comment by thebluebellsarablue (U9292)
posted 34 seconds ago
comment by Clockwork Red (U4892)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 2 minutes ago
I think what should be getting more discussion is the polls. What a disgrace they are.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

UK elections 2015, Brexit, US 2016 and now US 2020. That's four I can remember where they've been way off recently.

I heard one guy basically saying yesterday that they underestimated how many people won't admit to voting Trump. Always seems to be the same mistakes they make.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Conservatives and leavers are afraid to be called racist or stupid, so lie to pollsters
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I know, and the pollsters seem surprised every time.

comment by Clockwork Red (U4892)
posted 8 minutes ago
It really was quite surreal watching the BBC coverage yesterday. The amount of times the BBC had to say things like "baseless claims" or "without evidence" was amazing and, to a Trump sympathiser, it really would have sounded like open bias. But this is the world he's created for himself: if you say the things he said yesterday, you can't seriously expect news outlets to report it as a legitimate claim, so they're going to have to couch their reporting in language that seems to be biased against you.

I get that people like(d) him because he's "not like other politicians", but one thing politicians are generally good at is hedging their language, thinking about how they might be interpreted and how it might come back to haunt them - in short, being careful. He just rambles and comes out with stuff openly, thus leaving himself vulnerable to being proven wrong.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
MSM is mainly remain, Democrat and middle class liberal left leaning.

So basically do not represent half of the UK or America, which is weird.

comment by Clockwork Red (U4892)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by thebluebellsarablue (U9292)
posted 34 seconds ago
comment by Clockwork Red (U4892)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 2 minutes ago
I think what should be getting more discussion is the polls. What a disgrace they are.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

UK elections 2015, Brexit, US 2016 and now US 2020. That's four I can remember where they've been way off recently.

I heard one guy basically saying yesterday that they underestimated how many people won't admit to voting Trump. Always seems to be the same mistakes they make.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Conservatives and leavers are afraid to be called racist or stupid, so lie to pollsters
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I know, and the pollsters seem surprised every time.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
In Belfast when asked who we vote for we say moderate Alliance and not dup or SF, then Dup and SF top polls...same with conservatives and populists in UK and America when asked in public.

comment by thebluebellsarablue (U9292)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Clockwork Red (U4892)
posted 8 minutes ago
It really was quite surreal watching the BBC coverage yesterday. The amount of times the BBC had to say things like "baseless claims" or "without evidence" was amazing and, to a Trump sympathiser, it really would have sounded like open bias. But this is the world he's created for himself: if you say the things he said yesterday, you can't seriously expect news outlets to report it as a legitimate claim, so they're going to have to couch their reporting in language that seems to be biased against you.

I get that people like(d) him because he's "not like other politicians", but one thing politicians are generally good at is hedging their language, thinking about how they might be interpreted and how it might come back to haunt them - in short, being careful. He just rambles and comes out with stuff openly, thus leaving himself vulnerable to being proven wrong.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
MSM is mainly remain, Democrat and middle class liberal left leaning.

So basically do not represent half of the UK or America, which is weird.


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Liberal left leaning in the UK?

Other than the Guardian and the Daily Mirror, I'm not sure there are any other really notable left leaning media on the UK. These were also both remain.

The Times, the telegraph, the sun, the express and the mail are all comfortably right wing. 4 of the 5 of these were firmly leave (the times was balanced but slightly more leave). The FT and the independent are pretty centrist and the FT was slightly more remain. The BBC gets accused of being both on a regular basis.

The Independent is basically Remain HQ.

comment by Clockwork Red (U4892)
posted 13 minutes ago
The Independent is basically Remain HQ.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Yes sorry, I did miss that out. Either way though, i make it 2 out of 8 that are leftwing and 3 out of 8 that were notably remain.

Hardly qualifies as "MSM is mainly remain, Democrat and middle class liberal left leaning"

MSM is mainly remain, Democrat and middle class liberal left leaning.
———

comment by welshpoolfan (U7693)
posted 12 minutes ago
comment by Clockwork Red (U4892)
posted 13 minutes ago
The Independent is basically Remain HQ.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Yes sorry, I did miss that out. Either way though, i make it 2 out of 8 that are leftwing and 3 out of 8 that were notably remain.

Hardly qualifies as "MSM is mainly remain, Democrat and middle class liberal left leaning"
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Absolutely; I agree generally with that.

comment by Donny The King van de Beek (U10026)
posted 10 minutes ago
MSM is mainly remain, Democrat and middle class liberal left leaning.
———

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Just unbelievable tbh

comment by Constantinople (U11781)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Donny The King van de Beek (U10026)
posted 10 minutes ago
MSM is mainly remain, Democrat and middle class liberal left leaning.
———

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Just unbelievable tbh
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s not that hard to believe. Media has become so unprofessionally biased on both sides creating such extreme polarisation that this is a natural consequence. The fact that truly centrist sources are not in the majority says it all.

Going back to Trump, if anyone thinks that some form of utopia is going to start being created because the evil bigoted, divisive, racism, sexist prck is out of the White House is going to get a big shock.

MSM and social media play the biggest part for their complicit behaviour in whipping up narratives and false facts about very sensitive topics. 10 years ago this just used to be about celebrity infidelity et cetera but the hunger for clicks and market share has pushed the media to use the same abhorrent tactics with extremely complex and sensitive matters.

It really surprises me that I don’t see more general outrage towards the media. And I don’t mean ‘left wing narrative this or right wing narrative that’ it’s the same crime and it feels to me that people are focusing on the actors rather than looking at the directors. Which is great for them because it just furthers their cause; to make more money. Ironic isn’t it.

I’ll just add that a lot of the division we’re seeing now and false narratives all started under Obama. So again, I really don’t see it going away just because tango man is out.

comment by WB2 (Emery'll Get Me Killed) (U8276)
posted 3 hours, 17 minutes ago
Its proven that there is no difference in numbers of voting per post. People keep saying that, its nonsense

-----------------------------

Someone else has already corrected you but I wll just add. You've been watching the casting differences, play out live in the current election.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Have I?

Laugh at Trump campaigners in Nevada and all the braindead racists who worship him

comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 1 hour, 38 minutes ago
I’ll just add that a lot of the division we’re seeing now and false narratives all started under Obama. So again, I really don’t see it going away just because tango man is out.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Correct.

Division existed way before Trumpet.

He did not help, but it takes two to tango-man

Both sides are tribal at times.

comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 2 hours, 3 minutes ago
I’ll just add that a lot of the division we’re seeing now and false narratives all started under Obama. So again, I really don’t see it going away just because tango man is out.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s gonna get infinitely better. In a divided country, not having the potus ranting like a lunatic on social media will be a great Place to start.

So will you he division go away? Probably not, but it’s going to be so much better without the most powerful man inciting hatred

comment by £350k Förtnite Skin (U18355)
posted 34 minutes ago
Laugh at Trump campaigners in Nevada and all the braindead racists who worship him
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bubba J wannabees...drinkin beer & watchin NASCAR

(See Jeff Dunham)

comment by Manfrombelmonty (U1705)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 2 hours, 3 minutes ago
I’ll just add that a lot of the division we’re seeing now and false narratives all started under Obama. So again, I really don’t see it going away just because tango man is out.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s gonna get infinitely better. In a divided country, not having the potus ranting like a lunatic on social media will be a great Place to start.

So will you he division go away? Probably not, but it’s going to be so much better without the most powerful man inciting hatred
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It would be nice if he left and we were nicer to each other.

Life is tough and bleak enough.

comment by Manfrombelmonty (U1705)
posted 12 seconds ago
comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 2 hours, 3 minutes ago
I’ll just add that a lot of the division we’re seeing now and false narratives all started under Obama. So again, I really don’t see it going away just because tango man is out.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s gonna get infinitely better. In a divided country, not having the potus ranting like a lunatic on social media will be a great Place to start.

So will you he division go away? Probably not, but it’s going to be so much better without the most powerful man inciting hatred
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well I hope you’re proven right but I don’t see it given as I said that most of this started before Trump.

Look at the mess that was Ferguson and all the anti-police propaganda.

comment by Sheriff JW Pepper (U1007)
posted 20 seconds ago
comment by £350k Förtnite Skin (U18355)
posted 34 minutes ago
Laugh at Trump campaigners in Nevada and all the braindead racists who worship him
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bubba J wannabees...drinkin beer & watchin NASCAR

(See Jeff Dunham)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Beer n fast motors....yeehaw.🍻

https://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=https%3A%2F%2Fcountryrebel.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2018%2F04%2Fjeff-bubba-nascar-1-480x270.jpg&imgrefurl=https%3A%2F%2Fcountryrebel.com%2Fblogs%2Fvideos%2Fjeff-dunhams-redneck-puppet-defends-nascar-in-hysterical-rant%2F&tbnid=8_nfKFkr_VSJrM&vet=12ahUKEwiL093c9evsAhUNeRoKHcxCBB8QMygIegUIARDAAQ..i&docid=kjqske2fEuPA1M&w=480&h=270&q=bubba%20jeff%20dunham&ved=2ahUKEwiL093c9evsAhUNeRoKHcxCBB8QMygIegUIARDAAQ

comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 15 seconds ago
comment by Manfrombelmonty (U1705)
posted 12 seconds ago
comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 2 hours, 3 minutes ago
I’ll just add that a lot of the division we’re seeing now and false narratives all started under Obama. So again, I really don’t see it going away just because tango man is out.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s gonna get infinitely better. In a divided country, not having the potus ranting like a lunatic on social media will be a great Place to start.

So will you he division go away? Probably not, but it’s going to be so much better without the most powerful man inciting hatred
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well I hope you’re proven right but I don’t see it given as I said that most of this started before Trump.

Look at the mess that was Ferguson and all the anti-police propaganda.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
True.

Let's hope it gets better.

comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Manfrombelmonty (U1705)
posted 12 seconds ago
comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 2 hours, 3 minutes ago
I’ll just add that a lot of the division we’re seeing now and false narratives all started under Obama. So again, I really don’t see it going away just because tango man is out.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s gonna get infinitely better. In a divided country, not having the potus ranting like a lunatic on social media will be a great Place to start.

So will you he division go away? Probably not, but it’s going to be so much better without the most powerful man inciting hatred
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well I hope you’re proven right but I don’t see it given as I said that most of this started before Trump.

Look at the mess that was Ferguson and all the anti-police propaganda.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I don’t think it’s possible for anyone to say trump hasn’t stoked the fires and given extremists of all creed and color opportunity to act out.

There’s been divides in the us since it’s inception. It didn’t start with trump or Obama. Trump just made things worse and showed no desire to mediate and help heal.

The world is going to be better without him

comment by Manfrombelmonty (U1705)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Manfrombelmonty (U1705)
posted 12 seconds ago
comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 2 hours, 3 minutes ago
I’ll just add that a lot of the division we’re seeing now and false narratives all started under Obama. So again, I really don’t see it going away just because tango man is out.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s gonna get infinitely better. In a divided country, not having the potus ranting like a lunatic on social media will be a great Place to start.

So will you he division go away? Probably not, but it’s going to be so much better without the most powerful man inciting hatred
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well I hope you’re proven right but I don’t see it given as I said that most of this started before Trump.

Look at the mess that was Ferguson and all the anti-police propaganda.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I don’t think it’s possible for anyone to say trump hasn’t stoked the fires and given extremists of all creed and color opportunity to act out.

There’s been divides in the us since it’s inception. It didn’t start with trump or Obama. Trump just made things worse and showed no desire to mediate and help heal.

The world is going to be better without him
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Fair.

comment by Manfrombelmonty (U1705)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Manfrombelmonty (U1705)
posted 12 seconds ago
comment by Sat Nav (U18243)
posted 2 hours, 3 minutes ago
I’ll just add that a lot of the division we’re seeing now and false narratives all started under Obama. So again, I really don’t see it going away just because tango man is out.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s gonna get infinitely better. In a divided country, not having the potus ranting like a lunatic on social media will be a great Place to start.

So will you he division go away? Probably not, but it’s going to be so much better without the most powerful man inciting hatred
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well I hope you’re proven right but I don’t see it given as I said that most of this started before Trump.

Look at the mess that was Ferguson and all the anti-police propaganda.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I don’t think it’s possible for anyone to say trump hasn’t stoked the fires and given extremists of all creed and color opportunity to act out.

There’s been divides in the us since it’s inception. It didn’t start with trump or Obama. Trump just made things worse and showed no desire to mediate and help heal.

The world is going to be better without him
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Agreed but let’s ask the more pertinent question: which do you think has a larger portion of blame for the current levels of division we’re seeing in America and spilling over to the rest of the world? Trump or the media?

Agreed but let’s ask the more pertinent question: which do you think has a larger portion of blame for the current levels of division we’re seeing in America and spilling over to the rest of the world? Trump or the media?

----

How's that the more pertinent question? The media by definition reports what's happening.

Trump has actively sought to undermine people's trust in reputable news and professional reporting in favour of his own rhetoric. Rhetoric which has included open racism and repeated refusal to condemn hate groups that support him. He has emboldened some of the most dangerous groups in society. That's the words of the FBI by the way, before you accuse me of hyperbole.

Is the media responsible for reporting what he said? Maybe. For creating the divisions in society? No chance. As people have pointed out already - those divisions are what the States was founded on. And certainly predates mass media.