comment by thebluebellsareblue (U9292)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Coutinho's Happy Feet (U18971)
posted 3 minutes ago
"Weare states that the leave side won, and some of you lovely leftists cannot accept democratic decisions, if the working class step away from your world view"

Surely the definition of democracy is the ability to express an opinion without censure. For example those who voted remain do not agree with the result, or reasons for leaving the EU. In a democracy we are able to voice our opposition to the result.

Your suggestion that we should accept the result is in fact anti democratic.

*When I say do not agree with the vote I am in no way suggesting it should be overturned.
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If 71per cent vote and a majority decide to leave the Eu, or elect Corbyn, or Thatcher, you really do had to accept that.
I had to accept Provo prisoner release and sinn vein n govt, and it turns my stomach.
Out with taking up arms, you and I have to accept democracy is not always n our favour.
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Thebells

The point I am making is that the constant calls to pipe down is in itself anti democratic. We don't live in a democracy that states criticism isn't allowed. Using the example you gave yes you may have accepted Good Friday etc, but I bet you were vociferous in your opposition to it.

Again democracy may not be in our favour, for example I didn't vote for this government. But that does not mean they are immune from criticism or my voice is not valid.

comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 59 seconds ago
Can't remember Ulster ever being peaceful, Im working class, I don't want the UK to fail, I fully accept democratic decisions, article 50 hasnt yet been triggered so nothing has changed yet and ISIS are already in the UK.

Stay pragmatic Rudyard.





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Ulster has been peaceful, and is again.

Well done on the working class front😎

Perhaps not every line of each of my posts is not about you, if I say some want the brexit UK to fail, for example.

Cameron and Blair said there would be war here and in Ulster, No....missed that
Cameron said Isis would use brexit......really.Unlike Germany letting in one million males, as a counter pro- Eu tactic?
If article 50 is important, why is it sitting at fifty n the chart?

If you or remainers know our economics future, yer wasted here.

comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 7 minutes ago
Britain has always rejected the federalist European super state, nothing new there.
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See sizzles loon rant.......I am aiming at him, mostly.

He is agentbrexit.

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

Cameron and Blair said there would be war here and in Ulster, No....missed that
.................

Yup, I missed that.

I don't know our economic future, you seem convinced its cushty though, Donald Trump told you.

You can't use the working class as a bloc to back up your Leave argument when its patently untrue

comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 8 minutes ago
Britain has always rejected the federalist European super state, nothing new there.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes, now we have stopped that for good.....so, slight difference now.
Taking control entails self- determination.

Now, I hope the UK a d Eire can move closer, and this is a brexit positive, IMO.

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 1 minute ago
Is this thread 'live'? If not it blaady should be.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
it should be.

Admins

'Stopped it for good'...it was never on the cards in the first place! We never joined the euro and we have and we used the veto for the things we didnt want to be part of.

comment by Coutinho's Happy Feet (U18971)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by thebluebellsareblue (U9292)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Coutinho's Happy Feet (U18971)
posted 3 minutes ago
"Weare states that the leave side won, and some of you lovely leftists cannot accept democratic decisions, if the working class step away from your world view"

Surely the definition of democracy is the ability to express an opinion without censure. For example those who voted remain do not agree with the result, or reasons for leaving the EU. In a democracy we are able to voice our opposition to the result.

Your suggestion that we should accept the result is in fact anti democratic.

*When I say do not agree with the vote I am in no way suggesting it should be overturned.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If 71per cent vote and a majority decide to leave the Eu, or elect Corbyn, or Thatcher, you really do had to accept that.
I had to accept Provo prisoner release and sinn vein n govt, and it turns my stomach.
Out with taking up arms, you and I have to accept democracy is not always n our favour.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Thebells

The point I am making is that the constant calls to pipe down is in itself anti democratic. We don't live in a democracy that states criticism isn't allowed. Using the example you gave yes you may have accepted Good Friday etc, but I bet you were vociferous in your opposition to it.

Again democracy may not be in our favour, for example I didn't vote for this government. But that does not mean they are immune from criticism or my voice is not valid.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sorry bud, I was not saying shut up, do what brexit say, and I fear the hand of sizzle in these debates leads to division and bad feeling.

Both sides shouting at each other is futile, as we all live here, and do not know what the future holds.
When I come on here, I often find several loud anti- leave voices, so I steam in like a Hoolie🙅

Throwing insults is silly, and sorry if I have done so to you remainers, but sizzle started it, and he copied my homework, Sir.
Seriously, good debating with you guys, and fire away, as I am like the polls...often wrong.

often wrong.
..............

Yup, you said it.

comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 8 minutes ago
Cameron and Blair said there would be war here and in Ulster, No....missed that
.................

Yup, I missed that.

I don't know our economic future, you seem convinced its cushty though, Donald Trump told you.

You can't use the working class as a bloc to back up your Leave argument when its patently untrue


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Just saying, like Trump, brexit may get Hong done...my humble racist facist thick bigot opinion.

Do we agree Cameron and WMD Blair lied about brexit leading to sectarian and Isis war in the UK?

I refer to the working class as they voted brexit, often find n labour areas, and this block reject corbyn politics, in the main.
I do not use the working class to do anything, as that would be surreal, but they put Hilary and Brussels in their box, so hey ho.

comment by Just Shoot (U10408)
posted 12 minutes ago
Is this thread 'live'? If not it blaady should be.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Make it the Chelsea beating spurs thread.

Ktbffh

Thebells (I always think Quasimodo when I type that)

Fair play to you. Yeah I'll admit the debate about this can be muted by certain people on both sides.

I think debate is the only way the country, divided by a small margin, is going to work its way through this. One thing we should count our lucky stars for is that we live in a country where we can voice opposing viewpoints without serious consequence.

I want to be clear that although I am adamant leaving the EU is the wrong decision I am willing to apply critical thinking and listen to opinions I may not agree with . Oh and I'm sure I've got plenty wrong and am in no way an authority on the subject.

Always find it amusing that people actually believe the UK will "take back control". Of what exactly, and it's a complete euromyth that we didn't have regulatory control in the first place.

The UK can either abandon attempts to negotiate FTAs, or have a radical immigration policy. Thus crippling the economy.

Those who believe otherwise are delusional. Some of which are unfortunately in government.

You speak in absolutes, like every working class person voted leave and its not true, Scotland, Northern Ireland, Manchester, Liverpool, London didnt.

If those 2 discredited politicians said what you claim they said, I didn't see it.

comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 9 minutes ago
'Stopped it for good'...it was never on the cards in the first place! We never joined the euro and we have and we used the veto for the things we didnt want to be part of.
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Never joined euro and veto for what we didn't want from Brussels.......do you agree with this eurosceptic stance?
I thought the EU was perfect, but alas no, we always stood outside, and now, the divorce is for good.
F course, we work with our European neighbours for the common good, and forge new links, so all cushty, I hope.
I really do not know, or say brexit is perfect.

Je suis fallable.

comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 9 minutes ago
often wrong.
..............

Yup, you said it.


----------------------------------------------------------------------
Cannae say otherwise🙆

comment by Coutinho's Happy Feet (U18971)
posted 2 minutes ago
Thebells (I always think Quasimodo when I type that)

Fair play to you. Yeah I'll admit the debate about this can be muted by certain people on both sides.

I think debate is the only way the country, divided by a small margin, is going to work its way through this. One thing we should count our lucky stars for is that we live in a country where we can voice opposing viewpoints without serious consequence.

I want to be clear that although I am adamant leaving the EU is the wrong decision I am willing to apply critical thinking and listen to opinions I may not agree with. Oh and I'm sure I've got plenty wrong and am in no way an authority on the subject.
---------------------------------------------------------------------Cheers, and we are in this together.

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

comment by Hector (U3606)
posted 3 minutes ago
You speak in absolutes, like every working class person voted leave and its not true, Scotland, Northern Ireland, Manchester, Liverpool, London didnt.

If those 2 discredited politicians said what you claim they said, I didn't see it.
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Of course not all working class voters opted for leave....I never said it was solid, all over.More voted leave in Scotland than SNP, BTW, and I was surprised forty five percent in Ulster voted leave.
Outside London and scouse land, there was a solid leave vote in England and Wales...poorest parts of Manchester voted leave strongly too.
I repeat the term working class as many here claim to be socialist, but the workers vote differently, in the UK and USA.Then, workers become thick and racist.

Nowt wrong with middle class either, but as i am talking to Labour folk n here, it is relevant to point out the irony

Somewhat ironic that the poorest parts of the country will be those who feel the impacts of brexit the most.

I firmly believe if the general public were more aware of the UK's reliance on the EU, their wouldn't even have been a referendum.

But, we are we are. It's up to our inept politicians to get some kind of resolution.

Given the diversity of UK industry and the devolved governments, whatever is eventually agreed it will not cater for the whole of the UK. With Northern Ireland facing dire economic consequences.

More voted leave in Scotland than SNP,
............

Don't know if that's true or not but its not relevant. Scotland voted unanimously to Remain, it has always had strong European links going back centuries.

The Leave victory was just under 4% the way some brexitears go on its like they had a landslide and want a hard Brexit and Fk the rest of the country, regardless of class.

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

TBH I am not that interested in the complaints of people in N. Ireland or Scotland regarding us leaving the EU (that is to say from the angle of we didn't vote for it) if they really wanted it both areas could have really made a difference by returning very strong remain votes.

England has a huge population but the vote was close enough that other areas could have made the difference.