Yes, where is his condemnation? 176 comments and still only 2 people have levelled any criticism at him
https://amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/jan/06/biden-administration-staff-gaza-policy-protest
Biden’s own administration are questioning his policies yet we aren’t allowed to do it on here
Well done Bats, finally you’re talking sense-and in most important issues of all.
comment by Vladimikel Artutin - committing war crimes against football since 2019 (U18355)
posted 10 minutes ago
Yes, where is his condemnation? 176 comments and still only 2 people have levelled any criticism at him
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Probably because it's not a partisan Dems/Rep issue. Its US policy to back Israel irrespective of whom is in power. I do think the US has been mealy mouthed in its condemnation of killing innocent civilians in Gaza. But so have the government in the UK.
Antonio Gutierrez was correct when he, rightly, said Oct 7th didn't happen in a vacuum. It happened as a result of decades of oppression in Gaza and the West Bank. I heard on BBC that over 2000 Palestinians in the West Bank are currently in prison without knowing what they're charged with, legal representation, trial or sentence and release date. Also 25% of Palestinians in the West Bank have been imprisoned by Israel at one time or another. So called settlers use violence to evict Palestinians from their land, subsidised by the Israeli government, which then goes unpunished. Again thi s has been going on for decades, and has increased since Oct 7th in the West Bank.
Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank have no agency, representation and are ignored by western nations. They osensibly live in an apartheid state. This is what's given rise to Hamas.
The Israeli ambassador to the UK was on LBC the other day saying 'Gazans should leave the strip and claim refuge in Egypt' and 'tunnels connect every school, hospital, mosque and second home in Gaza so it needs to be levelled'. There was not a peep of condemnation from our government.
Its either rank hypocrisy or willful ignorance on the part of the US & UK. It is not a party political, or partisan issue though and shouldn't be confused as such as it only muddies the waters of sensible debate on a nuanced and difficult issue.
The Israeli ambassador to the UK was on LBC the other day saying 'Gazans should leave the strip and claim refuge in Egypt' and 'tunnels connect every school, hospital, mosque and second home in Gaza so it needs to be levelled'. There was not a peep of condemnation from our government.”
Of course they won’t criticise it because this is the Israeli end game, dispose of the filthy sand people to an in-habitual desert and let other sand people (Egyptians) deal with all the rising terrorist organisations that will come from it.
I just can’t accept the answer that the US stance on Israel stays the same regardless of who is in power.
There is more to presidency than politicising and taking orders. Having humanity, decency and wanting to change things for the better is what makes a great president.
In the eyes of some people on here, you only don’t have to be Donald Trump to be a good president
comment by Vladimikel Artutin - committing war crimes against football since 2019 (U18355)
posted 3 minutes ago
I just can’t accept the answer that the US stance on Israel stays the same regardless of who is in power.
There is more to presidency than politicising and taking orders. Having humanity, decency and wanting to change things for the better is what makes a great president.
In the eyes of some people on here, you only don’t have to be Donald Trump to be a good president
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Regardless of an Democratic or Republican president the stance remains the same. For example Bidens predecessor moved the US embassy in Israel to Jerusalem giving legitimacy to Israel's claim to the city being 'their capital'.
Blame the Romans, they started it all.
The who's in power bit is kind of irrelevant right now though seeing as if it's not Biden it will be Trump, who as mentioned above is even more pro Isreal.
You can't really ignore the alternative in a discussion like this.
There is no alternative though. It’s not like Biden can be sacked today and Trump walks into office. By the time the next POTUS is elected, there won’t be a Gaza left to talk about.
I just can’t ever remember a time where a president has been almost solely judged on who he isn’t rather than what he has/hasn’t done in the job.
Who here actually condemns Biden?
comment by Vladimikel Artutin - committing war crimes against football since 2019 (U18355)
posted 15 minutes ago
There is no alternative though. It’s not like Biden can be sacked today and Trump walks into office. By the time the next POTUS is elected, there won’t be a Gaza left to talk about.
I just can’t ever remember a time where a president has been almost solely judged on who he isn’t rather than what he has/hasn’t done in the job.
Who here actually condemns Biden?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think to the people whose opinion is actually important for an American president - Americans - there are dozens of more important issues he will be judged on ahead of Israel.
The most important issue seemingly that he isn’t Trump
comment by Vladimikel Artutin - committing war crimes against football since 2019 (U18355)
posted 3 minutes ago
The most important issue seemingly that he isn’t Trump
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well it that's what the yanks think
comment by Vladimikel Artutin - committing war crimes against football since 2019 (U18355)
posted 13 minutes ago
The most important issue seemingly that he isn’t Trump
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No it's more that he's judged for more than what happens in Gaza.
I'm not American so can't comment on things in the US under him, but the vast majority of people simply don't have the current situation over there at the top of their priority list.
comment by Vladimikel Artutin - committing war crimes against football since 2019 (U18355)
posted 42 minutes ago
The most important issue seemingly that he isn’t Trump
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No the most important thing is Oct 7th could've happened in 2023, 2016, 2008 or 1996 and the US response would he the same.
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 2 hours, 16 minutes ago
comment by Vladimikel Artutin - committing war crimes against football since 2019 (U18355)
posted 10 minutes ago
Yes, where is his condemnation? 176 comments and still only 2 people have levelled any criticism at him
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Probably because it's not a partisan Dems/Rep issue. Its US policy to back Israel irrespective of whom is in power. I do think the US has been mealy mouthed in its condemnation of killing innocent civilians in Gaza. But so have the government in the UK.
Antonio Gutierrez was correct when he, rightly, said Oct 7th didn't happen in a vacuum. It happened as a result of decades of oppression in Gaza and the West Bank. I heard on BBC that over 2000 Palestinians in the West Bank are currently in prison without knowing what they're charged with, legal representation, trial or sentence and release date. Also 25% of Palestinians in the West Bank have been imprisoned by Israel at one time or another. So called settlers use violence to evict Palestinians from their land, subsidised by the Israeli government, which then goes unpunished. Again thi s has been going on for decades, and has increased since Oct 7th in the West Bank.
Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank have no agency, representation and are ignored by western nations. They osensibly live in an apartheid state. This is what's given rise to Hamas.
The Israeli ambassador to the UK was on LBC the other day saying 'Gazans should leave the strip and claim refuge in Egypt' and 'tunnels connect every school, hospital, mosque and second home in Gaza so it needs to be levelled'. There was not a peep of condemnation from our government.
Its either rank hypocrisy or willful ignorance on the part of the US & UK. It is not a party political, or partisan issue though and shouldn't be confused as such as it only muddies the waters of sensible debate on a nuanced and difficult issue.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm sure the US and UK governments know how absurd their stance is, but they can't do fack all about it. Everyone is afraid to speak against Israel. Even the mighty UK and US tend to play ball when it comes to Israel. If it was any other country doing what Israel are doing we'd be sending troops to depose whatever dictator was responsible. But Israel can just do this.
Why?
Why?
Ever thought I would see the day I agree with Robb, Annie and Mamba on the same thread .
Bats has gone more off the rails than usual here.
comment by Thorgen Kloppinson - "When the facts are in your favour, you argue the facts. When facts are not in your favour you argue the process." (U1282)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 2 hours, 16 minutes ago
comment by Vladimikel Artutin - committing war crimes against football since 2019 (U18355)
posted 10 minutes ago
Yes, where is his condemnation? 176 comments and still only 2 people have levelled any criticism at him
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Probably because it's not a partisan Dems/Rep issue. Its US policy to back Israel irrespective of whom is in power. I do think the US has been mealy mouthed in its condemnation of killing innocent civilians in Gaza. But so have the government in the UK.
Antonio Gutierrez was correct when he, rightly, said Oct 7th didn't happen in a vacuum. It happened as a result of decades of oppression in Gaza and the West Bank. I heard on BBC that over 2000 Palestinians in the West Bank are currently in prison without knowing what they're charged with, legal representation, trial or sentence and release date. Also 25% of Palestinians in the West Bank have been imprisoned by Israel at one time or another. So called settlers use violence to evict Palestinians from their land, subsidised by the Israeli government, which then goes unpunished. Again thi s has been going on for decades, and has increased since Oct 7th in the West Bank.
Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank have no agency, representation and are ignored by western nations. They osensibly live in an apartheid state. This is what's given rise to Hamas.
The Israeli ambassador to the UK was on LBC the other day saying 'Gazans should leave the strip and claim refuge in Egypt' and 'tunnels connect every school, hospital, mosque and second home in Gaza so it needs to be levelled'. There was not a peep of condemnation from our government.
Its either rank hypocrisy or willful ignorance on the part of the US & UK. It is not a party political, or partisan issue though and shouldn't be confused as such as it only muddies the waters of sensible debate on a nuanced and difficult issue.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm sure the US and UK governments know how absurd their stance is, but they can't do fack all about it. Everyone is afraid to speak against Israel. Even the mighty UK and US tend to play ball when it comes to Israel. If it was any other country doing what Israel are doing we'd be sending troops to depose whatever dictator was responsible. But Israel can just do this.
Why?
Why?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s very simple. Israel is a hugely strategic military base for the US. Not just for the Middle East in terms of politics but also the Suez Canal. It can’t let Israel fall or else they don’t have a foothold there in one of the most strategic corridors in the world.
So they let Israel get away with literal murder because in their bigger picture it doesn’t really matter as long as Israel is allowed to look strong in the region.
comment by Robb - Glenn Maxwell. Legend. Hero. Icon. (U22716)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Thorgen Kloppinson - "When the facts are in your favour, you argue the facts. When facts are not in your favour you argue the process." (U1282)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 2 hours, 16 minutes ago
comment by Vladimikel Artutin - committing war crimes against football since 2019 (U18355)
posted 10 minutes ago
Yes, where is his condemnation? 176 comments and still only 2 people have levelled any criticism at him
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Probably because it's not a partisan Dems/Rep issue. Its US policy to back Israel irrespective of whom is in power. I do think the US has been mealy mouthed in its condemnation of killing innocent civilians in Gaza. But so have the government in the UK.
Antonio Gutierrez was correct when he, rightly, said Oct 7th didn't happen in a vacuum. It happened as a result of decades of oppression in Gaza and the West Bank. I heard on BBC that over 2000 Palestinians in the West Bank are currently in prison without knowing what they're charged with, legal representation, trial or sentence and release date. Also 25% of Palestinians in the West Bank have been imprisoned by Israel at one time or another. So called settlers use violence to evict Palestinians from their land, subsidised by the Israeli government, which then goes unpunished. Again thi s has been going on for decades, and has increased since Oct 7th in the West Bank.
Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank have no agency, representation and are ignored by western nations. They osensibly live in an apartheid state. This is what's given rise to Hamas.
The Israeli ambassador to the UK was on LBC the other day saying 'Gazans should leave the strip and claim refuge in Egypt' and 'tunnels connect every school, hospital, mosque and second home in Gaza so it needs to be levelled'. There was not a peep of condemnation from our government.
Its either rank hypocrisy or willful ignorance on the part of the US & UK. It is not a party political, or partisan issue though and shouldn't be confused as such as it only muddies the waters of sensible debate on a nuanced and difficult issue.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm sure the US and UK governments know how absurd their stance is, but they can't do fack all about it. Everyone is afraid to speak against Israel. Even the mighty UK and US tend to play ball when it comes to Israel. If it was any other country doing what Israel are doing we'd be sending troops to depose whatever dictator was responsible. But Israel can just do this.
Why?
Why?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s very simple. Israel is a hugely strategic military base for the US. Not just for the Middle East in terms of politics but also the Suez Canal. It can’t let Israel fall or else they don’t have a foothold there in one of the most strategic corridors in the world.
So they let Israel get away with literal murder because in their bigger picture it doesn’t really matter as long as Israel is allowed to look strong in the region.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
True, but there is a difference between letting Israel fall and arming them to commit genocide. They don't need to do the latter to achieve their goals.
They are helpless in the face of Israel.
comment by Thorgen Kloppinson - "When the facts are in your favour, you argue the facts. When facts are not in your favour you argue the process." (U1282)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Robb - Glenn Maxwell. Legend. Hero. Icon. (U22716)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Thorgen Kloppinson - "When the facts are in your favour, you argue the facts. When facts are not in your favour you argue the process." (U1282)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 2 hours, 16 minutes ago
comment by Vladimikel Artutin - committing war crimes against football since 2019 (U18355)
posted 10 minutes ago
Yes, where is his condemnation? 176 comments and still only 2 people have levelled any criticism at him
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Probably because it's not a partisan Dems/Rep issue. Its US policy to back Israel irrespective of whom is in power. I do think the US has been mealy mouthed in its condemnation of killing innocent civilians in Gaza. But so have the government in the UK.
Antonio Gutierrez was correct when he, rightly, said Oct 7th didn't happen in a vacuum. It happened as a result of decades of oppression in Gaza and the West Bank. I heard on BBC that over 2000 Palestinians in the West Bank are currently in prison without knowing what they're charged with, legal representation, trial or sentence and release date. Also 25% of Palestinians in the West Bank have been imprisoned by Israel at one time or another. So called settlers use violence to evict Palestinians from their land, subsidised by the Israeli government, which then goes unpunished. Again thi s has been going on for decades, and has increased since Oct 7th in the West Bank.
Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank have no agency, representation and are ignored by western nations. They osensibly live in an apartheid state. This is what's given rise to Hamas.
The Israeli ambassador to the UK was on LBC the other day saying 'Gazans should leave the strip and claim refuge in Egypt' and 'tunnels connect every school, hospital, mosque and second home in Gaza so it needs to be levelled'. There was not a peep of condemnation from our government.
Its either rank hypocrisy or willful ignorance on the part of the US & UK. It is not a party political, or partisan issue though and shouldn't be confused as such as it only muddies the waters of sensible debate on a nuanced and difficult issue.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm sure the US and UK governments know how absurd their stance is, but they can't do fack all about it. Everyone is afraid to speak against Israel. Even the mighty UK and US tend to play ball when it comes to Israel. If it was any other country doing what Israel are doing we'd be sending troops to depose whatever dictator was responsible. But Israel can just do this.
Why?
Why?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s very simple. Israel is a hugely strategic military base for the US. Not just for the Middle East in terms of politics but also the Suez Canal. It can’t let Israel fall or else they don’t have a foothold there in one of the most strategic corridors in the world.
So they let Israel get away with literal murder because in their bigger picture it doesn’t really matter as long as Israel is allowed to look strong in the region.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
True, but there is a difference between letting Israel fall and arming them to commit genocide. They don't need to do the latter to achieve their goals.
They are helpless in the face of Israel.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You’re implying there’s some sort of high level Jewish conspiracy high in the corridors of the US government when there are far more Christian zionists than Jewish ones so I’d say if anyone is pulling strings it’s more likely to be christofascists.
As for what’s going on now - yes, it’s horrific but I’m sure the US won’t really mind if more of the region is controlled by Israel when the dust has settled in the next few months. I’m sure (not so) secretly they’d love if Israel controlled it all.
comment by Vladimikel Artutin - committing war crimes against football since 2019 (U18355)
posted 2 hours, 25 minutes ago
I just can’t accept the answer that the US stance on Israel stays the same regardless of who is in power.
There is more to presidency than politicising and taking orders. Having humanity, decency and wanting to change things for the better is what makes a great president.
In the eyes of some people on here, you only don’t have to be Donald Trump to be a good president
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"I just can’t accept the answer that the US stance on Israel stays the same regardless of who is in power."
I suspect that's the nub of your OP and the question posed. Unfortunately the fact that you can't accept it, doesn't make it untrue.
I am not implying anything. The observations I've made and the questions are all valid. Weirdly, nobody can answer why when Iraq invades Kuwait we step in to save Kuwait but will give Israel $4b worth of weapons so they can kill women and children by the thousands.
Entire Iraq war caused around 100,000 deaths. We have like 25,000 Palestinians dead here already.
The double standards are amazing and I'm not buying the base in the middle east argument because you don't need to allow genocide in order to have a base in the middle east.
They are helping Israel to clear the Gaza strip. They want space for their people and to grab the estimated $400b worth of minerals, oil and gas within Gaza territory. Isn't that what's happening?
Also, US needs a base in the middle east so as to control the region and control the wealth and resources. Or is that also a conspiracy theory. They don't care about people and will kill middle easterns by the hundreds of thousands to maintain their control.
Saddam didn't have weapons of Mass Destruction, did he? But he wanted to leave the dollar economy and create a new currency to liberate the middle east from western hegemony.
All presidents who have even made that suggestion to leave he dollar economy are currently 6 feet under. They don't just die, they get humiliated and their families eradicated to serve as an example.
There's another conspiracy theory for you.
t’s very simple. Israel is a hugely strategic military base for the US. Not just for the Middle East in terms of politics but also the Suez Canal. It can’t let Israel fall or else they don’t have a foothold there in one of the most strategic corridors in the world.
...............
The US has its feet in quite a lot of locations in the Middle East in present times. They are not as dependent in Israel as they once were.
"The double standards are amazing and I'm not buying the base in the middle east argument because you don't need to allow genocide in order to have a base in the middle east."
Haven't the US got military bases in Saudi and Oman plus a strong naval fleet in the med/red sea?
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 47 seconds ago
"The double standards are amazing and I'm not buying the base in the middle east argument because you don't need to allow genocide in order to have a base in the middle east."
Haven't the US got military bases in Saudi and Oman plus a strong naval fleet in the med/red sea?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Tbf i was underselling the concept of a ‘military base’. I mean an entire country reliant on it to exist in a way that Saudi and Oman aren’t that has nuclear weapons and allows them a permanent foothold right by the Suez Canal and also smack bang in the middle of a region that if they got their shiiit together could unite and be a powerful alliance. Look at what happened with OPEC in the 1970s. Israel are an insurance policy for the US.
Sign in if you want to comment
Let’s talk about (Genocide) Joe
Page 8 of 14
9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13
posted on 9/1/24
Yes, where is his condemnation? 176 comments and still only 2 people have levelled any criticism at him
posted on 9/1/24
https://amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/jan/06/biden-administration-staff-gaza-policy-protest
Biden’s own administration are questioning his policies yet we aren’t allowed to do it on here
posted on 9/1/24
Well done Bats, finally you’re talking sense-and in most important issues of all.
posted on 9/1/24
comment by Vladimikel Artutin - committing war crimes against football since 2019 (U18355)
posted 10 minutes ago
Yes, where is his condemnation? 176 comments and still only 2 people have levelled any criticism at him
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Probably because it's not a partisan Dems/Rep issue. Its US policy to back Israel irrespective of whom is in power. I do think the US has been mealy mouthed in its condemnation of killing innocent civilians in Gaza. But so have the government in the UK.
Antonio Gutierrez was correct when he, rightly, said Oct 7th didn't happen in a vacuum. It happened as a result of decades of oppression in Gaza and the West Bank. I heard on BBC that over 2000 Palestinians in the West Bank are currently in prison without knowing what they're charged with, legal representation, trial or sentence and release date. Also 25% of Palestinians in the West Bank have been imprisoned by Israel at one time or another. So called settlers use violence to evict Palestinians from their land, subsidised by the Israeli government, which then goes unpunished. Again thi s has been going on for decades, and has increased since Oct 7th in the West Bank.
Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank have no agency, representation and are ignored by western nations. They osensibly live in an apartheid state. This is what's given rise to Hamas.
The Israeli ambassador to the UK was on LBC the other day saying 'Gazans should leave the strip and claim refuge in Egypt' and 'tunnels connect every school, hospital, mosque and second home in Gaza so it needs to be levelled'. There was not a peep of condemnation from our government.
Its either rank hypocrisy or willful ignorance on the part of the US & UK. It is not a party political, or partisan issue though and shouldn't be confused as such as it only muddies the waters of sensible debate on a nuanced and difficult issue.
posted on 9/1/24
The Israeli ambassador to the UK was on LBC the other day saying 'Gazans should leave the strip and claim refuge in Egypt' and 'tunnels connect every school, hospital, mosque and second home in Gaza so it needs to be levelled'. There was not a peep of condemnation from our government.”
Of course they won’t criticise it because this is the Israeli end game, dispose of the filthy sand people to an in-habitual desert and let other sand people (Egyptians) deal with all the rising terrorist organisations that will come from it.
posted on 9/1/24
I just can’t accept the answer that the US stance on Israel stays the same regardless of who is in power.
There is more to presidency than politicising and taking orders. Having humanity, decency and wanting to change things for the better is what makes a great president.
In the eyes of some people on here, you only don’t have to be Donald Trump to be a good president
posted on 9/1/24
comment by Vladimikel Artutin - committing war crimes against football since 2019 (U18355)
posted 3 minutes ago
I just can’t accept the answer that the US stance on Israel stays the same regardless of who is in power.
There is more to presidency than politicising and taking orders. Having humanity, decency and wanting to change things for the better is what makes a great president.
In the eyes of some people on here, you only don’t have to be Donald Trump to be a good president
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Regardless of an Democratic or Republican president the stance remains the same. For example Bidens predecessor moved the US embassy in Israel to Jerusalem giving legitimacy to Israel's claim to the city being 'their capital'.
posted on 9/1/24
Blame the Romans, they started it all.
posted on 9/1/24
The who's in power bit is kind of irrelevant right now though seeing as if it's not Biden it will be Trump, who as mentioned above is even more pro Isreal.
You can't really ignore the alternative in a discussion like this.
posted on 9/1/24
There is no alternative though. It’s not like Biden can be sacked today and Trump walks into office. By the time the next POTUS is elected, there won’t be a Gaza left to talk about.
I just can’t ever remember a time where a president has been almost solely judged on who he isn’t rather than what he has/hasn’t done in the job.
Who here actually condemns Biden?
posted on 9/1/24
comment by Vladimikel Artutin - committing war crimes against football since 2019 (U18355)
posted 15 minutes ago
There is no alternative though. It’s not like Biden can be sacked today and Trump walks into office. By the time the next POTUS is elected, there won’t be a Gaza left to talk about.
I just can’t ever remember a time where a president has been almost solely judged on who he isn’t rather than what he has/hasn’t done in the job.
Who here actually condemns Biden?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think to the people whose opinion is actually important for an American president - Americans - there are dozens of more important issues he will be judged on ahead of Israel.
posted on 9/1/24
The most important issue seemingly that he isn’t Trump
posted on 9/1/24
comment by Vladimikel Artutin - committing war crimes against football since 2019 (U18355)
posted 3 minutes ago
The most important issue seemingly that he isn’t Trump
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well it that's what the yanks think
posted on 9/1/24
comment by Vladimikel Artutin - committing war crimes against football since 2019 (U18355)
posted 13 minutes ago
The most important issue seemingly that he isn’t Trump
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No it's more that he's judged for more than what happens in Gaza.
I'm not American so can't comment on things in the US under him, but the vast majority of people simply don't have the current situation over there at the top of their priority list.
posted on 9/1/24
comment by Vladimikel Artutin - committing war crimes against football since 2019 (U18355)
posted 42 minutes ago
The most important issue seemingly that he isn’t Trump
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No the most important thing is Oct 7th could've happened in 2023, 2016, 2008 or 1996 and the US response would he the same.
posted on 9/1/24
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 2 hours, 16 minutes ago
comment by Vladimikel Artutin - committing war crimes against football since 2019 (U18355)
posted 10 minutes ago
Yes, where is his condemnation? 176 comments and still only 2 people have levelled any criticism at him
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Probably because it's not a partisan Dems/Rep issue. Its US policy to back Israel irrespective of whom is in power. I do think the US has been mealy mouthed in its condemnation of killing innocent civilians in Gaza. But so have the government in the UK.
Antonio Gutierrez was correct when he, rightly, said Oct 7th didn't happen in a vacuum. It happened as a result of decades of oppression in Gaza and the West Bank. I heard on BBC that over 2000 Palestinians in the West Bank are currently in prison without knowing what they're charged with, legal representation, trial or sentence and release date. Also 25% of Palestinians in the West Bank have been imprisoned by Israel at one time or another. So called settlers use violence to evict Palestinians from their land, subsidised by the Israeli government, which then goes unpunished. Again thi s has been going on for decades, and has increased since Oct 7th in the West Bank.
Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank have no agency, representation and are ignored by western nations. They osensibly live in an apartheid state. This is what's given rise to Hamas.
The Israeli ambassador to the UK was on LBC the other day saying 'Gazans should leave the strip and claim refuge in Egypt' and 'tunnels connect every school, hospital, mosque and second home in Gaza so it needs to be levelled'. There was not a peep of condemnation from our government.
Its either rank hypocrisy or willful ignorance on the part of the US & UK. It is not a party political, or partisan issue though and shouldn't be confused as such as it only muddies the waters of sensible debate on a nuanced and difficult issue.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm sure the US and UK governments know how absurd their stance is, but they can't do fack all about it. Everyone is afraid to speak against Israel. Even the mighty UK and US tend to play ball when it comes to Israel. If it was any other country doing what Israel are doing we'd be sending troops to depose whatever dictator was responsible. But Israel can just do this.
Why?
Why?
posted on 9/1/24
Ever thought I would see the day I agree with Robb, Annie and Mamba on the same thread .
Bats has gone more off the rails than usual here.
posted on 9/1/24
comment by Thorgen Kloppinson - "When the facts are in your favour, you argue the facts. When facts are not in your favour you argue the process." (U1282)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 2 hours, 16 minutes ago
comment by Vladimikel Artutin - committing war crimes against football since 2019 (U18355)
posted 10 minutes ago
Yes, where is his condemnation? 176 comments and still only 2 people have levelled any criticism at him
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Probably because it's not a partisan Dems/Rep issue. Its US policy to back Israel irrespective of whom is in power. I do think the US has been mealy mouthed in its condemnation of killing innocent civilians in Gaza. But so have the government in the UK.
Antonio Gutierrez was correct when he, rightly, said Oct 7th didn't happen in a vacuum. It happened as a result of decades of oppression in Gaza and the West Bank. I heard on BBC that over 2000 Palestinians in the West Bank are currently in prison without knowing what they're charged with, legal representation, trial or sentence and release date. Also 25% of Palestinians in the West Bank have been imprisoned by Israel at one time or another. So called settlers use violence to evict Palestinians from their land, subsidised by the Israeli government, which then goes unpunished. Again thi s has been going on for decades, and has increased since Oct 7th in the West Bank.
Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank have no agency, representation and are ignored by western nations. They osensibly live in an apartheid state. This is what's given rise to Hamas.
The Israeli ambassador to the UK was on LBC the other day saying 'Gazans should leave the strip and claim refuge in Egypt' and 'tunnels connect every school, hospital, mosque and second home in Gaza so it needs to be levelled'. There was not a peep of condemnation from our government.
Its either rank hypocrisy or willful ignorance on the part of the US & UK. It is not a party political, or partisan issue though and shouldn't be confused as such as it only muddies the waters of sensible debate on a nuanced and difficult issue.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm sure the US and UK governments know how absurd their stance is, but they can't do fack all about it. Everyone is afraid to speak against Israel. Even the mighty UK and US tend to play ball when it comes to Israel. If it was any other country doing what Israel are doing we'd be sending troops to depose whatever dictator was responsible. But Israel can just do this.
Why?
Why?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s very simple. Israel is a hugely strategic military base for the US. Not just for the Middle East in terms of politics but also the Suez Canal. It can’t let Israel fall or else they don’t have a foothold there in one of the most strategic corridors in the world.
So they let Israel get away with literal murder because in their bigger picture it doesn’t really matter as long as Israel is allowed to look strong in the region.
posted on 9/1/24
comment by Robb - Glenn Maxwell. Legend. Hero. Icon. (U22716)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Thorgen Kloppinson - "When the facts are in your favour, you argue the facts. When facts are not in your favour you argue the process." (U1282)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 2 hours, 16 minutes ago
comment by Vladimikel Artutin - committing war crimes against football since 2019 (U18355)
posted 10 minutes ago
Yes, where is his condemnation? 176 comments and still only 2 people have levelled any criticism at him
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Probably because it's not a partisan Dems/Rep issue. Its US policy to back Israel irrespective of whom is in power. I do think the US has been mealy mouthed in its condemnation of killing innocent civilians in Gaza. But so have the government in the UK.
Antonio Gutierrez was correct when he, rightly, said Oct 7th didn't happen in a vacuum. It happened as a result of decades of oppression in Gaza and the West Bank. I heard on BBC that over 2000 Palestinians in the West Bank are currently in prison without knowing what they're charged with, legal representation, trial or sentence and release date. Also 25% of Palestinians in the West Bank have been imprisoned by Israel at one time or another. So called settlers use violence to evict Palestinians from their land, subsidised by the Israeli government, which then goes unpunished. Again thi s has been going on for decades, and has increased since Oct 7th in the West Bank.
Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank have no agency, representation and are ignored by western nations. They osensibly live in an apartheid state. This is what's given rise to Hamas.
The Israeli ambassador to the UK was on LBC the other day saying 'Gazans should leave the strip and claim refuge in Egypt' and 'tunnels connect every school, hospital, mosque and second home in Gaza so it needs to be levelled'. There was not a peep of condemnation from our government.
Its either rank hypocrisy or willful ignorance on the part of the US & UK. It is not a party political, or partisan issue though and shouldn't be confused as such as it only muddies the waters of sensible debate on a nuanced and difficult issue.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm sure the US and UK governments know how absurd their stance is, but they can't do fack all about it. Everyone is afraid to speak against Israel. Even the mighty UK and US tend to play ball when it comes to Israel. If it was any other country doing what Israel are doing we'd be sending troops to depose whatever dictator was responsible. But Israel can just do this.
Why?
Why?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s very simple. Israel is a hugely strategic military base for the US. Not just for the Middle East in terms of politics but also the Suez Canal. It can’t let Israel fall or else they don’t have a foothold there in one of the most strategic corridors in the world.
So they let Israel get away with literal murder because in their bigger picture it doesn’t really matter as long as Israel is allowed to look strong in the region.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
True, but there is a difference between letting Israel fall and arming them to commit genocide. They don't need to do the latter to achieve their goals.
They are helpless in the face of Israel.
posted on 9/1/24
comment by Thorgen Kloppinson - "When the facts are in your favour, you argue the facts. When facts are not in your favour you argue the process." (U1282)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Robb - Glenn Maxwell. Legend. Hero. Icon. (U22716)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Thorgen Kloppinson - "When the facts are in your favour, you argue the facts. When facts are not in your favour you argue the process." (U1282)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 2 hours, 16 minutes ago
comment by Vladimikel Artutin - committing war crimes against football since 2019 (U18355)
posted 10 minutes ago
Yes, where is his condemnation? 176 comments and still only 2 people have levelled any criticism at him
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Probably because it's not a partisan Dems/Rep issue. Its US policy to back Israel irrespective of whom is in power. I do think the US has been mealy mouthed in its condemnation of killing innocent civilians in Gaza. But so have the government in the UK.
Antonio Gutierrez was correct when he, rightly, said Oct 7th didn't happen in a vacuum. It happened as a result of decades of oppression in Gaza and the West Bank. I heard on BBC that over 2000 Palestinians in the West Bank are currently in prison without knowing what they're charged with, legal representation, trial or sentence and release date. Also 25% of Palestinians in the West Bank have been imprisoned by Israel at one time or another. So called settlers use violence to evict Palestinians from their land, subsidised by the Israeli government, which then goes unpunished. Again thi s has been going on for decades, and has increased since Oct 7th in the West Bank.
Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank have no agency, representation and are ignored by western nations. They osensibly live in an apartheid state. This is what's given rise to Hamas.
The Israeli ambassador to the UK was on LBC the other day saying 'Gazans should leave the strip and claim refuge in Egypt' and 'tunnels connect every school, hospital, mosque and second home in Gaza so it needs to be levelled'. There was not a peep of condemnation from our government.
Its either rank hypocrisy or willful ignorance on the part of the US & UK. It is not a party political, or partisan issue though and shouldn't be confused as such as it only muddies the waters of sensible debate on a nuanced and difficult issue.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm sure the US and UK governments know how absurd their stance is, but they can't do fack all about it. Everyone is afraid to speak against Israel. Even the mighty UK and US tend to play ball when it comes to Israel. If it was any other country doing what Israel are doing we'd be sending troops to depose whatever dictator was responsible. But Israel can just do this.
Why?
Why?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s very simple. Israel is a hugely strategic military base for the US. Not just for the Middle East in terms of politics but also the Suez Canal. It can’t let Israel fall or else they don’t have a foothold there in one of the most strategic corridors in the world.
So they let Israel get away with literal murder because in their bigger picture it doesn’t really matter as long as Israel is allowed to look strong in the region.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
True, but there is a difference between letting Israel fall and arming them to commit genocide. They don't need to do the latter to achieve their goals.
They are helpless in the face of Israel.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You’re implying there’s some sort of high level Jewish conspiracy high in the corridors of the US government when there are far more Christian zionists than Jewish ones so I’d say if anyone is pulling strings it’s more likely to be christofascists.
As for what’s going on now - yes, it’s horrific but I’m sure the US won’t really mind if more of the region is controlled by Israel when the dust has settled in the next few months. I’m sure (not so) secretly they’d love if Israel controlled it all.
posted on 9/1/24
comment by Vladimikel Artutin - committing war crimes against football since 2019 (U18355)
posted 2 hours, 25 minutes ago
I just can’t accept the answer that the US stance on Israel stays the same regardless of who is in power.
There is more to presidency than politicising and taking orders. Having humanity, decency and wanting to change things for the better is what makes a great president.
In the eyes of some people on here, you only don’t have to be Donald Trump to be a good president
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"I just can’t accept the answer that the US stance on Israel stays the same regardless of who is in power."
I suspect that's the nub of your OP and the question posed. Unfortunately the fact that you can't accept it, doesn't make it untrue.
posted on 9/1/24
I am not implying anything. The observations I've made and the questions are all valid. Weirdly, nobody can answer why when Iraq invades Kuwait we step in to save Kuwait but will give Israel $4b worth of weapons so they can kill women and children by the thousands.
Entire Iraq war caused around 100,000 deaths. We have like 25,000 Palestinians dead here already.
The double standards are amazing and I'm not buying the base in the middle east argument because you don't need to allow genocide in order to have a base in the middle east.
They are helping Israel to clear the Gaza strip. They want space for their people and to grab the estimated $400b worth of minerals, oil and gas within Gaza territory. Isn't that what's happening?
Also, US needs a base in the middle east so as to control the region and control the wealth and resources. Or is that also a conspiracy theory. They don't care about people and will kill middle easterns by the hundreds of thousands to maintain their control.
Saddam didn't have weapons of Mass Destruction, did he? But he wanted to leave the dollar economy and create a new currency to liberate the middle east from western hegemony.
All presidents who have even made that suggestion to leave he dollar economy are currently 6 feet under. They don't just die, they get humiliated and their families eradicated to serve as an example.
There's another conspiracy theory for you.
posted on 9/1/24
t’s very simple. Israel is a hugely strategic military base for the US. Not just for the Middle East in terms of politics but also the Suez Canal. It can’t let Israel fall or else they don’t have a foothold there in one of the most strategic corridors in the world.
...............
The US has its feet in quite a lot of locations in the Middle East in present times. They are not as dependent in Israel as they once were.
posted on 9/1/24
"The double standards are amazing and I'm not buying the base in the middle east argument because you don't need to allow genocide in order to have a base in the middle east."
Haven't the US got military bases in Saudi and Oman plus a strong naval fleet in the med/red sea?
posted on 9/1/24
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 47 seconds ago
"The double standards are amazing and I'm not buying the base in the middle east argument because you don't need to allow genocide in order to have a base in the middle east."
Haven't the US got military bases in Saudi and Oman plus a strong naval fleet in the med/red sea?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Tbf i was underselling the concept of a ‘military base’. I mean an entire country reliant on it to exist in a way that Saudi and Oman aren’t that has nuclear weapons and allows them a permanent foothold right by the Suez Canal and also smack bang in the middle of a region that if they got their shiiit together could unite and be a powerful alliance. Look at what happened with OPEC in the 1970s. Israel are an insurance policy for the US.
Page 8 of 14
9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13