I have no real bone in this fight, but it is disheartening to see people claim that extrapolated numbers are fact.

They aren't, they are a prediction and should not be used in such absolute terms

think i got mixed up between bone to pick and dog in the fight there

Hold on... Someone talks about about 'what paisley could've achieved in 26 years?!' They'll never know.
But still try to use some ratio conversion they've devised. It's irrelevant.
But we do know what SAF achieved.
You say lets compare, Paisleys entire reign to SAF first 9 years? What?!
You talk about how Paisley was such a lovely man, like that has any bearing on anything, but to you lot it does.
It's simple. SAF has won more trophies.

In the year 2047 medical science will have advanced to the point that people will be able to live for 300 years.

After 280 years of management, Nigel Worthybottom from Yorkshire will have won 14 titles and 3 European cups making him the greatest ever.

factamundo

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"SAF has won more trophies."

not the most important and best trophy he hasn't

he's only got 2 of those

TKT, if Jose retires with 4 CL's will you consider him a better manager than Paisley?

Apart from anything else, Bob did it with dignity, and decency, a proper gentleman.
Ferguson was the complete opposite.
Awful, truly awful.

Again with the phantom ratio converter....
You have an understanding how Stats are devised.
RDM has a better C.L win rate than Arsene wenger..
He's not the better manager.

And the European cup total is another skewed opinion.
Yes Paisley won more C.L.
So you can use this 3-2 fact.
And League titles are irrelevant, are they?
36>19....

depends on how long he takes to do it

there was a documentary last year that claimed Jose was already the greatest manager of all time

and you could make a very good case for it if he retired today.

Titles in England, Italy and Spain with CL wins with different clubs. He's got every medal worth winning at club level, the full set.

It's an opinion though just any other.

I know a few older people who will rate Shanks and Busby as better than Paisley and Ferguson. Another valid opinion in how you define 'best'.

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fair enough, at least you are consistent with your argument.

And yeh its hard to judge against the old generation. For example I cant convince my Dad that there has ever been anyone better than Clough.

"You talk about how Paisley was such a lovely man, like that has any bearing on anything, but to you lot it does"....
Jlou - Apart from anything else, Bob did it with dignity, and decency, a proper gentleman.
Ferguson was the complete opposite.
Awful, truly awful.....

An Opinion...... Yet tripe like that is somehow meant to be a relevant point.

also whoever said di-matte if you average them out is silly, di matteo hasent just managed chelsea, i was being kind to united fans and only including fergies more successful time as united manager,

Di matteo would also only average 2.0 pots a season, if we just include chelsea, leaving him trailing bob.

We'll never know who the greatest manager is/was because there's too many different variables that people use. People will argue the continuity, number of trophies, different leagues, building a team and so on. Unless one manager somehow fits every variable in then it will always be opinion.

I just said the win rate ratio doesn't mean anything...

36>19 does...

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Seriously...

Does RDM have a better win rate in C.L than Arsene Wenger... Is RDM the better manager?

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comment by dunc_ champ20ns (U11713)
posted 2 hours, 24 minutes ago
is that when it was a piece of p 1 5 5 to win??

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Terrible argument

The whole Fergie v Paisley thing though you have to remeber that Fergie took over United when he was 45. Paisley took over Liverpool when he was 55. So straight away that's an extra 10 years for Fergie to win trophies.

The fact is that we will never be able to say who the greatest manager is, i agree.

But the arrogance of all the utd fans calling him the greatest manager ever is astounding,

Have they forgotten busby?!

Shanks, paisley, clough All top top managers.

To call Ferguson "the best" is arrogant and naive.

To call him the longest serving top flight manager in England is the only "Fact"!

its like saying a plumber doing the job for 60 years is better than a plumber whos been doing it for 20.

Time in a job is no indication of ability, achievements are, and in that case paisley wipes the floor with sir alex.

We'll never know who the greatest manager is/was because there's too many different variables that people use. People will argue the continuity, number of trophies, different leagues, building a team and so on. Unless one manager somehow fits every variable in then it will always be opinion.

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Exactly.

People will always have an opinion, myself included, but that's all it will ever be.

I think what is fact is that both can be regarded as great managers. For two great clubs. For United to have a manager that divides opinion in regards to a manager such as Paisley, then that is a compliment to Ferguson. Likewise, it is a compliment to Paisley for people to hold him up against Ferguson. Win win really when you look at it like that. Two great managers. Two very successful managers. It should be left at that.

It should not be reduced to a > symbol in a vain attempt to get one over the other.

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remeber that Fergie took over United when he was 45. Paisley took over Liverpool when he was 55. So straight away that's an extra 10 years for Fergie to win trophies....

Remember SAF was banned from Europe for his 1st four seasons..unlike Paisley...
we could skew facts all day, but we all agree they are two great managers..
Just SAF is better...

Di matteo 2 cups in 4 years = 0.5 cups per season,

Paisley > Di Matteo