago
He'll 100% get a second term
....
No he won’t.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Hard to call. No one really thought he stood a chance against Hilary.
He's survived situations which would have ended most political careers, and raised incompetence to new levels. Yet, dispute his abject failure to govern, and narcissistic disposition, his core support seems to be undeterred.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
comment by Cal Neva (U11544)
posted 34 seconds ago
Trumpism is a cult
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sign in if you want to comment
Trump suspending WHO contribution
Page 6 of 22
7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11
posted on 15/4/20
comment by CurrentlyIntheUK (U11181)
posted 32 seconds ago
The silencing of the whistleblower doctors was a royal fackup, but it was ordered by local authorities, not the central government: as soon as the story emerged, Beijing sacked the local head of the CCP responsible for the arrests.
------
China has local, regional/provincial, and national/central levels of government. Usually, those in positions of power try to contain or cover up such things in order to position in power.
There was an issue not too long ago with pigs from one area affected with a disease covered up the illness until others noticed it. The local government, in order to protect the locals economy didn't say anything until too late. This seems a common thing with the local governments in China.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Then you can imagine what its like for foreign or international institutions when dealing with China. They do it to themselves, they'll do it worse to others. With WHO having no real powers to enable them to proceed on their own then things will never change.
posted on 15/4/20
comment by ttliv87 (U11882)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by ttliv87 (U11882)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 46 seconds ago
comment by ttliv87 (U11882)
posted 15 seconds ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by ttliv87 (U11882)
posted 13 minutes ago
China is the closest thing to National Socialist we have seen since Hitler, but because it's minorities doing it, the left is completely fine with it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Goodwin's Law
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nice deflection
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not deflection at all. There is no point entering a discussion with someone who thinks Hitler was a socialist.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok that's not Goodwin's law anyway. I'm not calling him a socialist he was more of a centrist I'm calling him by the party he was in which was National Socialist party.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Hitler was a centrist?
So nothing like China then? They are national socialists who aren't in a party called that. Hitler was in a party called the national socialist party but wasn't a socialist. So your admitting your comparison was bollox.
It is Godwin's Law. If a discussion goes on for long enough, someone will make a comparison to Hitler. You win.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You actually think China are socialist? They wouldn't have so many footballers earning tens of millions per year if that were the case. Like the Na zis they call themselves socialists or Communist but are not, they have fully embraced the free market where it suits them. China are like the Na zis in that they are an actual fascist country.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You probably need to go back and read my original post, where I answered someone calling them communist. I stated that they were not communist because the private sector earns the majority of their GDP, however the private sector is also more open to government intervention than elsewhere in the world (which is a socialist priniciple). I actually called them nationalist with socialist tendencies; as their main aim is to make China great.
Modern socialism is generally defined by government intervention into private markets. If you think it owns all the means of production then you are actually thinking of communism. Interesting that you think Corbyn is a socialist though, but not China.
posted on 15/4/20
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 15/4/20
Trump v Biden debates are gonna be great, 2 senile rapists, it really is a choice between a douche and a tuurd.
posted on 15/4/20
comment by CurrentlyIntheUK (U11181)
posted 11 minutes ago
The silencing of the whistleblower doctors was a royal fackup, but it was ordered by local authorities, not the central government: as soon as the story emerged, Beijing sacked the local head of the CCP responsible for the arrests.
------
China has local, regional/provincial, and national/central levels of government. Usually, those in positions of power try to contain or cover up such things in order to position in power.
There was an issue not too long ago with pigs from one area affected with a disease covered up the illness until others noticed it. The local government, in order to protect the locals economy didn't say anything until too late. This seems a common thing with the local governments in China.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I imagine that lower level officials are eager to please those higher up, who will in turn look for someone lower down the chain of command to blame for any cock-ups.
I suppose too that the ones lower down will often act on their own initiative so as not to inconvenience their superiors or simply to point score.
Up to that point, it's probably a common trait in human behavior and you'll find similar happening in our societies.
The big difference is that, even though they don't always work, we have checks and balances in place aimed at reducing abuse of power and at encouraging transparency in decision-making. The same checks and balances that some of our more authoritarian leaders are desperate to dismantle.
posted on 15/4/20
comment by ttliv87 (U11882)
posted 38 minutes ago
comment by Sergio Marquina (U11781)
posted 9 minutes ago
Tiittty isn’t the brightest when it comes to politics, he’s your bog standard Tory that infest the country these days.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Tamwolf is a much better debater than me. He is an expert at picking the irrelevant things that have nothing to do with the main argument, then fully going down that path to disrupt the debate. I'm not practised in that trickery yet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You mean I'm an expert in answering your posts based on what you say?
posted on 15/4/20
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 5 minutes ago
If the WHO have no real powers and just copy and paste what countries tell them, why were the US paying them 400 million dollars?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The US doesn't "pay them" It is financed by contributions from members and donors.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Health_Organization#Financing_and_partnerships
https://www.who.int/about/who-we-are/structure
posted on 15/4/20
comment by Scouze Doggie Dog (U22357)
posted 22 minutes ago
comment by CurrentlyIntheUK (U11181)
posted 32 seconds ago
The silencing of the whistleblower doctors was a royal fackup, but it was ordered by local authorities, not the central government: as soon as the story emerged, Beijing sacked the local head of the CCP responsible for the arrests.
------
China has local, regional/provincial, and national/central levels of government. Usually, those in positions of power try to contain or cover up such things in order to position in power.
There was an issue not too long ago with pigs from one area affected with a disease covered up the illness until others noticed it. The local government, in order to protect the locals economy didn't say anything until too late. This seems a common thing with the local governments in China.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Then you can imagine what its like for foreign or international institutions when dealing with China. They do it to themselves, they'll do it worse to others. With WHO having no real powers to enable them to proceed on their own then things will never change.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think the lack of knowledge of how the Chinese government functions at different levels is an issue for some discussing this issue.
posted on 15/4/20
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 15/4/20
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 15 minutes ago
Trump v Biden debates are gonna be great, 2 senile rapists, it really is a choice between a douche and a tuurd.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And Biden
posted on 15/4/20
I think it’s best to focus on the here and now and we can save all the finger pointing and difficult questions once we get through this.
-
Sizzle comes through with the most ironic comment in the history of JA606
posted on 15/4/20
comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 34 minutes ago
If the WHO have no real powers and just copy and paste what countries tell them, why were the US paying them 400 million dollars?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because there's other diseases apart from Covid. The WHO has dealt excellently with diseases like Malaria. We even have a chance of eliminating Malaria. They are doing a great job all over the world when allowed to do so. They have the will
When it comes to stuff like Covid, the conversation is infested and infected by politics and we all know what politics does. They bring out the statutes and charters, made by them to take away control from the WHO and to give them said control over such situations. You're suddenly toeing a fine line.
Politics is how China can control the leadership of the WHO, which the Chinese see as expanding their influence when really they are playing with the health of the world.
posted on 15/4/20
Most concerning thing is that this virus - from what we currently know - isn't THAT deadly yet after a month several major nations are crippled and considering sending their lambs back for slaughter way before the first lot have all been killed. We've got projections already suggesting the economic impact will be almost unimaginably severe.
Our current model is clearly not fit for purpose at all, it's stupidly fragile. In the likely event something more deadly comes along it'll crumble over night (assuming it survives this current crisis)
posted on 15/4/20
comment by The Lambeau Leap (U21050)
posted 18 minutes ago
I think it’s best to focus on the here and now and we can save all the finger pointing and difficult questions once we get through this.
-
Sizzle comes through with the most ironic comment in the history of JA606
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah...like anyone wants for facts on here
posted on 15/4/20
his caaaaantiness knows no bounds. its remarkable really
posted on 15/4/20
He'll 100% get a second term
....
No he won’t.
posted on 15/4/20
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 15/4/20
WHO under their previous leadership vigorously contested any figures during the SARS outbreak, and clearly didn't do so with this outbreak.
They did fail to address Taiwan's concerns and that is an issue, noting China's funding and the current China/Taiwan situation. Would further validation have prevented some deaths? Almost certainly.
Is trump a moron who has made countless errors? Sure
posted on 15/4/20
comment by ttliv87 (U11882)
posted 2 hours, 13 minutes ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 46 seconds ago
comment by ttliv87 (U11882)
posted 15 seconds ago
comment by Tamwolf (U17286)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by ttliv87 (U11882)
posted 13 minutes ago
China is the closest thing to National Socialist we have seen since Hitler, but because it's minorities doing it, the left is completely fine with it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Goodwin's Law
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nice deflection
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not deflection at all. There is no point entering a discussion with someone who thinks Hitler was a socialist.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok that's not Goodwin's law anyway. I'm not calling him a socialist he was more of a centrist I'm calling him by the party he was in which was National Socialist party.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Are you serious here? Hitler a centrist….embarrassing.
posted on 15/4/20
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 2 minutes ago
He'll 100% get a second term
....
No he won’t.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
He will. He’s the Mourinho of the world leaders. The rest of the league and their fans hates him but his own followers will back him to the hilt.
How this will pan out in my opinion is as follows.
- Trump cuts funding to WHO and blames them for the number of deaths worldwide. The money saved will either stay in the treasury or be spent on additional PPE for the US saving lives
- WHO with a reduced income can no longer supply poorer countries with vital PPE when they are inevitably hit by Covid19
- Hundred’s of thousands more die outside of the US
- Trump is “justified” in his decision over the “corrupt” WHO
posted on 15/4/20
comment by CurrentlyIntheUK (U11181)
posted 2 hours ago
Tamwolf has made many sensible comments here.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
posted on 15/4/20
He will definitely get re-elected.
Despite his every action requiring accountability, he has managed to bend reality to his will. His behaviour has become so acceptable, it's frightening.
His propaganda video will be updated and played throughout the next few months, while the stimulus cheques will have his name forced on there.
I detest everything he does, but he knows what his supporters will absorb.
posted on 15/4/20
comment by Vidicschin (U3584)
posted 9 minutes ago
He'll 100% get a second term
....
No he won’t.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Hard to call. No one really thought he stood a chance against Hilary.
He's survived situations which would have ended most political careers, and raised incompetence to new levels. Yet, dispute his abject failure to govern, and narcissistic disposition, his core support seems to be undeterred.
posted on 15/4/20
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 15/4/20
comment by Cal Neva (U11544)
posted 34 seconds ago
Trumpism is a cult
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Page 6 of 22
7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11