comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 22 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 8 minutes ago
On the matter of recycling.....I agree the producers need to take responsibility and the cost for this and where they do not they are being taxed more.
But what's happening to this money? Is it going to Local Council's to fulfil the waste and recycling operations. No! Council's are getting no extra money.
This is just another money raising exercise under the guise of being green.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Who spent 14 years stripping local councils of funding, to the point of bankruptcy for some?
But 4 months in to the new government and it's Labour's fault
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Never said that whatsoever
I actually agreed with you on the need to tax polluters and the Govt have upped this tax.
You the one that said that the burden to tidy up these polluters was on Councils....My point is that this raised tax isnt going towards that!
Surely anyone who actually cares should be asking "where is this polluters tax going if its not to the Councils who bare the cost of pollution?"
But again, my overall point - wage rises, NI rises, thresholds lowered + packaging tax rises. It's a quad whammy. All worthy but how does doing this in one bang help the economy? the economy which has to pay for everything we want to do as a country?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The point of the tax is to incentivise business to produce and use less plastic packaging and to recycle their own plastic waste not keep producing more. This will reduce the recycling costs on local councils.
As for employer NI. Business could measure the growth of not having 1/10th of the population/customer base/employee pool on an NHS waiting list or living in poverty (18%).
You didn't think there would be a reckoning after 14 years of public service cuts wealth inequality, Brexit and the impact of Liz Truss' short tenure?
Schools and public buildings need repairing, 7m NHS waiting list, backlogs in the justice system that undermine it, re funding local councils after years of cuts, over crowded prisons etc etc.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You are again missing the point.
Yes, a lot of damage needs making good.
But it is counter productive to layer taxes on businesses with the intention to fund public services if the result of that is to - drive up inflation, keep interest rates high, impact unemployment, impact businesses ability to give pay rises, impact growth.
I said at the start today that the Govt may find itself with all these negative impacts come the next budget .
The fundamental point is that the economy drives absolutely everything. If it is strong and incentivised it will create more opportunities, pay more, employ more, generate more tax revenue, reduce welfare spending.
It is remarkable how much an economy responds to sentiment. If there is uncertainty then it is a snowball effect that can often lead to low growth, low wage growth and rising unemployment.
It is a brief snapshot but the 0.1% growth of the last quarter has been significantly contributed to (according to most economic commentators) the negative messaging and uncertainty about what the budget will bring.
For many businesses, that uncertainty will not have been alleviated, in fact their worst fears may have come true. Therefore do not expect anything too different from the last quarter come the 2024 Q4 figures.
I want public services to be properly funded and all the shortfalls to be met but none of that is possible without a strong stable economy and that is certainly not what was presented at the last budget, unless you can tell me different (other than Hector's, lets wait and see mantra).
My fear that in going large on tax and spending and borrowing now, they hope that come 2029 it's all looking rosy. It's a gamble and their desire to make some public spending headlines comes at the cost of growth.
"Food bank reliance has soared
Crucially, while prices shot up, wages remained stagnant, leading to record numbers of people relying on food banks. The Trussell Trust, which is the UK’s largest food bank charity, has seen its business grow rapidly. From the number of food banks to the number of emergency parcels, they provide a sad record of the UK’s growing number of impoverished households.
Many of the people who visit food banks are in work, but their low wages cannot stretch to cover bills. Not only have consumer prices risen, but so have taxes, rent and mortgages."
"Inflation peaked in October 2022 at 11.1%. It has fallen ever since, with a few bumps in the road, helping Rishi Sunak meet his pledge to halve inflation during 2023.
Yet food prices remain 20% above the level seen in July 2021 and family budgets remain stretched."
"Council tax has been on a rollercoaster ride since 2010. First it was frozen, then from 2016 increased by 5% a year, before a social care surcharge in 2020 limited the increase to 3% (in total, bills still increased by 5%).
Across all taxes, the overall level is heading to its highest since the second world war under current government plans. Mortgage and rent bills have also soared. The latest official figures show that rent inflation is at a record level, while those who need to remortgage can face a doubling or trebling of their monthly interest payments.
Figures from the homelessness charity Crisis show that the number of people sleeping rough is now 61% higher than it was 10 years ago and 120% higher than when data collection began in 2010."
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/jun/20/the-economy-how-14-years-of-tory-rule-have-changed-britain-in-charts
Customers and employees have been squeezed for years under the last lot, by business passing on the costs of various global events, by wages not rising in line with the cost of living and increased taxes.
What did business profits, shareholder dividends and executive pay do over the same period?
Retailers can threaten all they like. The threat of not opening yet another mini supermarket or out of town outlet store on the back of under paid staff who can't afford their bills isn't going to contribute to the economy, just profits and tax avoidance (in the case of one signatory). The threat of online shopping isn't the fault of the government either and employers like supermarkets, amongst others, employ less people on the back of online shopping.
Growth at 0.1% for the Quarter.
Now inflation jumped to 2.3% its highest level since April.
"The latest inflation figure comes after the government revealed that an additional 50,000 pensioners will be living in relative poverty next year as a result of cuts to the winter fuel allowance." (BBC)
Every country globally is struggling though right?
comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 1 hour, 46 minutes ago
Every country globally is struggling though right?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
But the UK had the fastest rate of growth in the G7 for the first 6 months of this year, now we have the second worst!
What’s your thoughts on that?
comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 2 hours ago
Every country globally is struggling though right?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well indeed, we havent seen the levels of growth of the 00s when global economy was booming (2-5% UK GDP growth).
Since the financial crisis its been typically 1-2%.
The global position is still difficult but improving with forecast for about 2.7% growth for 2024. The UK was well on target to meet that with 0.6 and 0.7% in the first 2 quarters. It's now stalled at 0.1& for Q3.
Within an improving global context, we should also be growing even if that will still represent modest growth in a historical context.
Pick the odd one out:
Tough decisions =
1. putting pensioners into poverty and the chiller.
2. Taxing businesses to discourage them from employing more staff, offering existing staff better wages, or making other investments in their business.
3. Paying train drivers exactly what they demand, with no strings attached, strings that would have seen them modernise and move towards a more efficient modern system that would ultimately cost the public purse less over time.
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 9 minutes ago
Pick the odd one out:
Tough decisions =
1. putting pensioners into poverty and the chiller.
2. Taxing businesses to discourage them from employing more staff, offering existing staff better wages, or making other investments in their business.
3. Paying train drivers exactly what they demand, with no strings attached, strings that would have seen them modernise and move towards a more efficient modern system that would ultimately cost the public purse less over time.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Labour committed in their manifesto to end the use of migrant hotels and now they are opening 14 more and yet they’ll let pensioners freeze! More pre election lies!
comment by RED666…Always Right! 🇬🇧 (U6562)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 9 minutes ago
Pick the odd one out:
Tough decisions =
1. putting pensioners into poverty and the chiller.
2. Taxing businesses to discourage them from employing more staff, offering existing staff better wages, or making other investments in their business.
3. Paying train drivers exactly what they demand, with no strings attached, strings that would have seen them modernise and move towards a more efficient modern system that would ultimately cost the public purse less over time.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Labour committed in their manifesto to end the use of migrant hotels and now they are opening 14 more and yet they’ll let pensioners freeze! More pre election lies!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Their own analysis of Tory proposals of means testing the WFP a couple years ago concluded that 3000-4000 pensions would die as a result.
Sir K forgot to mention that when announcing the policy.
Again, another example of decisions made in the treasury, without really looking beyond what money it can raise/save.
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 1 hour ago
Pick the odd one out:
Tough decisions =
1. putting pensioners into poverty and the chiller.
2. Taxing businesses to discourage them from employing more staff, offering existing staff better wages, or making other investments in their business.
3. Paying train drivers exactly what they demand, with no strings attached, strings that would have seen them modernise and move towards a more efficient modern system that would ultimately cost the public purse less over time.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Lesson learned, Join a Union.
Pension Credit
Universal Credit
income-related Employment and Support Allowance (ESA)
income-based Jobseeker’s Allowance (JSA)
Income Support
Child Tax Credit
Working Tax Credit
All entitled to a WFP, then poorest in society.
The business thing is just hot air and bluster, if your business cannot handle modest staff cost increases then its not a viable going concern, thems juat the blunt facts.
comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 1 hour ago
Pick the odd one out:
Tough decisions =
1. putting pensioners into poverty and the chiller.
2. Taxing businesses to discourage them from employing more staff, offering existing staff better wages, or making other investments in their business.
3. Paying train drivers exactly what they demand, with no strings attached, strings that would have seen them modernise and move towards a more efficient modern system that would ultimately cost the public purse less over time.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Lesson learned, Join a Union.
Pension Credit
Universal Credit
income-related Employment and Support Allowance (ESA)
income-based Jobseeker’s Allowance (JSA)
Income Support
Child Tax Credit
Working Tax Credit
All entitled to a WFP, then poorest in society.
The business thing is just hot air and bluster, if your business cannot handle modest staff cost increases then its not a viable going concern, thems juat the blunt facts.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That is the lesson to learn if all you are interested in is "getting what you want/think you deserve"
If you want a healthy economy with a diverse range of businesses, want to encourage entrepreneurism, want to ensure new businesses can develop and grow and become larger more successful businesses, if you want to do all these things which will create an economy that will pay for all those benefits that will help the lowest paid and poorest then the businesses community needs supporting.
If you want the world run by amazon, tescos and a few other mega companies dominating everything then yeah, lets unionise the world and create a businesses environment where only the very successful stand a chance.
SMEs contribute around half of the turnover in the UK private sector, est. £2.4 trillion.
SMEs employ 16.7 million people, which is 61% of the total employment in the UK.
But hey, their concerns are hot air and bluster. Feck em, right, if they cannot be a success who needs them.
And as for anyone looking to start a business, perhaps grow, employ a few more people. Bugggger them too, dont bother unless you're gonna be anything less than financial success from the word go.
Lets just all rely on the amazons of this world. They're succesful, they can absorb additional costs. They pay loads of tax, oh wait.
"Modest staff cost increases" that will raise £25bn. Define modest
While we're at it, lets close all the pubs. Most operate on the margins, make on average 12p profit per pint, cannot afford to pay their staff that well. Feck 'em. Who needs pubs right? if they cannot keep it viable and pay staff generously, then don't try and support them, 10 close every week anyway, let them die
Hold on.let me get my tiny violin.
"But hey, their concerns are hot air and bluster. Feck em, right, if they cannot be a success who needs them."
You wanna preach capitalism, Market forces my good
man.
Biatching about a relatively small increase in overheads after the unprecedented support SMEs have had over
the last few years is laughable,. Nobody is denying the importance both economically and socially of small businesses but they are not sacrosanct and untouchable ffs!
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 16 minutes ago
While we're at it, lets close all the pubs. Most operate on the margins, make on average 12p profit per pint, cannot afford to pay their staff that well. Feck 'em. Who needs pubs right? if they cannot keep it viable and pay staff generously, then don't try and support them, 10 close every week anyway, let them die
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If your business model includes paying your staff the legal minimum that isn't livable on then yeah fack em. What good is a business who's staff rely on govt help or foodbanks to get by week on week?
comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 10 minutes ago
Hold on.let me get my tiny violin.
"But hey, their concerns are hot air and bluster. Feck em, right, if they cannot be a success who needs them."
You wanna preach capitalism, Market forces my good
man.
Biatching about a relatively small increase in overheads after the unprecedented support SMEs have had over
the last few years is laughable,. Nobody is denying the importance both economically and socially of small businesses but they are not sacrosanct and untouchable ffs!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Again, £25bn raised does not represent a small cost on businesses.
No one is sacrosanct but if you are preaching about bringing back stability and growth, this action does not achieve that.
What you are saying is that, if businesses cannot run themselves well enough to absorb these costs then so be it, good buy!
And what will be the out come of this. Unemployment ✅ increased welfare costs ✅less/no growth✅increased poverty✅
Not increasing taxes is not supporting a sector, it's to maintain the status quo.
Lowering their taxes is to support a sector.
Increasing their taxes is to attack the sector.
Labour are harming the sector and while I appreciate that there is a need to increase funding for public services, to do this through taxing all businesses is completely contradictory to their manifesto promises to bring stability and growth to the economy, and will also undermine their ongoing plans if the growth is lower than projected.
These actions will increase costs, so will increase prices and inflation and the knock on from this will be felt by Labour's "working people" through their cost of living.
BTW the tax rises seen, mainly through NI, are the biggest in a generation (since 1993). You can call them 'small increases' but that is to brush over the facts!
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
BTW the tax rises seen, mainly through NI, are the biggest in a generation (since 1993). You can call them 'small increases' but that is to brush over the facts!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The geveral tax payer has seen the highest taxes since WW2 implemented by the last Tory gov. In work benefits have risen and so have working people using food banks and classed as being in in work poverty.
We've seen over the last 14 years tax cuts only serve to enrich CEO's and shareholders and those intent on avoiding paying their fair share.
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 23 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
BTW the tax rises seen, mainly through NI, are the biggest in a generation (since 1993). You can call them 'small increases' but that is to brush over the facts!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The geveral tax payer has seen the highest taxes since WW2 implemented by the last Tory gov. In work benefits have risen and so have working people using food banks and classed as being in in work poverty.
We've seen over the last 14 years tax cuts only serve to enrich CEO's and shareholders and those intent on avoiding paying their fair share.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Right, so what have the Govt done to target these CEOs and shareholders, and those avoiding paying their tax?
Oh, that's right, nothing! They hit pensioners, they've hit all businesses indiscriminately in an area that effects cost and growth.
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 6 hours, 18 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 23 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
BTW the tax rises seen, mainly through NI, are the biggest in a generation (since 1993). You can call them 'small increases' but that is to brush over the facts!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The geveral tax payer has seen the highest taxes since WW2 implemented by the last Tory gov. In work benefits have risen and so have working people using food banks and classed as being in in work poverty.
We've seen over the last 14 years tax cuts only serve to enrich CEO's and shareholders and those intent on avoiding paying their fair share.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Right, so what have the Govt done to target these CEOs and shareholders, and those avoiding paying their tax?
Oh, that's right, nothing! They hit pensioners, they've hit all businesses indiscriminately in an area that effects cost and growth.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly!
Daniel Hobbs, managing director at New Leaf Distribution a guy who’s in a better position than Hector and FannyAnnie has said “It feels like the whole economy has deteriorated since the budget."
However Hector and FannyAnnie won’t admit it!
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 13 hours, 39 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 23 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
BTW the tax rises seen, mainly through NI, are the biggest in a generation (since 1993). You can call them 'small increases' but that is to brush over the facts!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The geveral tax payer has seen the highest taxes since WW2 implemented by the last Tory gov. In work benefits have risen and so have working people using food banks and classed as being in in work poverty.
We've seen over the last 14 years tax cuts only serve to enrich CEO's and shareholders and those intent on avoiding paying their fair share.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Right, so what have the Govt done to target these CEOs and shareholders, and those avoiding paying their tax?
Oh, that's right, nothing! They hit pensioners, they've hit all businesses indiscriminately in an area that effects cost and growth.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sorry you expect them to have fixed 14 years of the Tories letting CEO's and shareholders off and giving them tax breaks in 4 months
If yourself and Red had got your way in the election we would've got through 2 Education Secretaries and had a reshuffle by now.
I don't think 2 people, yourself and Red, who voted for more wasted money on things like Rwanda are in a position to bleat about this government, fiscal responsibility or budgets.
posted 1 month, 1 day ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 3 hours, 27 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 13 hours, 39 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 23 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
BTW the tax rises seen, mainly through NI, are the biggest in a generation (since 1993). You can call them 'small increases' but that is to brush over the facts!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The geveral tax payer has seen the highest taxes since WW2 implemented by the last Tory gov. In work benefits have risen and so have working people using food banks and classed as being in in work poverty.
We've seen over the last 14 years tax cuts only serve to enrich CEO's and shareholders and those intent on avoiding paying their fair share.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Right, so what have the Govt done to target these CEOs and shareholders, and those avoiding paying their tax?
Oh, that's right, nothing! They hit pensioners, they've hit all businesses indiscriminately in an area that effects cost and growth.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sorry you expect them to have fixed 14 years of the Tories letting CEO's and shareholders off and giving them tax breaks in 4 months
If yourself and Red had got your way in the election we would've got through 2 Education Secretaries and had a reshuffle by now.
I don't think 2 people, yourself and Red, who voted for more wasted money on things like Rwanda are in a position to bleat about this government, fiscal responsibility or budgets.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"We've seen over the last 14 years tax cuts only serve to enrich CEO's and shareholders and those intent on avoiding paying their fair share."
So these tax cuts, what are they?.....Whatever they are, reverse them, right. Surely that's easy.
Oh, but then they made a promise about not affecting personal taxes so even if they wanted a 50p rate or a 55p rate on the wealthy, they couldnt, because of the stupid feckin red line they drew to get over the election line.
Those with the broadest shoulders have barely been touched by this budget.
Open season on pensioners & businesses & family farms though
And as for immigration, Rwanda was an unpleasant policy to address a very difficult problem, and most people would not feel comfortable with it.
But what is Labours plan? "Smash the gangs" a lovely slogan.
+1000 came over on boats last week, in winter.
And they have refused to put any limit on immigration, they just said they will sort it
I am fine criticising some Tory policies which would not get my vote, but so far this almost impossible problem also has no solution from Labour, not even an embryo of a solution, just slogans.
posted 1 month, 1 day ago
Dev
What tax cuts he says
"Since 2010 successive cuts were made to the main rate of Corporation Tax reducing it from 28% in 2010 to 19% in April 2017. This has resulted in the UK having a Corporation Tax rate which is significantly lower than the rest of the G7 and the lowest in the G20."
What has CEO pay done in the same period?
Not to forget the Truss budget and Sunak trying to get reelected on the promise of?
"Open season on pensioners & businesses & family farms though"
You could call it that if you worked for a RW tabloid and your job is to gaslight Tory diehards
"But what is Labours plan? "Smash the gangs" a lovely slogan."
What's the problem with this Mr I voted more than once for 'take back control'/'stop the boats'/'get Brexit done'?
Don't get the pearl clutching here.
"And as for immigration, Rwanda was an unpleasant policy to address a very difficult problem, and most people would not feel comfortable with it."
Yet people still voted Tory despite them continuing with it, and wasting hundreds of millions in tax payer money in the process. You see why lectures on ficscal responsibility from Tory voters isn't being taken seriously?
We've had promises of growth and jam tomorrow from.business for a decade and a half. What would make a person sceptical that this latest promise will be upheld after past experiences? Trickle down economics has been proven to be a load of shiite because the wealth doesn't trickle down, its accumulated and hoarded at the top.
posted 1 month, 1 day ago
Corporation tax is used to raise revenues from profits of business but it is also used to incentivise business, give this country a competitive advantage and reduce the tax burden on businesses.
The drops we have seen have all been since the financial crisis, and then maintained through Covid, as a means to try and stimulate growth.
The Tories then raised in 2023, to 25%, as part of a suite of tax changes to pay for covid.
To view it as a sop to big business and lining the pockets of the wealthy is to completely misunderstand the purpose of adjusting it.
In fact, Tony Blair cut it from 33% to 30% over their time in power.
So, from your view this Tory present of low Corp Tax to their wealthy donators etc, what have Labour done?
Oh yeah, they promised before the election not to increase it if they get in power.
Gonna criticise that are you? Is Sir K in bed with all these wealthy business owners, making sure their profits stay fat?
Gonna criticise keeping the top rate of tax at 45%? More bending over for the wealthy from Sir K? I thought the broadest shoulders were taking the strain Nah, too busy sucking up to them and getting a few free suits.
posted 1 month, 1 day ago
As for voting, just because you vote for a party does not mean you agree with every policy. In the same way that not voting for a party is not a vote against all their policies.
You defend any Labour policy, regardless. Yet will attack any Tory policy, regardless. And then remain silent when Labour do nothing about it.
Pre-election promises of Corp Tax and personal taxation has meant that those with the broadest shoulders are not carrying the burden?
The reason Sir K hasnt touched Corporation tax is because part of their big plan is to get investment into this country, and that is an absolutely legit reason, and part of a tough balancing act to be made in terms of raising revenues and securing growth.
My issue as i have stated all along is that they have done nothing to help businesses in the short to medium term, and as all the observers are saying, we will see inflation, we will see job losses, we will see higher rates, which will continue the cost of living issues, and all this will result in less growth. Some of these figures are already coming to pass, and it will damage them.
Big investment and infrastructure projects in this country will boost us in the long term, but damage will be done, not least to their support, if business is neglected in the mean time.
posted 1 month, 1 day ago
Dev
"The drops we have seen have all been since the financial crisis, and then maintained through Covid, as a means to try and stimulate growth."
How did that work out? Honest answer only.
No answer to what CEO pay and shareholder dividends have done in the same period?
"The Tories then raised in 2023, to 25%, as part of a suite of tax changes to pay for covid."
No they mooted it them shelved it and kept it at 19%
How about an answer to what Rishi Sunak promised together reelected? You voted for it you must be able to explain it.
At least you've stopped using pensioners as a political football. In the time you've voted Tory, since 97 you said?, where was your concern for pensioners when public services were closing, utility prices rising and talk of them using 'warmbanks' to get by in winter?
Why should anyone take the word on the of the Tories, and Tory voters, seriously on the economy after the mess it's currently in.
We've seen you blame lack of growth under the Tories on anything and everything from Ukraine to Covid, conveniently omitting self inflicted things like Brexit and Liz Truss. Yet talk of growth, or lack of, from this Labour gov conveniently doesn't mention the above ongoing and still consequential world events, why not?
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Page 25 of 38
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posted on 19/11/24
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 22 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 8 minutes ago
On the matter of recycling.....I agree the producers need to take responsibility and the cost for this and where they do not they are being taxed more.
But what's happening to this money? Is it going to Local Council's to fulfil the waste and recycling operations. No! Council's are getting no extra money.
This is just another money raising exercise under the guise of being green.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Who spent 14 years stripping local councils of funding, to the point of bankruptcy for some?
But 4 months in to the new government and it's Labour's fault
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Never said that whatsoever
I actually agreed with you on the need to tax polluters and the Govt have upped this tax.
You the one that said that the burden to tidy up these polluters was on Councils....My point is that this raised tax isnt going towards that!
Surely anyone who actually cares should be asking "where is this polluters tax going if its not to the Councils who bare the cost of pollution?"
But again, my overall point - wage rises, NI rises, thresholds lowered + packaging tax rises. It's a quad whammy. All worthy but how does doing this in one bang help the economy? the economy which has to pay for everything we want to do as a country?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The point of the tax is to incentivise business to produce and use less plastic packaging and to recycle their own plastic waste not keep producing more. This will reduce the recycling costs on local councils.
As for employer NI. Business could measure the growth of not having 1/10th of the population/customer base/employee pool on an NHS waiting list or living in poverty (18%).
You didn't think there would be a reckoning after 14 years of public service cuts wealth inequality, Brexit and the impact of Liz Truss' short tenure?
Schools and public buildings need repairing, 7m NHS waiting list, backlogs in the justice system that undermine it, re funding local councils after years of cuts, over crowded prisons etc etc.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You are again missing the point.
Yes, a lot of damage needs making good.
But it is counter productive to layer taxes on businesses with the intention to fund public services if the result of that is to - drive up inflation, keep interest rates high, impact unemployment, impact businesses ability to give pay rises, impact growth.
I said at the start today that the Govt may find itself with all these negative impacts come the next budget .
The fundamental point is that the economy drives absolutely everything. If it is strong and incentivised it will create more opportunities, pay more, employ more, generate more tax revenue, reduce welfare spending.
It is remarkable how much an economy responds to sentiment. If there is uncertainty then it is a snowball effect that can often lead to low growth, low wage growth and rising unemployment.
It is a brief snapshot but the 0.1% growth of the last quarter has been significantly contributed to (according to most economic commentators) the negative messaging and uncertainty about what the budget will bring.
For many businesses, that uncertainty will not have been alleviated, in fact their worst fears may have come true. Therefore do not expect anything too different from the last quarter come the 2024 Q4 figures.
I want public services to be properly funded and all the shortfalls to be met but none of that is possible without a strong stable economy and that is certainly not what was presented at the last budget, unless you can tell me different (other than Hector's, lets wait and see mantra).
My fear that in going large on tax and spending and borrowing now, they hope that come 2029 it's all looking rosy. It's a gamble and their desire to make some public spending headlines comes at the cost of growth.
posted on 19/11/24
"Food bank reliance has soared
Crucially, while prices shot up, wages remained stagnant, leading to record numbers of people relying on food banks. The Trussell Trust, which is the UK’s largest food bank charity, has seen its business grow rapidly. From the number of food banks to the number of emergency parcels, they provide a sad record of the UK’s growing number of impoverished households.
Many of the people who visit food banks are in work, but their low wages cannot stretch to cover bills. Not only have consumer prices risen, but so have taxes, rent and mortgages."
"Inflation peaked in October 2022 at 11.1%. It has fallen ever since, with a few bumps in the road, helping Rishi Sunak meet his pledge to halve inflation during 2023.
Yet food prices remain 20% above the level seen in July 2021 and family budgets remain stretched."
"Council tax has been on a rollercoaster ride since 2010. First it was frozen, then from 2016 increased by 5% a year, before a social care surcharge in 2020 limited the increase to 3% (in total, bills still increased by 5%).
Across all taxes, the overall level is heading to its highest since the second world war under current government plans. Mortgage and rent bills have also soared. The latest official figures show that rent inflation is at a record level, while those who need to remortgage can face a doubling or trebling of their monthly interest payments.
Figures from the homelessness charity Crisis show that the number of people sleeping rough is now 61% higher than it was 10 years ago and 120% higher than when data collection began in 2010."
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/jun/20/the-economy-how-14-years-of-tory-rule-have-changed-britain-in-charts
Customers and employees have been squeezed for years under the last lot, by business passing on the costs of various global events, by wages not rising in line with the cost of living and increased taxes.
What did business profits, shareholder dividends and executive pay do over the same period?
Retailers can threaten all they like. The threat of not opening yet another mini supermarket or out of town outlet store on the back of under paid staff who can't afford their bills isn't going to contribute to the economy, just profits and tax avoidance (in the case of one signatory). The threat of online shopping isn't the fault of the government either and employers like supermarkets, amongst others, employ less people on the back of online shopping.
posted on 20/11/24
Growth at 0.1% for the Quarter.
Now inflation jumped to 2.3% its highest level since April.
"The latest inflation figure comes after the government revealed that an additional 50,000 pensioners will be living in relative poverty next year as a result of cuts to the winter fuel allowance." (BBC)
posted on 20/11/24
Every country globally is struggling though right?
posted on 20/11/24
comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 1 hour, 46 minutes ago
Every country globally is struggling though right?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
But the UK had the fastest rate of growth in the G7 for the first 6 months of this year, now we have the second worst!
What’s your thoughts on that?
posted on 20/11/24
comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 2 hours ago
Every country globally is struggling though right?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Well indeed, we havent seen the levels of growth of the 00s when global economy was booming (2-5% UK GDP growth).
Since the financial crisis its been typically 1-2%.
The global position is still difficult but improving with forecast for about 2.7% growth for 2024. The UK was well on target to meet that with 0.6 and 0.7% in the first 2 quarters. It's now stalled at 0.1& for Q3.
Within an improving global context, we should also be growing even if that will still represent modest growth in a historical context.
posted on 20/11/24
Pick the odd one out:
Tough decisions =
1. putting pensioners into poverty and the chiller.
2. Taxing businesses to discourage them from employing more staff, offering existing staff better wages, or making other investments in their business.
3. Paying train drivers exactly what they demand, with no strings attached, strings that would have seen them modernise and move towards a more efficient modern system that would ultimately cost the public purse less over time.
posted on 20/11/24
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 9 minutes ago
Pick the odd one out:
Tough decisions =
1. putting pensioners into poverty and the chiller.
2. Taxing businesses to discourage them from employing more staff, offering existing staff better wages, or making other investments in their business.
3. Paying train drivers exactly what they demand, with no strings attached, strings that would have seen them modernise and move towards a more efficient modern system that would ultimately cost the public purse less over time.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Labour committed in their manifesto to end the use of migrant hotels and now they are opening 14 more and yet they’ll let pensioners freeze! More pre election lies!
posted on 20/11/24
comment by RED666…Always Right! 🇬🇧 (U6562)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 9 minutes ago
Pick the odd one out:
Tough decisions =
1. putting pensioners into poverty and the chiller.
2. Taxing businesses to discourage them from employing more staff, offering existing staff better wages, or making other investments in their business.
3. Paying train drivers exactly what they demand, with no strings attached, strings that would have seen them modernise and move towards a more efficient modern system that would ultimately cost the public purse less over time.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Labour committed in their manifesto to end the use of migrant hotels and now they are opening 14 more and yet they’ll let pensioners freeze! More pre election lies!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Their own analysis of Tory proposals of means testing the WFP a couple years ago concluded that 3000-4000 pensions would die as a result.
Sir K forgot to mention that when announcing the policy.
Again, another example of decisions made in the treasury, without really looking beyond what money it can raise/save.
posted on 20/11/24
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 1 hour ago
Pick the odd one out:
Tough decisions =
1. putting pensioners into poverty and the chiller.
2. Taxing businesses to discourage them from employing more staff, offering existing staff better wages, or making other investments in their business.
3. Paying train drivers exactly what they demand, with no strings attached, strings that would have seen them modernise and move towards a more efficient modern system that would ultimately cost the public purse less over time.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Lesson learned, Join a Union.
Pension Credit
Universal Credit
income-related Employment and Support Allowance (ESA)
income-based Jobseeker’s Allowance (JSA)
Income Support
Child Tax Credit
Working Tax Credit
All entitled to a WFP, then poorest in society.
The business thing is just hot air and bluster, if your business cannot handle modest staff cost increases then its not a viable going concern, thems juat the blunt facts.
posted on 20/11/24
comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 1 hour ago
Pick the odd one out:
Tough decisions =
1. putting pensioners into poverty and the chiller.
2. Taxing businesses to discourage them from employing more staff, offering existing staff better wages, or making other investments in their business.
3. Paying train drivers exactly what they demand, with no strings attached, strings that would have seen them modernise and move towards a more efficient modern system that would ultimately cost the public purse less over time.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Lesson learned, Join a Union.
Pension Credit
Universal Credit
income-related Employment and Support Allowance (ESA)
income-based Jobseeker’s Allowance (JSA)
Income Support
Child Tax Credit
Working Tax Credit
All entitled to a WFP, then poorest in society.
The business thing is just hot air and bluster, if your business cannot handle modest staff cost increases then its not a viable going concern, thems juat the blunt facts.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That is the lesson to learn if all you are interested in is "getting what you want/think you deserve"
If you want a healthy economy with a diverse range of businesses, want to encourage entrepreneurism, want to ensure new businesses can develop and grow and become larger more successful businesses, if you want to do all these things which will create an economy that will pay for all those benefits that will help the lowest paid and poorest then the businesses community needs supporting.
If you want the world run by amazon, tescos and a few other mega companies dominating everything then yeah, lets unionise the world and create a businesses environment where only the very successful stand a chance.
SMEs contribute around half of the turnover in the UK private sector, est. £2.4 trillion.
SMEs employ 16.7 million people, which is 61% of the total employment in the UK.
But hey, their concerns are hot air and bluster. Feck em, right, if they cannot be a success who needs them.
And as for anyone looking to start a business, perhaps grow, employ a few more people. Bugggger them too, dont bother unless you're gonna be anything less than financial success from the word go.
Lets just all rely on the amazons of this world. They're succesful, they can absorb additional costs. They pay loads of tax, oh wait.
"Modest staff cost increases" that will raise £25bn. Define modest
posted on 20/11/24
While we're at it, lets close all the pubs. Most operate on the margins, make on average 12p profit per pint, cannot afford to pay their staff that well. Feck 'em. Who needs pubs right? if they cannot keep it viable and pay staff generously, then don't try and support them, 10 close every week anyway, let them die
posted on 20/11/24
Hold on.let me get my tiny violin.
"But hey, their concerns are hot air and bluster. Feck em, right, if they cannot be a success who needs them."
You wanna preach capitalism, Market forces my good
man.
Biatching about a relatively small increase in overheads after the unprecedented support SMEs have had over
the last few years is laughable,. Nobody is denying the importance both economically and socially of small businesses but they are not sacrosanct and untouchable ffs!
posted on 20/11/24
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 16 minutes ago
While we're at it, lets close all the pubs. Most operate on the margins, make on average 12p profit per pint, cannot afford to pay their staff that well. Feck 'em. Who needs pubs right? if they cannot keep it viable and pay staff generously, then don't try and support them, 10 close every week anyway, let them die
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If your business model includes paying your staff the legal minimum that isn't livable on then yeah fack em. What good is a business who's staff rely on govt help or foodbanks to get by week on week?
posted on 20/11/24
comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 10 minutes ago
Hold on.let me get my tiny violin.
"But hey, their concerns are hot air and bluster. Feck em, right, if they cannot be a success who needs them."
You wanna preach capitalism, Market forces my good
man.
Biatching about a relatively small increase in overheads after the unprecedented support SMEs have had over
the last few years is laughable,. Nobody is denying the importance both economically and socially of small businesses but they are not sacrosanct and untouchable ffs!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Again, £25bn raised does not represent a small cost on businesses.
No one is sacrosanct but if you are preaching about bringing back stability and growth, this action does not achieve that.
What you are saying is that, if businesses cannot run themselves well enough to absorb these costs then so be it, good buy!
And what will be the out come of this. Unemployment ✅ increased welfare costs ✅less/no growth✅increased poverty✅
Not increasing taxes is not supporting a sector, it's to maintain the status quo.
Lowering their taxes is to support a sector.
Increasing their taxes is to attack the sector.
Labour are harming the sector and while I appreciate that there is a need to increase funding for public services, to do this through taxing all businesses is completely contradictory to their manifesto promises to bring stability and growth to the economy, and will also undermine their ongoing plans if the growth is lower than projected.
These actions will increase costs, so will increase prices and inflation and the knock on from this will be felt by Labour's "working people" through their cost of living.
posted on 20/11/24
BTW the tax rises seen, mainly through NI, are the biggest in a generation (since 1993). You can call them 'small increases' but that is to brush over the facts!
posted on 20/11/24
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
BTW the tax rises seen, mainly through NI, are the biggest in a generation (since 1993). You can call them 'small increases' but that is to brush over the facts!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The geveral tax payer has seen the highest taxes since WW2 implemented by the last Tory gov. In work benefits have risen and so have working people using food banks and classed as being in in work poverty.
We've seen over the last 14 years tax cuts only serve to enrich CEO's and shareholders and those intent on avoiding paying their fair share.
posted on 20/11/24
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 23 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
BTW the tax rises seen, mainly through NI, are the biggest in a generation (since 1993). You can call them 'small increases' but that is to brush over the facts!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The geveral tax payer has seen the highest taxes since WW2 implemented by the last Tory gov. In work benefits have risen and so have working people using food banks and classed as being in in work poverty.
We've seen over the last 14 years tax cuts only serve to enrich CEO's and shareholders and those intent on avoiding paying their fair share.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Right, so what have the Govt done to target these CEOs and shareholders, and those avoiding paying their tax?
Oh, that's right, nothing! They hit pensioners, they've hit all businesses indiscriminately in an area that effects cost and growth.
posted on 21/11/24
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 6 hours, 18 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 23 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
BTW the tax rises seen, mainly through NI, are the biggest in a generation (since 1993). You can call them 'small increases' but that is to brush over the facts!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The geveral tax payer has seen the highest taxes since WW2 implemented by the last Tory gov. In work benefits have risen and so have working people using food banks and classed as being in in work poverty.
We've seen over the last 14 years tax cuts only serve to enrich CEO's and shareholders and those intent on avoiding paying their fair share.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Right, so what have the Govt done to target these CEOs and shareholders, and those avoiding paying their tax?
Oh, that's right, nothing! They hit pensioners, they've hit all businesses indiscriminately in an area that effects cost and growth.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly!
Daniel Hobbs, managing director at New Leaf Distribution a guy who’s in a better position than Hector and FannyAnnie has said “It feels like the whole economy has deteriorated since the budget."
However Hector and FannyAnnie won’t admit it!
posted on 21/11/24
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 13 hours, 39 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 23 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
BTW the tax rises seen, mainly through NI, are the biggest in a generation (since 1993). You can call them 'small increases' but that is to brush over the facts!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The geveral tax payer has seen the highest taxes since WW2 implemented by the last Tory gov. In work benefits have risen and so have working people using food banks and classed as being in in work poverty.
We've seen over the last 14 years tax cuts only serve to enrich CEO's and shareholders and those intent on avoiding paying their fair share.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Right, so what have the Govt done to target these CEOs and shareholders, and those avoiding paying their tax?
Oh, that's right, nothing! They hit pensioners, they've hit all businesses indiscriminately in an area that effects cost and growth.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sorry you expect them to have fixed 14 years of the Tories letting CEO's and shareholders off and giving them tax breaks in 4 months
If yourself and Red had got your way in the election we would've got through 2 Education Secretaries and had a reshuffle by now.
I don't think 2 people, yourself and Red, who voted for more wasted money on things like Rwanda are in a position to bleat about this government, fiscal responsibility or budgets.
posted 1 month, 1 day ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 3 hours, 27 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 13 hours, 39 minutes ago
comment by FieldsofAnfieldRd (U18971)
posted 23 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 5 minutes ago
BTW the tax rises seen, mainly through NI, are the biggest in a generation (since 1993). You can call them 'small increases' but that is to brush over the facts!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The geveral tax payer has seen the highest taxes since WW2 implemented by the last Tory gov. In work benefits have risen and so have working people using food banks and classed as being in in work poverty.
We've seen over the last 14 years tax cuts only serve to enrich CEO's and shareholders and those intent on avoiding paying their fair share.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Right, so what have the Govt done to target these CEOs and shareholders, and those avoiding paying their tax?
Oh, that's right, nothing! They hit pensioners, they've hit all businesses indiscriminately in an area that effects cost and growth.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sorry you expect them to have fixed 14 years of the Tories letting CEO's and shareholders off and giving them tax breaks in 4 months
If yourself and Red had got your way in the election we would've got through 2 Education Secretaries and had a reshuffle by now.
I don't think 2 people, yourself and Red, who voted for more wasted money on things like Rwanda are in a position to bleat about this government, fiscal responsibility or budgets.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"We've seen over the last 14 years tax cuts only serve to enrich CEO's and shareholders and those intent on avoiding paying their fair share."
So these tax cuts, what are they?.....Whatever they are, reverse them, right. Surely that's easy.
Oh, but then they made a promise about not affecting personal taxes so even if they wanted a 50p rate or a 55p rate on the wealthy, they couldnt, because of the stupid feckin red line they drew to get over the election line.
Those with the broadest shoulders have barely been touched by this budget.
Open season on pensioners & businesses & family farms though
And as for immigration, Rwanda was an unpleasant policy to address a very difficult problem, and most people would not feel comfortable with it.
But what is Labours plan? "Smash the gangs" a lovely slogan.
+1000 came over on boats last week, in winter.
And they have refused to put any limit on immigration, they just said they will sort it
I am fine criticising some Tory policies which would not get my vote, but so far this almost impossible problem also has no solution from Labour, not even an embryo of a solution, just slogans.
posted 1 month, 1 day ago
Dev
What tax cuts he says
"Since 2010 successive cuts were made to the main rate of Corporation Tax reducing it from 28% in 2010 to 19% in April 2017. This has resulted in the UK having a Corporation Tax rate which is significantly lower than the rest of the G7 and the lowest in the G20."
What has CEO pay done in the same period?
Not to forget the Truss budget and Sunak trying to get reelected on the promise of?
"Open season on pensioners & businesses & family farms though"
You could call it that if you worked for a RW tabloid and your job is to gaslight Tory diehards
"But what is Labours plan? "Smash the gangs" a lovely slogan."
What's the problem with this Mr I voted more than once for 'take back control'/'stop the boats'/'get Brexit done'?
Don't get the pearl clutching here.
"And as for immigration, Rwanda was an unpleasant policy to address a very difficult problem, and most people would not feel comfortable with it."
Yet people still voted Tory despite them continuing with it, and wasting hundreds of millions in tax payer money in the process. You see why lectures on ficscal responsibility from Tory voters isn't being taken seriously?
We've had promises of growth and jam tomorrow from.business for a decade and a half. What would make a person sceptical that this latest promise will be upheld after past experiences? Trickle down economics has been proven to be a load of shiite because the wealth doesn't trickle down, its accumulated and hoarded at the top.
posted 1 month, 1 day ago
Corporation tax is used to raise revenues from profits of business but it is also used to incentivise business, give this country a competitive advantage and reduce the tax burden on businesses.
The drops we have seen have all been since the financial crisis, and then maintained through Covid, as a means to try and stimulate growth.
The Tories then raised in 2023, to 25%, as part of a suite of tax changes to pay for covid.
To view it as a sop to big business and lining the pockets of the wealthy is to completely misunderstand the purpose of adjusting it.
In fact, Tony Blair cut it from 33% to 30% over their time in power.
So, from your view this Tory present of low Corp Tax to their wealthy donators etc, what have Labour done?
Oh yeah, they promised before the election not to increase it if they get in power.
Gonna criticise that are you? Is Sir K in bed with all these wealthy business owners, making sure their profits stay fat?
Gonna criticise keeping the top rate of tax at 45%? More bending over for the wealthy from Sir K? I thought the broadest shoulders were taking the strain Nah, too busy sucking up to them and getting a few free suits.
posted 1 month, 1 day ago
As for voting, just because you vote for a party does not mean you agree with every policy. In the same way that not voting for a party is not a vote against all their policies.
You defend any Labour policy, regardless. Yet will attack any Tory policy, regardless. And then remain silent when Labour do nothing about it.
Pre-election promises of Corp Tax and personal taxation has meant that those with the broadest shoulders are not carrying the burden?
The reason Sir K hasnt touched Corporation tax is because part of their big plan is to get investment into this country, and that is an absolutely legit reason, and part of a tough balancing act to be made in terms of raising revenues and securing growth.
My issue as i have stated all along is that they have done nothing to help businesses in the short to medium term, and as all the observers are saying, we will see inflation, we will see job losses, we will see higher rates, which will continue the cost of living issues, and all this will result in less growth. Some of these figures are already coming to pass, and it will damage them.
Big investment and infrastructure projects in this country will boost us in the long term, but damage will be done, not least to their support, if business is neglected in the mean time.
posted 1 month, 1 day ago
Dev
"The drops we have seen have all been since the financial crisis, and then maintained through Covid, as a means to try and stimulate growth."
How did that work out? Honest answer only.
No answer to what CEO pay and shareholder dividends have done in the same period?
"The Tories then raised in 2023, to 25%, as part of a suite of tax changes to pay for covid."
No they mooted it them shelved it and kept it at 19%
How about an answer to what Rishi Sunak promised together reelected? You voted for it you must be able to explain it.
At least you've stopped using pensioners as a political football. In the time you've voted Tory, since 97 you said?, where was your concern for pensioners when public services were closing, utility prices rising and talk of them using 'warmbanks' to get by in winter?
Why should anyone take the word on the of the Tories, and Tory voters, seriously on the economy after the mess it's currently in.
We've seen you blame lack of growth under the Tories on anything and everything from Ukraine to Covid, conveniently omitting self inflicted things like Brexit and Liz Truss. Yet talk of growth, or lack of, from this Labour gov conveniently doesn't mention the above ongoing and still consequential world events, why not?
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