comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 21 minutes ago
There's not being a mockery but in a sport remembered for flair, style & excitement it's not very inspiring.
Brazil 70
Netherlands 74
Argentina 86
OK I picked WC teams but iconic stuff and right now it is tough to see England get close in those stakes. That said, France might have peaked, Spain have a chance if Yamal does some more crazy sh.t and right now Ragnick has Austria firing...still time.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Spain were dull as dishwater in 2010, Portugal were just bad mostly in 2016, Greece made your eyes bleed in 04.
I would happily trade being called boring if we won it - just get it done and let the critics say whatever they want.
I said it on another thread, the Euros loves a shock winner every now and again - Austria look dangerous. I am happier playing the Netherlands over Austrianthats for sure, they would kill this lethargic England side with their press at the moment.
Jose would probably win the World Cup
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules... (U6374)
posted 2 hours, 1 minute ago
comment by Melbourne Red (U5417)
posted 14 minutes ago
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules... (U6374)
posted 19 minutes ago
I can’t see Potter, Howe or Poch taking the job. They’re club managers who would earn vastly more staying that way. Potter maybe is a possibility.
It’ll be Lampard or Carsley I reckon, outside chance of Rooney.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Absolutely no chance will it be Lampard or Rooney.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because they’re terrible managers.
comment by Robberto Garnacho (U22716)
posted 11 minutes ago
Jose would probably win the World Cup
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wahl?
Jose loses it in the second season at club level - who knows when he would lose it at international level.
I do hope he manages Portugal one day though - I do want the theory put to the test
comment by Melbourne Red (U5417)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules... (U6374)
posted 2 hours, 1 minute ago
comment by Melbourne Red (U5417)
posted 14 minutes ago
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules... (U6374)
posted 19 minutes ago
I can’t see Potter, Howe or Poch taking the job. They’re club managers who would earn vastly more staying that way. Potter maybe is a possibility.
It’ll be Lampard or Carsley I reckon, outside chance of Rooney.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Absolutely no chance will it be Lampard or Rooney.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because they’re terrible managers.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I hear you but have you seen our last three England managers?
I’m not sure why that means ‘absolutely no chance’ tbh.
I also don’t understand why people think international teams appoint club manager quality candidates. They don’t.
Who is the best International Manager out there? Then ask yourself if you’d want them at Utd.
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 1 hour, 41 minutes ago
Whoever it is will have to be completely devoid of personality, emotion or anything resembling flair. Even if they sacked Southgate they'd come back around to him as the only suitable candidate.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If this was intended to imply that Southgate is devoid of personality, I'd say it's factually incorrect. Too often in football we confuse 'loud' with 'charismatic'. There have been loads of managers with a quiet and respectful manner who exercised huge authority in the dressing room and would have players running through walls for them. For instance, listen to how Ian Wright describes the reverence he and his team mates had for Wenger when we arrived at Arsenal, and what an impact his calmness made on them when they were used to be shouted at by managers. It's pretty universally accepted that Southgate has succeeded in creating a strong culture of unity and humility in an England dressing room that had been undermined by cliques and egos for years and years. He also has a knack of channelling a very sincere and deeply felt patriotism in a way that makes sense to a young, diverse squad.
When it comes to tactics, he's obviously no Marcelo Bielsa. There's no way he'd have one of the best win % and best records in tournament progression of any England manager, over one of the longest stints ever as England manager, if he were bad at the interpersonal side of management as well.
comment by Snooker_49 (U10665)
posted 5 minutes ago
Get Klopp
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why on Earth would he manage England?
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Snooker_49 (U10665)
posted 5 minutes ago
Get Klopp
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why on Earth would he manage England?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's a part-time gig for a couple of years, and he was obviously burned out from the intensity of club football. He obviously had a strong emotional connection with Liverpool, and I think with English football culture more generally.
(I don't think it will happen either.)
comment by Snooker_49 (U10665)
posted 14 minutes ago
Get Klopp
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’m sure he’d love that
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 3 hours, 30 minutes ago
I can’t see Potter, Howe or Poch taking the job. They’re club managers who would earn vastly more staying that way. Potter maybe is a possibility.
It’ll be Lampard or Carsley I reckon, outside chance of Rooney.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
southgates on 5m a year best paid manager in international football ffs. potter was on 2m at brighton, howes on 6m at newcasttle, cant see potter getting anywhere near 12m a year he got at chelsea again.
ange is on 5m a year 7th highest in the prem apparently
https://www.footballfancast.com/premier-league-managers-salaries-how-much-are-they-paid/
comment by InBefore (U20589)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 3 hours, 30 minutes ago
I can’t see Potter, Howe or Poch taking the job. They’re club managers who would earn vastly more staying that way. Potter maybe is a possibility.
It’ll be Lampard or Carsley I reckon, outside chance of Rooney.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
southgates on 5m a yearbest paid manager in international football ffs. potter was on 2m at brighton, howes on 6m at newcasttle, cant see potter getting anywhere near 12m a year he got at chelsea again.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Southgate’s initial contract was under £2m a year.
I’d be absolutely amazed if Howe became England manager, to the point I find it stupid even mentioning his name.
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 1 hour, 41 minutes ago
Whoever it is will have to be completely devoid of personality, emotion or anything resembling flair. Even if they sacked Southgate they'd come back around to him as the only suitable candidate.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If this was intended to imply that Southgate is devoid of personality, I'd say it's factually incorrect. Too often in football we confuse 'loud' with 'charismatic'. There have been loads of managers with a quiet and respectful manner who exercised huge authority in the dressing room and would have players running through walls for them. For instance, listen to how Ian Wright describes the reverence he and his team mates had for Wenger when we arrived at Arsenal, and what an impact his calmness made on them when they were used to be shouted at by managers. It's pretty universally accepted that Southgate has succeeded in creating a strong culture of unity and humility in an England dressing room that had been undermined by cliques and egos for years and years. He also has a knack of channelling a very sincere and deeply felt patriotism in a way that makes sense to a young, diverse squad.
When it comes to tactics, he's obviously no Marcelo Bielsa. There's no way he'd have one of the best win % and best records in tournament progression of any England manager, over one of the longest stints ever as England manager, if he were bad at the interpersonal side of management as well.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Of course he has a personality. It may resonate with the players. It certainly seems to resonate with the FA. In many respects it is the new way since power has shifted to the players. And I don't see anyone confusing loud with charismatic? Football is an emotional game - positively channeled, of course.
Wenger calm? Hmmmm. Away from the match maybe. He was certainly a revelation in the game in England but at a time when it was changing anyway away from sheepskin, shouting and George Best lifestyles.
Humility, unity, sincerity, diplomacy, patriotism yadda - all great but not the character traits normally trotted out in the same breath as winner. Of course the players love it - he keeps picking them!
Listen he might be a different beast behind the public persona though I think that would be out in the open if he was. All I'm saying is to achieve the very top you maybe need that bit more - the enthusiasm, energy, emotion, inspiration, pressing different buttons for different players, a captain that isn't a clone - a guy that can generate a peak at the right time and not just the consistent guy waiting on lady luck or hoping players can reproduce club form - he has to make it happen, has to get that 110% and not just 99%.
Bielsa - flawed genius, Klopp - players and fans love him but fallible, Pep - maybe overthinks, Mourinho - gets the 110% but at a cost - none perfect but all capable of lifting to great heights and I just don't see that. Not to say that lady luck strikes though.
Southgate off camera is apparently banteriffic.
Humility, unity, sincerity, diplomacy, patriotism yadda - all great but not the character traits normally trotted out in the same breath as winner.
--------------------------------------------------------------
Seems like you have both quite a stereotypical view of a winner and a narrow understanding of success. By objective metrics, Southgate has been the most successful England manager since Alf Ramsey. If in international managerial terms being a 'winner' means winning tournaments, then there can only be one winner every two years, and by the same logic 23 to 31 losers.
As for winners, in fact they come in all sorts of personality types. Alf Ramsey himself was known as a relatively taciturn man, who could be awkward with the media. There have been lots of successful leaders who are introverts or quietly spoken.
For all the defence of Southgate no one would ever want him as the manager of their club. I’m sure he’s a decent enough guy but his legacy if England crash out of the Euros playing this kind of football will be one closer to Sven than Alf Ramsey imo
Even if we crash out playing as bad as we have this tournament Southgate will still be looked at fondly because he got us to a Euro final and WC semi. Even if you could argue he should have got more out of the players he had he's done far more than pretty much any manager bar Ramsey.
Wouldn’t say far more. Venables’ Euro 96 run was pretty special in terms of how well he got England playing. On a separate note I watched the highlights on TikTok of the Euro 96 run and completely had forgotten he used a central midfield partnership of Platt and Gazza against Spain and still knocked them out. Was Platt even a CM? In my memory he was more of a #10.
Hoddle got England playing far better stuff than Southgate has against far better quality of teams.
Southgate’s record against the big sides is pretty poor and his legacy will be that he was very inflexible in games tactically which cost England a trophy.
Wouldn't want a foreign manager managing us. I don't agree with it in international football. Potter seems like the best candidate. I don't know if he is the best but I think he is at least tactically better than Southgate and wants to play football the right way.
Redknapp should be added to the list if he is interested. If you go through who are the best English managers of the PL era then it's hard not to say he wouldn't be top.
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 24 minutes ago
Even if we crash out playing as bad as we have this tournament Southgate will still be looked at fondly because he got us to a Euro final and WC semi. Even if you could argue he should have got more out of the players he had he's done far more than pretty much any manager bar Ramsey.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
He'd only be looked at fondly by people who haven't got a clue. Those that have will see he was squandering England's best chances to win anything for this era.
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 24 minutes ago
Even if we crash out playing as bad as we have this tournament Southgate will still be looked at fondly because he got us to a Euro final and WC semi. Even if you could argue he should have got more out of the players he had he's done far more than pretty much any manager bar Ramsey.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
He'd only be looked at fondly by people who haven't got a clue. Those that have will see he was squandering England's best chances to win anything for this era.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why do people deal in these absolutes?
That’s rhetorical tbf, because I know why. They think this England side is absolutely brimming with talent all over the pitch, when in reality, it isn’t.
The defence is mince individually. We literally don’t have a single DM with any experience, we don’t have a single fit left back, we have a striker who can’t be displaced but also can’t run behind or the the channels and no LWF to speak of with any experience.
It’s an incredibly unbalanced squad but apparently this side should be turning over squads like France, Portugal, the current holders and the hosts because we have about 12 number 8s.
Yer, okay.
I personally believe that if Graham Potter or Eddie Howe are installed as the next England Manager after our likely disappointing exit in this competition England will win the 2026 World Cup.
Sign in if you want to comment
The next England manager?
Page 2 of 4
posted on 26/6/24
Rob Page.
posted on 26/6/24
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 21 minutes ago
There's not being a mockery but in a sport remembered for flair, style & excitement it's not very inspiring.
Brazil 70
Netherlands 74
Argentina 86
OK I picked WC teams but iconic stuff and right now it is tough to see England get close in those stakes. That said, France might have peaked, Spain have a chance if Yamal does some more crazy sh.t and right now Ragnick has Austria firing...still time.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Spain were dull as dishwater in 2010, Portugal were just bad mostly in 2016, Greece made your eyes bleed in 04.
I would happily trade being called boring if we won it - just get it done and let the critics say whatever they want.
I said it on another thread, the Euros loves a shock winner every now and again - Austria look dangerous. I am happier playing the Netherlands over Austrianthats for sure, they would kill this lethargic England side with their press at the moment.
posted on 26/6/24
Jose would probably win the World Cup
posted on 26/6/24
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules... (U6374)
posted 2 hours, 1 minute ago
comment by Melbourne Red (U5417)
posted 14 minutes ago
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules... (U6374)
posted 19 minutes ago
I can’t see Potter, Howe or Poch taking the job. They’re club managers who would earn vastly more staying that way. Potter maybe is a possibility.
It’ll be Lampard or Carsley I reckon, outside chance of Rooney.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Absolutely no chance will it be Lampard or Rooney.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because they’re terrible managers.
posted on 26/6/24
comment by Robberto Garnacho (U22716)
posted 11 minutes ago
Jose would probably win the World Cup
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wahl?
Jose loses it in the second season at club level - who knows when he would lose it at international level.
I do hope he manages Portugal one day though - I do want the theory put to the test
posted on 26/6/24
comment by Melbourne Red (U5417)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules... (U6374)
posted 2 hours, 1 minute ago
comment by Melbourne Red (U5417)
posted 14 minutes ago
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules... (U6374)
posted 19 minutes ago
I can’t see Potter, Howe or Poch taking the job. They’re club managers who would earn vastly more staying that way. Potter maybe is a possibility.
It’ll be Lampard or Carsley I reckon, outside chance of Rooney.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Absolutely no chance will it be Lampard or Rooney.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because they’re terrible managers.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I hear you but have you seen our last three England managers?
I’m not sure why that means ‘absolutely no chance’ tbh.
I also don’t understand why people think international teams appoint club manager quality candidates. They don’t.
Who is the best International Manager out there? Then ask yourself if you’d want them at Utd.
posted on 26/6/24
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 1 hour, 41 minutes ago
Whoever it is will have to be completely devoid of personality, emotion or anything resembling flair. Even if they sacked Southgate they'd come back around to him as the only suitable candidate.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If this was intended to imply that Southgate is devoid of personality, I'd say it's factually incorrect. Too often in football we confuse 'loud' with 'charismatic'. There have been loads of managers with a quiet and respectful manner who exercised huge authority in the dressing room and would have players running through walls for them. For instance, listen to how Ian Wright describes the reverence he and his team mates had for Wenger when we arrived at Arsenal, and what an impact his calmness made on them when they were used to be shouted at by managers. It's pretty universally accepted that Southgate has succeeded in creating a strong culture of unity and humility in an England dressing room that had been undermined by cliques and egos for years and years. He also has a knack of channelling a very sincere and deeply felt patriotism in a way that makes sense to a young, diverse squad.
When it comes to tactics, he's obviously no Marcelo Bielsa. There's no way he'd have one of the best win % and best records in tournament progression of any England manager, over one of the longest stints ever as England manager, if he were bad at the interpersonal side of management as well.
posted on 26/6/24
Get Klopp
posted on 26/6/24
comment by Snooker_49 (U10665)
posted 5 minutes ago
Get Klopp
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why on Earth would he manage England?
posted on 26/6/24
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Snooker_49 (U10665)
posted 5 minutes ago
Get Klopp
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why on Earth would he manage England?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's a part-time gig for a couple of years, and he was obviously burned out from the intensity of club football. He obviously had a strong emotional connection with Liverpool, and I think with English football culture more generally.
(I don't think it will happen either.)
posted on 26/6/24
comment by Snooker_49 (U10665)
posted 14 minutes ago
Get Klopp
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I’m sure he’d love that
posted on 26/6/24
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 3 hours, 30 minutes ago
I can’t see Potter, Howe or Poch taking the job. They’re club managers who would earn vastly more staying that way. Potter maybe is a possibility.
It’ll be Lampard or Carsley I reckon, outside chance of Rooney.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
southgates on 5m a year best paid manager in international football ffs. potter was on 2m at brighton, howes on 6m at newcasttle, cant see potter getting anywhere near 12m a year he got at chelsea again.
posted on 26/6/24
ange is on 5m a year 7th highest in the prem apparently
https://www.footballfancast.com/premier-league-managers-salaries-how-much-are-they-paid/
posted on 26/6/24
comment by InBefore (U20589)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Robbing Hoody - I want to play by my own rules and if I can’t I’ll sue you (U6374)
posted 3 hours, 30 minutes ago
I can’t see Potter, Howe or Poch taking the job. They’re club managers who would earn vastly more staying that way. Potter maybe is a possibility.
It’ll be Lampard or Carsley I reckon, outside chance of Rooney.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
southgates on 5m a yearbest paid manager in international football ffs. potter was on 2m at brighton, howes on 6m at newcasttle, cant see potter getting anywhere near 12m a year he got at chelsea again.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Southgate’s initial contract was under £2m a year.
I’d be absolutely amazed if Howe became England manager, to the point I find it stupid even mentioning his name.
posted on 26/6/24
comment by Red Russian (U4715)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by Silver (U6112)
posted 1 hour, 41 minutes ago
Whoever it is will have to be completely devoid of personality, emotion or anything resembling flair. Even if they sacked Southgate they'd come back around to him as the only suitable candidate.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If this was intended to imply that Southgate is devoid of personality, I'd say it's factually incorrect. Too often in football we confuse 'loud' with 'charismatic'. There have been loads of managers with a quiet and respectful manner who exercised huge authority in the dressing room and would have players running through walls for them. For instance, listen to how Ian Wright describes the reverence he and his team mates had for Wenger when we arrived at Arsenal, and what an impact his calmness made on them when they were used to be shouted at by managers. It's pretty universally accepted that Southgate has succeeded in creating a strong culture of unity and humility in an England dressing room that had been undermined by cliques and egos for years and years. He also has a knack of channelling a very sincere and deeply felt patriotism in a way that makes sense to a young, diverse squad.
When it comes to tactics, he's obviously no Marcelo Bielsa. There's no way he'd have one of the best win % and best records in tournament progression of any England manager, over one of the longest stints ever as England manager, if he were bad at the interpersonal side of management as well.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Of course he has a personality. It may resonate with the players. It certainly seems to resonate with the FA. In many respects it is the new way since power has shifted to the players. And I don't see anyone confusing loud with charismatic? Football is an emotional game - positively channeled, of course.
Wenger calm? Hmmmm. Away from the match maybe. He was certainly a revelation in the game in England but at a time when it was changing anyway away from sheepskin, shouting and George Best lifestyles.
Humility, unity, sincerity, diplomacy, patriotism yadda - all great but not the character traits normally trotted out in the same breath as winner. Of course the players love it - he keeps picking them!
Listen he might be a different beast behind the public persona though I think that would be out in the open if he was. All I'm saying is to achieve the very top you maybe need that bit more - the enthusiasm, energy, emotion, inspiration, pressing different buttons for different players, a captain that isn't a clone - a guy that can generate a peak at the right time and not just the consistent guy waiting on lady luck or hoping players can reproduce club form - he has to make it happen, has to get that 110% and not just 99%.
Bielsa - flawed genius, Klopp - players and fans love him but fallible, Pep - maybe overthinks, Mourinho - gets the 110% but at a cost - none perfect but all capable of lifting to great heights and I just don't see that. Not to say that lady luck strikes though.
posted on 26/6/24
Southgate off camera is apparently banteriffic.
posted on 26/6/24
I’d love Big Ange
posted on 26/6/24
Humility, unity, sincerity, diplomacy, patriotism yadda - all great but not the character traits normally trotted out in the same breath as winner.
--------------------------------------------------------------
Seems like you have both quite a stereotypical view of a winner and a narrow understanding of success. By objective metrics, Southgate has been the most successful England manager since Alf Ramsey. If in international managerial terms being a 'winner' means winning tournaments, then there can only be one winner every two years, and by the same logic 23 to 31 losers.
As for winners, in fact they come in all sorts of personality types. Alf Ramsey himself was known as a relatively taciturn man, who could be awkward with the media. There have been lots of successful leaders who are introverts or quietly spoken.
posted on 26/6/24
For all the defence of Southgate no one would ever want him as the manager of their club. I’m sure he’s a decent enough guy but his legacy if England crash out of the Euros playing this kind of football will be one closer to Sven than Alf Ramsey imo
posted on 26/6/24
Even if we crash out playing as bad as we have this tournament Southgate will still be looked at fondly because he got us to a Euro final and WC semi. Even if you could argue he should have got more out of the players he had he's done far more than pretty much any manager bar Ramsey.
posted on 26/6/24
Wouldn’t say far more. Venables’ Euro 96 run was pretty special in terms of how well he got England playing. On a separate note I watched the highlights on TikTok of the Euro 96 run and completely had forgotten he used a central midfield partnership of Platt and Gazza against Spain and still knocked them out. Was Platt even a CM? In my memory he was more of a #10.
Hoddle got England playing far better stuff than Southgate has against far better quality of teams.
Southgate’s record against the big sides is pretty poor and his legacy will be that he was very inflexible in games tactically which cost England a trophy.
posted on 26/6/24
Wouldn't want a foreign manager managing us. I don't agree with it in international football. Potter seems like the best candidate. I don't know if he is the best but I think he is at least tactically better than Southgate and wants to play football the right way.
Redknapp should be added to the list if he is interested. If you go through who are the best English managers of the PL era then it's hard not to say he wouldn't be top.
posted on 26/6/24
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 24 minutes ago
Even if we crash out playing as bad as we have this tournament Southgate will still be looked at fondly because he got us to a Euro final and WC semi. Even if you could argue he should have got more out of the players he had he's done far more than pretty much any manager bar Ramsey.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
He'd only be looked at fondly by people who haven't got a clue. Those that have will see he was squandering England's best chances to win anything for this era.
posted on 26/6/24
comment by Spurtle (U1608)
posted 9 minutes ago
comment by manutd1982 (U6633)
posted 24 minutes ago
Even if we crash out playing as bad as we have this tournament Southgate will still be looked at fondly because he got us to a Euro final and WC semi. Even if you could argue he should have got more out of the players he had he's done far more than pretty much any manager bar Ramsey.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
He'd only be looked at fondly by people who haven't got a clue. Those that have will see he was squandering England's best chances to win anything for this era.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why do people deal in these absolutes?
That’s rhetorical tbf, because I know why. They think this England side is absolutely brimming with talent all over the pitch, when in reality, it isn’t.
The defence is mince individually. We literally don’t have a single DM with any experience, we don’t have a single fit left back, we have a striker who can’t be displaced but also can’t run behind or the the channels and no LWF to speak of with any experience.
It’s an incredibly unbalanced squad but apparently this side should be turning over squads like France, Portugal, the current holders and the hosts because we have about 12 number 8s.
Yer, okay.
posted on 26/6/24
I personally believe that if Graham Potter or Eddie Howe are installed as the next England Manager after our likely disappointing exit in this competition England will win the 2026 World Cup.
Page 2 of 4