comment by Robbing Hoody - keepy up arbiter. Don’t talk to me unless you can do ten (U6374)
posted less than a minute ago
Think there’s plenty out there myself. Pretty sure we’ll see Pep pick one up in Jan too.
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Baleba looks ite, says hes only 5ft10 on wiki but looks taller than that. Competitive quick strong good on the ball.

Zubi is very different tho, if thats the profile we are after.

If zubis the profile someone like wharton, who we will get a look at this sat? Have to say though little ive seen this seasons hes not been great but neight have palace? Been playing with an injury apparently though.

"Zubi is very different tho, if thats the profile we are after."

I personally don't believe it's a profile thing lol. More we got encouragement from is camp a deal could be done possibly below market value

I guess I'll be proved wrong if & when we go back for him...or we'll see what other options we go for in the not so distant future.

Yeah seemed more of an opportunity to add a gd player for sure.. but still dno what slot would prefer.

Guess we'll know when he's had another month or so with the squad and played some bigger teams, then we'll know where we're at. We're getting results at the moment but not always dominating which Slot seems to want

We can only speculate, will surely see soon enough as we need another option in there. He doesnt seem to like Endo that much. Who will surely have to rethink his decision come january if hes not played a lot more? Maybe recoup some money for him as he has a lot of admirers still.

comment by The Duality of Van (Dijk) (U21747)
posted 6 minutes ago
I think Gravenberch playing well means we won't for another DM, and I suspect Bajcetic comes back next season and rotates with Gravenberch as our two options there. I'd guess Bajcetic will probably take Endo's place in the squad next summer, and Endo will be the back-up this season
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Bajcetic has much to prove before taking the role we're discussing imo - that's challenging for a 1st team place and allowing rotation of the current 3 without a significant drop in quality.

He's played a couple of games for RBS and apparently has already picked up a fine for a training incident. I think (/hope) it's more likely that we try and sign another 1st teamer and have Bajcetic for depth and development.

I mean to go from Tchoumani to Lavia to Caceido to Zubi

Yeah Hughes & Slot just came in but Spearman is still the head of analytics (I think)

comment by Szoboss (U6997)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by The Duality of Van (Dijk) (U21747)
posted 6 minutes ago
I think Gravenberch playing well means we won't for another DM, and I suspect Bajcetic comes back next season and rotates with Gravenberch as our two options there. I'd guess Bajcetic will probably take Endo's place in the squad next summer, and Endo will be the back-up this season
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Bajcetic has much to prove before taking the role we're discussing imo - that's challenging for a 1st team place and allowing rotation of the current 3 without a significant drop in quality.

He's played a couple of games for RBS and apparently has already picked up a fine for a training incident. I think (/hope) it's more likely that we try and sign another 1st teamer and have Bajcetic for depth and development.

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Realistically, how many teams have a back-up option that's the same quality as the first option. City are planning to use Stones instead of Rodri I read, he's good but that's a drop-off. Rice has Partey who can't maintain his level for a full game and is injury prone

Bajcetic will develop a lot this year with starting minutes and if he does well, of course he's good enough to be a back-up. He'll be 20/21 next season

comment by Michael Edwards FC 2.0 loading…{Proud owner of the 5 000 000th comment} (U2720)
posted 9 minutes ago
I mean to go from Tchoumani to Lavia to Caceido to Zubi

Yeah Hughes & Slot just came in but Spearman is still the head of analytics (I think)
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Caveat that I've not watched too much of Tchou or Lavia but from what I have seen, there is a commonality of style with Tchou, Lavia and Caicedo, albeit different strengths and points in development. That was all for a place in Klopp's team.

I guess we'll see when we go for our next DM (which I'm sure will happen in either Jan or summer) whether Zubi was an anomaly or an intentional change of direction under Slot.

I personally believe the latter but we've had this debate before and I know we differ, so we'll see.

we'll probably have a clearer idea on what we need after this hard fixture run, been easy so far

comment by The Duality of Van (Dijk) (U21747)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by Szoboss (U6997)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by The Duality of Van (Dijk) (U21747)
posted 6 minutes ago
I think Gravenberch playing well means we won't for another DM, and I suspect Bajcetic comes back next season and rotates with Gravenberch as our two options there. I'd guess Bajcetic will probably take Endo's place in the squad next summer, and Endo will be the back-up this season
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Bajcetic has much to prove before taking the role we're discussing imo - that's challenging for a 1st team place and allowing rotation of the current 3 without a significant drop in quality.

He's played a couple of games for RBS and apparently has already picked up a fine for a training incident. I think (/hope) it's more likely that we try and sign another 1st teamer and have Bajcetic for depth and development.

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Realistically, how many teams have a back-up option that's the same quality as the first option. City are planning to use Stones instead of Rodri I read, he's good but that's a drop-off. Rice has Partey who can't maintain his level for a full game and is injury prone

Bajcetic will develop a lot this year with starting minutes and if he does well, of course he's good enough to be a back-up. He'll be 20/21 next season
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I didn't say the same quality, I said without a significant drop in quality. And there is a difference imo. The former is very difficult, as you said, but the latter, not so much imo.

In the UK we've got City who have in CM - Rodri, Gundogan, Kovacic, Nunes, KdB and Bernardo.

And Arsenal in CM - Rice, Partey, Jorginho, Merino, Odegaard and Havertz (although he seems to be played as a CF more these days).

So comparing the deeper CM players, do we have comparable overall quality if we go with AMA, Grav, Jones and Bajcetic? Compared to the 4 at City and Arsenal; I'd say we have the bigger drop off.

comment by Szoboss (U6997)
posted 13 minutes ago
comment by Michael Edwards FC 2.0 loading…{Proud owner of the 5 000 000th comment} (U2720)
posted 9 minutes ago
I mean to go from Tchoumani to Lavia to Caceido to Zubi

Yeah Hughes & Slot just came in but Spearman is still the head of analytics (I think)
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Caveat that I've not watched too much of Tchou or Lavia but from what I have seen, there is a commonality of style with Tchou, Lavia and Caicedo, albeit different strengths and points in development. That was all for a place in Klopp's team.

I guess we'll see when we go for our next DM (which I'm sure will happen in either Jan or summer) whether Zubi was an anomaly or an intentional change of direction under Slot.

I personally believe the latter but we've had this debate before and I know we differ, so we'll see.
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Not really imo..Caicedo can only work in a midfield 2 and we know his partnership with Mac is really good.

Tchou and Lavia are still dissimilar imo but both lone holding midfielders

Agree Hughes & Slot have just come in so there is definitely a directional change

I really just want to see how it plays out

comment by Szoboss (U6997)

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I didn't say the same quality, I said without a significant drop in quality. And there is a difference imo. The former is very difficult, as you said, but the latter, not so much imo.

In the UK we've got City who have in CM - Rodri, Gundogan, Kovacic, Nunes, KdB and Bernardo.

And Arsenal in CM - Rice, Partey, Jorginho, Merino, Odegaard and Havertz (although he seems to be played as a CF more these days).

So comparing the deeper CM players, do we have comparable overall quality if we go with AMA, Grav, Jones and Bajcetic? Compared to the 4 at City and Arsenal; I'd say we have the bigger drop off.
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That's a fair point, I get you. To be honest I forgot City have Kovacic and Arsenal have Jorginho.

Based on Slot coaching history in the Netherlands he likes a 6 who is good on the ball. He had Koopmeiners at AZ and he was doing a similar role what Gravenberch is doing for us. At Feyenoord he had Wieffer who is also good at driving forward with the ball but a better defensive player than what we currently have.

Slot won't sign a DM who is only good at breaking play up like Ugarte. He wants somebody who is more complete in that position in progressing the ball forward with dribbling or passing and also doing the defensive work out of possession.

comment by Boca Seniors (CR7= Club Record, 7-0) (U19731)
posted about an hour ago
Based on Slot coaching history in the Netherlands he likes a 6 who is good on the ball. He had Koopmeiners at AZ and he was doing a similar role what Gravenberch is doing for us. At Feyenoord he had Wieffer who is also good at driving forward with the ball but a better defensive player than what we currently have.

Slot won't sign a DM who is only good at breaking play up like Ugarte. He wants somebody who is more complete in that position in progressing the ball forward with dribbling or passing and also doing the defensive work out of possession.
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Agreed. People should have noticed why he wants this as last night was the perfect example. The amount of times Gravenberch had to take the ball forward in order to break their press was ridiculous. Their man to man press would have caused major problems if it was just a ball winner in there. Even with Gravenberch in there there were some periods of the game when we struggled with their press but it could have been a very different night without Gravenberch doing what he did.

It a wonder we ever won a trophy without him when you put it like that.

comment by TheresOnlyOne7-0Reds (U1721)
posted 43 minutes ago
comment by Boca Seniors (CR7= Club Record, 7-0) (U19731)
posted about an hour ago
Based on Slot coaching history in the Netherlands he likes a 6 who is good on the ball. He had Koopmeiners at AZ and he was doing a similar role what Gravenberch is doing for us. At Feyenoord he had Wieffer who is also good at driving forward with the ball but a better defensive player than what we currently have.

Slot won't sign a DM who is only good at breaking play up like Ugarte. He wants somebody who is more complete in that position in progressing the ball forward with dribbling or passing and also doing the defensive work out of possession.
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Agreed. People should have noticed why he wants this as last night was the perfect example. The amount of times Gravenberch had to take the ball forward in order to break their press was ridiculous. Their man to man press would have caused major problems if it was just a ball winner in there. Even with Gravenberch in there there were some periods of the game when we struggled with their press but it could have been a very different night without Gravenberch doing what he did.
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Grav got legs too.

comment by The Duality of Van (Dijk) (U21747)
posted about 2 hours ago
comment by Szoboss (U6997)

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I didn't say the same quality, I said without a significant drop in quality. And there is a difference imo. The former is very difficult, as you said, but the latter, not so much imo.

In the UK we've got City who have in CM - Rodri, Gundogan, Kovacic, Nunes, KdB and Bernardo.

And Arsenal in CM - Rice, Partey, Jorginho, Merino, Odegaard and Havertz (although he seems to be played as a CF more these days).

So comparing the deeper CM players, do we have comparable overall quality if we go with AMA, Grav, Jones and Bajcetic? Compared to the 4 at City and Arsenal; I'd say we have the bigger drop off.
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That's a fair point, I get you. To be honest I forgot City have Kovacic and Arsenal have Jorginho.
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Yeah, we do need to add a midfielder and a Centre back, hopefully in Jan.

comment by Robbing Hoody - keepy up arbiter. Don’t talk to me unless you can do ten (U6374)
posted 41 minutes ago
It a wonder we ever won a trophy without him when you put it like that.
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Correct me if I'm remembering this wrong, but I think when we signed Grav you were one of the posters that was really pleased - talking up his skillset and his enormous potential.

Now that he's started delivering on that potential you seem, well a bit p*ssed off tbh.

comment by Szoboss (U6997)
posted 4 seconds ago
comment by Robbing Hoody - keepy up arbiter. Don’t talk to me unless you can do ten (U6374)
posted 41 minutes ago
It a wonder we ever won a trophy without him when you put it like that.
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Correct me if I'm remembering this wrong, but I think when we signed Grav you were one of the posters that was really pleased - talking up his skillset and his enormous potential.

Now that he's started delivering on that potential you seem, well a bit p*ssed off tbh.
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Yep, huge fan, always have been and pushed for his signing. There were lots on here that were against it too.

What I want is a full squad, not have someone replaced. It doesn’t mean I want Grav benched at all. In fact I’d be looking at AMA atm, who is playing brilliantly but I feel is wasted a touch deeper, and can also be got at defensively.

Moreover, the fact that they’ve moulded Grav into that player, shows that there is indeed numerous footballers that could improve our midfield, so this profile thing is a bit hollow really.

What I really hate is people just pulling stuff out of their ass and trying to pass it off as fact sand there are many posters on here that are rather economical with the truth.

comment by Robbing Hoody - keepy up arbiter. Don’t talk to me unless you can do ten (U6374)
posted 53 minutes ago
It a wonder we ever won a trophy without him when you put it like that.
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Improving is comparatively easy. It's how much or how far you improve that really matters. Improving from 87 to 88 points is pointless if you remain in third place. The aim isn't just to improve, how you improve matters.

United got a lot of praise on here for their transfer business this summer. They did a lot of "improving" all summer but look at them now.

There's many players that could theoretically improve our team and nobody has ever denied that, but every single one of those players could also theoretically flop badly. We don't have oil money and have to get it right nearly everytime.

A lot of the people who bemoaned United's signing of Ugarte and attacked the club for failing to move on him and other similar deals, are the same people saying it's easy to improve our midfield when we are seeing with our own eyes that United, for example, who have more money than us and a worse midfield than us are struggling to improve their sheet midfield.

If it was so easy to improve they'd be winning the league by now after spending 200m every summer.

comment by Robbing Hoody - keepy up arbiter. Don’t talk to me unless you can do ten (U6374)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Szoboss (U6997)
posted 4 seconds ago
comment by Robbing Hoody - keepy up arbiter. Don’t talk to me unless you can do ten (U6374)
posted 41 minutes ago
It a wonder we ever won a trophy without him when you put it like that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Correct me if I'm remembering this wrong, but I think when we signed Grav you were one of the posters that was really pleased - talking up his skillset and his enormous potential.

Now that he's started delivering on that potential you seem, well a bit p*ssed off tbh.
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Yep, huge fan, always have been and pushed for his signing. There were lots on here that were against it too.

What I want is a full squad, not have someone replaced. It doesn’t mean I want Grav benched at all. In fact I’d be looking at AMA atm, who is playing brilliantly but I feel is wasted a touch deeper, and can also be got at defensively.

Moreover, the fact that they’ve moulded Grav into that player, shows that there is indeed numerous footballers that could improve our midfield, so this profile thing is a bit hollow really.

What I really hate is people just pulling stuff out of their ass and trying to pass it off as fact sand there are many posters on here that are rather economical with the truth.
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I've not really brought into this 'unique skillset' line with Zubi, albeit I do think we're looking for something a little different to what we were under Klopp.

In fairness though, Grav has long been touted as one of biggest midfield talents in Europe - he was basically seen as the next big thing at Ajax. Moulding him into this player isn't necessarily a great indicator - they had a lot of ability to work with!