comment by NJS (U8272)
posted 24 minutes ago
comment by Barf Vader (U15867)
posted 12 minutes ago
comment by NJS (U8272)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Barf Vader (U15867)
posted 3 minutes ago
Ferguson was undoubtedly a great manager but he employed intimidation to officials to achieve results

-----------------------------------------------------------

Always makes me giggle this. Always one that pipes up with it.

Imagine a fit and healthy 30 or 40 something being intimidated by an OAP. What was Fergie going to do to them?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh come on it wasn't anything to do with physical intimidation more to do with the career prospects of officials...I'm sure the officials didn't think it was a giggle!
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Seriously? Again, what was Fergie going to do?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well seriously already alluded to the consequences of intimidation of officials if you read back...and are seriously denying Ferguson didn't intimidate officials, as my friend Cal posted, ref to the psychological aspect Ferguson employed?
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Are there examples of this intimidation? What were the consequences? Are there examples of these consequences?

My admiration for Revie is that he achieved great success at Leeds because it was his only club...in that success can be measured from the relative obscurity of the club when he took over to one of the best teams in Europe over a decade or so, as well as leaving a legacy that can be seen many decades later.

Clough was another great manager who achieved success at clubs that were not exactly famous for winning trophies, didn't have prestige of being 'big clubs'....

Just two titles for Clough in over 20 years in management. Comparing Clough to Fergie is unfair, due to financial reasons, though lets not forget Clough did break the world transfer record.

Because they're from the distant past they get a little overlooked. But look at what Sirs Matt and Alf achieved they deserve to be near the top.
But Fergie has to be No 1,his record is unmatched.

comment by Barf Vader (U15867)
posted 6 seconds ago
comment by NJS (U8272)
posted 24 minutes ago
comment by Barf Vader (U15867)
posted 12 minutes ago
comment by NJS (U8272)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Barf Vader (U15867)
posted 3 minutes ago
Ferguson was undoubtedly a great manager but he employed intimidation to officials to achieve results

-----------------------------------------------------------

Always makes me giggle this. Always one that pipes up with it.

Imagine a fit and healthy 30 or 40 something being intimidated by an OAP. What was Fergie going to do to them?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh come on it wasn't anything to do with physical intimidation more to do with the career prospects of officials...I'm sure the officials didn't think it was a giggle!
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Seriously? Again, what was Fergie going to do?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well seriously already alluded to the consequences of intimidation of officials if you read back...and are seriously denying Ferguson didn't intimidate officials, as my friend Cal posted, ref to the psychological aspect Ferguson employed?
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Are there examples of this intimidation? What were the consequences? Are there examples of these consequences?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Extra timing by officials which enabled his team to take advantage of...was 'Fergie time' just a figment of the imagination of the opposition, l don't think so!
His players frequently intimidated officials, a legacy that's still with us today, why the authorities are so lenient on this collective behaviour is a mystery to me,
but these aspects have already been alluded to...

Great managers such as Ferguson are not perfect managers if you look at other aspects such as transfer policies...how much money have Manchester United thrown at buying players, always inflating transfers and salaries, many of these bought players have been a waste of money which again continues to the present day...not so much an astute transfer policy, more a vanity project.

Yes, great shout! Alf Ramsey deserves the accolade of great manager!!

comment by Barf Vader (U15867)
posted 22 minutes ago
comment by NJS (U8272)
posted 24 minutes ago
comment by Barf Vader (U15867)
posted 12 minutes ago
comment by NJS (U8272)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Barf Vader (U15867)
posted 3 minutes ago
Ferguson was undoubtedly a great manager but he employed intimidation to officials to achieve results

-----------------------------------------------------------

Always makes me giggle this. Always one that pipes up with it.

Imagine a fit and healthy 30 or 40 something being intimidated by an OAP. What was Fergie going to do to them?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh come on it wasn't anything to do with physical intimidation more to do with the career prospects of officials...I'm sure the officials didn't think it was a giggle!
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Seriously? Again, what was Fergie going to do?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well seriously already alluded to the consequences of intimidation of officials if you read back...and are seriously denying Ferguson didn't intimidate officials, as my friend Cal posted, ref to the psychological aspect Ferguson employed?
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Are there examples of this intimidation? What were the consequences? Are there examples of these consequences?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
However, Michael Crick's book The Boss turned up a revealing tale from Fergie's dim and distant. After he was sacked by St Mirren he took them to an industrial tribunal and was counter-accused of intimidating behaviour towards his office secretary because he wanted players to get some expenses tax free. He blanked her for six weeks, confiscated her keys and communicated only through a 17-year-old secretarial assistant. The tribunal concluded that Ferguson was "particularly petty" and "immature".

comment by Cal Neva (U11544)
posted 1 hour, 59 minutes ago
Clough stands out for me. Any manager that could take a team like Forest to two European cup wins despite having alcohol issues must be special.
----------------------------------------------------------------------


Definitely - anyone who did what he did with the resources at hand - truly magical

Whilst the likes of Paisley & Ferguson....Ferguson particularly were brilliant in what they created and achieved, they did it in the back of an already built empire - both Liverpool and Man Utd had resources, finances and a support base as big as a where in the world

Clough achieved what he did with 2 small, unfashionable clubs, and built them BOTH to be the best in the Country, and with Forest, the best in Europe...TWICE

that’s what sets him apart as being the best

But he won’t get voted the best on here, purely because the amount of Liverpool and Man Utd supporters voting on here

But as Graham Souness has openly admitted, what Clough did with Forest is the greatest Footballing achievement of all time 👍🏼

Says it all really

comment by Barefoot (U19770)
posted 18 minutes ago
Just two titles for Clough in over 20 years in management. Comparing Clough to Fergie is unfair, due to financial reasons, though lets not forget Clough did break the world transfer record.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Promotion and title with unfashionable club derby.
Loads of titles and cups with another unfashionable club forest.

comment by NJS (U8272)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Barf Vader (U15867)
posted 6 seconds ago
comment by NJS (U8272)
posted 24 minutes ago
comment by Barf Vader (U15867)
posted 12 minutes ago
comment by NJS (U8272)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Barf Vader (U15867)
posted 3 minutes ago
Ferguson was undoubtedly a great manager but he employed intimidation to officials to achieve results

-----------------------------------------------------------

Always makes me giggle this. Always one that pipes up with it.

Imagine a fit and healthy 30 or 40 something being intimidated by an OAP. What was Fergie going to do to them?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh come on it wasn't anything to do with physical intimidation more to do with the career prospects of officials...I'm sure the officials didn't think it was a giggle!
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Seriously? Again, what was Fergie going to do?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well seriously already alluded to the consequences of intimidation of officials if you read back...and are seriously denying Ferguson didn't intimidate officials, as my friend Cal posted, ref to the psychological aspect Ferguson employed?
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Are there examples of this intimidation? What were the consequences? Are there examples of these consequences?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Extra timing by officials which enabled his team to take advantage of...was 'Fergie time' just a figment of the imagination of the opposition, l don't think so!
His players frequently intimidated officials, a legacy that's still with us today, why the authorities are so lenient on this collective behaviour is a mystery to me,
but these aspects have already been alluded to...

Great managers such as Ferguson are not perfect managers if you look at other aspects such as transfer policies...how much money have Manchester United thrown at buying players, always inflating transfers and salaries, many of these bought players have been a waste of money which again continues to the present day...not so much an astute transfer policy, more a vanity project.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Every club /manager will make bad buys over a 25 year period, of course Fergie wasn't perfect, unlokr who?
The records show Fergie time didn't exist.
Fergie will win bec he's the best.

comment by manusince52 (U9692)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by NJS (U8272)
posted 6 minutes ago
comment by Barf Vader (U15867)
posted 6 seconds ago
comment by NJS (U8272)
posted 24 minutes ago
comment by Barf Vader (U15867)
posted 12 minutes ago
comment by NJS (U8272)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Barf Vader (U15867)
posted 3 minutes ago
Ferguson was undoubtedly a great manager but he employed intimidation to officials to achieve results

-----------------------------------------------------------

Always makes me giggle this. Always one that pipes up with it.

Imagine a fit and healthy 30 or 40 something being intimidated by an OAP. What was Fergie going to do to them?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh come on it wasn't anything to do with physical intimidation more to do with the career prospects of officials...I'm sure the officials didn't think it was a giggle!
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Seriously? Again, what was Fergie going to do?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well seriously already alluded to the consequences of intimidation of officials if you read back...and are seriously denying Ferguson didn't intimidate officials, as my friend Cal posted, ref to the psychological aspect Ferguson employed?
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Are there examples of this intimidation? What were the consequences? Are there examples of these consequences?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Extra timing by officials which enabled his team to take advantage of...was 'Fergie time' just a figment of the imagination of the opposition, l don't think so!
His players frequently intimidated officials, a legacy that's still with us today, why the authorities are so lenient on this collective behaviour is a mystery to me,
but these aspects have already been alluded to...

Great managers such as Ferguson are not perfect managers if you look at other aspects such as transfer policies...how much money have Manchester United thrown at buying players, always inflating transfers and salaries, many of these bought players have been a waste of money which again continues to the present day...not so much an astute transfer policy, more a vanity project.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Every club /manager will make bad buys over a 25 year period, of course Fergie wasn't perfect, unlokr who?
The records show Fergie time didn't exist.
Fergie will win bec he's the best.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok then 😀

What Clough did with Derby and Forest was extraordinary. He achieved more, with less, than any manager in the history of the game.

But it is hard to look beyond Sir Alex Ferguson.

comment by Scarf (U21116)
posted 2 minutes ago
What Clough did with Derby and Forest was extraordinary. He achieved more, with less, than any manager in the history of the game.

But it is hard to look beyond Sir Alex Ferguson.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Hell of an achievement, but you can easily argue jock stein with 11 local boys winning the european cup was better, and I’ve always thought fergie s greatest achievement was winning 2 European trophies with aberdeen. With the treble he spent millions to build that team, he didn’t have that at Aberdeen.

comment by Scarf (U21116)
posted 5 minutes ago
What Clough did with Derby and Forest was extraordinary. He achieved more, with less, than any manager in the history of the game.

But it is hard to look beyond Sir Alex Ferguson.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Cloughie was a great and idiosyncratic manager. But he didn't do it with nothing. He bought a goalie and striker at record prices.

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

comment by Cal Neva (U11544)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by manusince52 (U9692)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Scarf (U21116)
posted 5 minutes ago
What Clough did with Derby and Forest was extraordinary. He achieved more, with less, than any manager in the history of the game.

But it is hard to look beyond Sir Alex Ferguson.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Cloughie was a great and idiosyncratic manager. But he didn't do it with nothing. He bought a goalie and striker at record prices.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Only because of his success alone.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Correct.
He generated wealth thru success, invested in the team and repeat...

Amazing achievements.

comment by Cal Neva (U11544)
posted 2 hours, 9 minutes ago
comment by Barefoot (U19770)
posted 6 minutes ago
Fergie was a success in Scotland as well, winning a couple of titles and a European trophy.

I watched The Damned Utd the other night (for the 2nd time). Clough doesn't come out of it to well, but Revie even worse. I know it's a film, needed to be taken with a pinch of salt, btw!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's because it was a work of fiction.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I watched the actual TV interview with Austin Mitchell last night as I just came across it on YouTube, Clough comes across as very submissive towards Revie in that unlike the film version
Anyway getting away from the point, I think Clough’s achievements with forest elevate him above Revie, however, anyone saying anyone other than SAF is the best of that list is just bitter or tribal

comment by Scarf (U21116)
posted 10 seconds ago
comment by Cal Neva (U11544)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by manusince52 (U9692)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Scarf (U21116)
posted 5 minutes ago
What Clough did with Derby and Forest was extraordinary. He achieved more, with less, than any manager in the history of the game.

But it is hard to look beyond Sir Alex Ferguson.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Cloughie was a great and idiosyncratic manager. But he didn't do it with nothing. He bought a goalie and striker at record prices.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Only because of his success alone.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Correct.
He generated wealth thru success, invested in the team and repeat...

Amazing achievements.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Without the foundations of an empire behind him - the likes of which Ferguson has at his disposal

comment by Geoff Tipps (U1449)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Cal Neva (U11544)
posted 2 hours, 9 minutes ago
comment by Barefoot (U19770)
posted 6 minutes ago
Fergie was a success in Scotland as well, winning a couple of titles and a European trophy.

I watched The Damned Utd the other night (for the 2nd time). Clough doesn't come out of it to well, but Revie even worse. I know it's a film, needed to be taken with a pinch of salt, btw!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's because it was a work of fiction.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I watched the actual TV interview with Austin Mitchell last night as I just came across it on YouTube, Clough comes across as very submissive towards Revie in that unlike the film version
Anyway getting away from the point, I think Clough’s achievements with forest elevate him above Revie, however, anyone saying anyone other than SAF is the best of that list is just bitter or tribal
----------------------------------------------------------------------
coming from a Man Utd Supporter

CLASSIC

comment by ThE ReVoLuTiOn Is HeRe (U22182)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Scarf (U21116)
posted 10 seconds ago
comment by Cal Neva (U11544)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by manusince52 (U9692)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Scarf (U21116)
posted 5 minutes ago
What Clough did with Derby and Forest was extraordinary. He achieved more, with less, than any manager in the history of the game.

But it is hard to look beyond Sir Alex Ferguson.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Cloughie was a great and idiosyncratic manager. But he didn't do it with nothing. He bought a goalie and striker at record prices.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Only because of his success alone.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Correct.
He generated wealth thru success, invested in the team and repeat...

Amazing achievements.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Without the foundations of an empire behind him - the likes of which Ferguson has at his disposal

----------------------------------------------------------------------
At Aberdeen?

comment by ThE ReVoLuTiOn Is HeRe (U22182)
posted 10 seconds ago
comment by Geoff Tipps (U1449)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Cal Neva (U11544)
posted 2 hours, 9 minutes ago
comment by Barefoot (U19770)
posted 6 minutes ago
Fergie was a success in Scotland as well, winning a couple of titles and a European trophy.

I watched The Damned Utd the other night (for the 2nd time). Clough doesn't come out of it to well, but Revie even worse. I know it's a film, needed to be taken with a pinch of salt, btw!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's because it was a work of fiction.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I watched the actual TV interview with Austin Mitchell last night as I just came across it on YouTube, Clough comes across as very submissive towards Revie in that unlike the film version
Anyway getting away from the point, I think Clough’s achievements with forest elevate him above Revie, however, anyone saying anyone other than SAF is the best of that list is just bitter or tribal
----------------------------------------------------------------------
coming from a Man Utd Supporter

CLASSIC
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Isn't wrong though, is he?

Interestingly though Clough in his newspaper articles on Sunday always championed Revie for the England job but I suspect he wanted Revie and Leeds out of the way to leave the field to Derby at that time...Clough
constantly provoked Revie when Derby were about to play Leeds...'don't bother turning up as you will lose' he shouted all the time.
As a Leeds fan I'm glad to report we usually came away with the points, home and away.

comment by Jonty (U4614)
posted 1 hour, 3 minutes ago
comment by Barefoot (U19770)
posted 18 minutes ago
Just two titles for Clough in over 20 years in management. Comparing Clough to Fergie is unfair, due to financial reasons, though lets not forget Clough did break the world transfer record.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Promotion and title with unfashionable club derby.
Loads of titles and cups with another unfashionable club forest.

----------------------------------------------------------------------
One title with Forest. It's his European achievements that make him stand out. They were unique.

Some great shouts on that list.

Very difficult to pick, you could make a very good argument for any of them

Urgh.. said with a bit of sick in my mouth ... Ferguson!