comment by Mael - NOT Wahl (U22417)
furrrking thick
----------------------------------------------------------------------
ha ha, definitely not wahl.
but you're right, 99% of the achievement of winning the CWC is winning the CL, after that it's just a glorified friendly halfway round the world against substandard opponents.
comment by Mael - NOT Wahl (U22417)
posted 1 minute ago
Since it seems people are missing the point, let me ask this question:
If you could win either
(A) CL and league cup
(B) CL and club World Cup
Which would you choose out of (A) or (B)?
I don’t understand why people are so furrrking thick and keep including the separate achievement of winning the CL into the case for winning the CWC when my question is literally about the two competitions of the league cup and club World Cup taken in ISOLATION, but I dunno, I guess some people have low iqs and can’t understand a simple question.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'd choose A. However I still think the Club World Cup is the most prestigious out of the two and the clubs would choose the CWC also, considering this and the huge difference in prize money.
comment by Don Draper's dandruff (U20155)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Mael - NOT Wahl (U22417)
furrrking thick
----------------------------------------------------------------------
ha ha, definitely not wahl.
but you're right, 99% of the achievement of winning the CWC is winning the CL, after that it's just a glorified friendly halfway round the world against substandard opponents.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Its also possible to win the league cup by being drawn solely against lower league teams.
comment by welshpoolfan (U7693)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Don Draper's dandruff (U20155)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Mael - NOT Wahl (U22417)
furrrking thick
----------------------------------------------------------------------
ha ha, definitely not wahl.
but you're right, 99% of the achievement of winning the CWC is winning the CL, after that it's just a glorified friendly halfway round the world against substandard opponents.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Its also possible to win the league cup by being drawn solely against lower league teams.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah but then you have to be consistent enough to beat like 6 pub teams, rather than just 2
comment by TBaggerin (U11806)
posted 23 minutes ago
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 1 minute ago
“ Interesting discussion though!”
Not really interesting though, is it?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think it is!
I had to have a good think about it before I came to a decision in my own mind on this one.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Thinking before posting? Not the JA way
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Noted!
comment by welshpoolfan (U7693)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Its also possible to win the league cup by being drawn solely against lower league teams.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
yes, that's the element of luck in any draw. but in the CWC you are 100% guaranteed to win it if you beat 2 (used to be 1) mediocre teams. flamengo would be lucky to avoid relegation from the PL.
and i'd love to know the last team to win the league cup "by being drawn solely against lower league teams."
Definitely the club World cup, although it's not exactly taken off it does make sense. It's a bit hampered because of the gulf in quality between European football and other continents is so vast and therefore it tends to go without saying that a full strength and focused European champion team would walk it.
What's the point of the league cup though? It's great for giving young players a run around but above that what's the point when you have the FA Cup?
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 2 hours, 6 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 11 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 14 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 2 minutes ago
I think Jose will take the League Cup seriously. That's something I do like about him. He'll always try to win silverware. Hell he even claimed the Community Shield as part of a 'treble'.
As for the Club World Cup it's nice to win and it may get more prestigious in future. It only confirms you as best in the world though if you win your league and the Champions League the previous season. Then you can truly say you're the best in your country, continent and planet. 👍
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's like saying winning the World Cup only confirms you as the best in the world of you win your previous Nations League and continental championship, ie EURO's.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Two completely different ways of qualifying for those respective competitions. Also, only European teams (and Israel) can win the Euros...
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Only English teams can win the PL. Only European teams can win the CL. Not sure what your point is.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sorry. Been out for a walk. I misread what you wrote re Euros but the point I was making that the Euros (or any continental Competition) has a different qualifying mechanism so is truly stand alone. In club football though you only qualify for the continental tournaments through domestic competition. They also happen every year rather than every four. So, to conclude, my first remark on this matter was correct!
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
When I was 10 and Liverpool had never won the League Cup I was made up when we won 4 in a row. Another 4 wins later several of which I have witnessed in person I’m a bit ‘Meh!’ The final straw was the EFL forcing Liverpool’s hand this season when we had two games in 24 hours. Watching us win a new trophy against one of the worlds most famous teams made me feel like I was 10 again.
comment by Mael - NOT Wahl (U22417)
posted 58 minutes ago
Since it seems people are missing the point, let me ask this question:
If you could win either
(A) CL and league cup
(B) CL and club World Cup
Which would you choose out of (A) or (B)?
I don’t understand why people are so furrrking thick and keep including the separate achievement of winning the CL into the case for winning the CWC when my question is literally about the two competitions of the league cup and club World Cup taken in ISOLATION, but I dunno, I guess some people have low iqs and can’t understand a simple question.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
your original question was which is more prestigious.
answer= cwc
this question= A but that means losing to some cheating south american team in the final.
so i'll take C and win the CL, CWC and the league cup.
As a United fan I can pretty much remember most things we’ve won since the turn of the century, who we played in the latter stages, who scored etc.
When we won the World club championship ship in 2009, I could not tell who we played or who scored.
Champions of the world is a nice title but in reality it’s a nothing trophy and ever entrant outside of the European entry is barely PL quality, most not even that.
*championship, the 2nd ship just sailed in out of nowhere
It doesn’t seem so long ago that Man U fans were telling us the League Cup was a Mickey Mouse trophy
comment by Ringo Fire (U4165)
posted 3 minutes ago
It doesn’t seem so long ago that Man U fans were telling us the League Cup was a Mickey Mouse trophy
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s Mickey Mouse compared to the PL and CL but still really enjoyable to win.
The thing with the World Club Championship is that to be in it you have to be European champions (normally). So to get there is an achievement. To win it is nice, but not a big deal. You've already proved yourself to be the best in Europe by winning the CL anyway.
The World Club Championship is just filler, like an add on in a computer game, with the main purpose being financial. That's the reason it will get compared to the Super Cup and Community Shield. As the actual achievement is winning something to be there in the first place
*and being the best in Europe already means you're best in the world. There's a reason the South American teams take the World Club Championship far, far more seriously than the Europeans do
comment by merrysupersteve (U1132)
posted 43 minutes ago
The thing with the World Club Championship is that to be in it you have to be European champions (normally). So to get there is an achievement. To win it is nice, but not a big deal. You've already proved yourself to be the best in Europe by winning the CL anyway.
The World Club Championship is just filler, like an add on in a computer game, with the main purpose being financial. That's the reason it will get compared to the Super Cup and Community Shield. As the actual achievement is winning something to be there in the first place
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It doesn't compare to the Super Cup or Community Shield. In both those examples the club's could've already met that season, established a champion and those really are nothing more than a little charity match. Unless there's a scenario where a club can qualify for the EL but not the CL?
The club World cup while easily forgettable brings together winners from each contintenal competition that otherwise couldn't meet.
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by merrysupersteve (U1132)
posted 43 minutes ago
The thing with the World Club Championship is that to be in it you have to be European champions (normally). So to get there is an achievement. To win it is nice, but not a big deal. You've already proved yourself to be the best in Europe by winning the CL anyway.
The World Club Championship is just filler, like an add on in a computer game, with the main purpose being financial. That's the reason it will get compared to the Super Cup and Community Shield. As the actual achievement is winning something to be there in the first place
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It doesn't compare to the Super Cup or Community Shield. In both those examples the club's could've already met that season, established a champion and those really are nothing more than a little charity match. Unless there's a scenario where a club can qualify for the EL but not the CL?
The club World cup while easily forgettable brings together winners from each contintenal competition that otherwise couldn't meet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And ones where the financial disparity is such, that meeting Middlesbrough in the league cup is a more level playing field. It's pointless as you've qualified for it by beating teams far better than you could possibly face and it's nothing more than an add on
comment by merrysupersteve (U1132)
posted 2 hours, 59 minutes ago
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by merrysupersteve (U1132)
posted 43 minutes ago
The thing with the World Club Championship is that to be in it you have to be European champions (normally). So to get there is an achievement. To win it is nice, but not a big deal. You've already proved yourself to be the best in Europe by winning the CL anyway.
The World Club Championship is just filler, like an add on in a computer game, with the main purpose being financial. That's the reason it will get compared to the Super Cup and Community Shield. As the actual achievement is winning something to be there in the first place
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It doesn't compare to the Super Cup or Community Shield. In both those examples the club's could've already met that season, established a champion and those really are nothing more than a little charity match. Unless there's a scenario where a club can qualify for the EL but not the CL?
The club World cup while easily forgettable brings together winners from each contintenal competition that otherwise couldn't meet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And ones where the financial disparity is such, that meeting Middlesbrough in the league cup is a more level playing field. It's pointless as you've qualified for it by beating teams far better than you could possibly face and it's nothing more than an add on
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You could argue that any league or cup isn't a fair playing field though. What's the point of having any competition in that case?
I’d opt to win the club World Cup every time..
As it means you’ve won two trophies to actually get there.
League cup anyone in the whole league can enter by default.
As it means you’ve won two trophies to actually get there.
-----------
Completely irrelevant to the question.
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 9 hours, 13 minutes ago
comment by merrysupersteve (U1132)
posted 2 hours, 59 minutes ago
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by merrysupersteve (U1132)
posted 43 minutes ago
The thing with the World Club Championship is that to be in it you have to be European champions (normally). So to get there is an achievement. To win it is nice, but not a big deal. You've already proved yourself to be the best in Europe by winning the CL anyway.
The World Club Championship is just filler, like an add on in a computer game, with the main purpose being financial. That's the reason it will get compared to the Super Cup and Community Shield. As the actual achievement is winning something to be there in the first place
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It doesn't compare to the Super Cup or Community Shield. In both those examples the club's could've already met that season, established a champion and those really are nothing more than a little charity match. Unless there's a scenario where a club can qualify for the EL but not the CL?
The club World cup while easily forgettable brings together winners from each contintenal competition that otherwise couldn't meet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And ones where the financial disparity is such, that meeting Middlesbrough in the league cup is a more level playing field. It's pointless as you've qualified for it by beating teams far better than you could possibly face and it's nothing more than an add on
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You could argue that any league or cup isn't a fair playing field though. What's the point of having any competition in that case?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think you're well aware that most competitions don't have the financial and talent disparity that is displayed in the World Club money-spinner
comment by Mael - NOT Wahl (U22417)
posted 2 hours, 10 minutes ago
As it means you’ve won two trophies to actually get there.
-----------
Completely irrelevant to the question.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Actually quite central to the ability to win the club World Cup. If you disagree then you’re an idiot.
Basically to win the world club cup means for European teams you have to win either the CL or the Europa plus the European Super cup.
Those European nights in two legged competitions are absolutely brilliant. Especially for the later rounds. Wouldn’t swap one of those for the league cup let alone any associated trophy.
Ask any Liverpool fan if they would swap the 4-0 v Barca for the league cup and they say fack off.
Sign in if you want to comment
Which is more of a prestigious trophy
Page 8 of 10
6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10
posted on 24/7/20
comment by Mael - NOT Wahl (U22417)
furrrking thick
----------------------------------------------------------------------
ha ha, definitely not wahl.
but you're right, 99% of the achievement of winning the CWC is winning the CL, after that it's just a glorified friendly halfway round the world against substandard opponents.
posted on 24/7/20
comment by Mael - NOT Wahl (U22417)
posted 1 minute ago
Since it seems people are missing the point, let me ask this question:
If you could win either
(A) CL and league cup
(B) CL and club World Cup
Which would you choose out of (A) or (B)?
I don’t understand why people are so furrrking thick and keep including the separate achievement of winning the CL into the case for winning the CWC when my question is literally about the two competitions of the league cup and club World Cup taken in ISOLATION, but I dunno, I guess some people have low iqs and can’t understand a simple question.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'd choose A. However I still think the Club World Cup is the most prestigious out of the two and the clubs would choose the CWC also, considering this and the huge difference in prize money.
posted on 24/7/20
comment by Don Draper's dandruff (U20155)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Mael - NOT Wahl (U22417)
furrrking thick
----------------------------------------------------------------------
ha ha, definitely not wahl.
but you're right, 99% of the achievement of winning the CWC is winning the CL, after that it's just a glorified friendly halfway round the world against substandard opponents.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Its also possible to win the league cup by being drawn solely against lower league teams.
posted on 24/7/20
comment by welshpoolfan (U7693)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Don Draper's dandruff (U20155)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Mael - NOT Wahl (U22417)
furrrking thick
----------------------------------------------------------------------
ha ha, definitely not wahl.
but you're right, 99% of the achievement of winning the CWC is winning the CL, after that it's just a glorified friendly halfway round the world against substandard opponents.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Its also possible to win the league cup by being drawn solely against lower league teams.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah but then you have to be consistent enough to beat like 6 pub teams, rather than just 2
posted on 24/7/20
comment by TBaggerin (U11806)
posted 23 minutes ago
comment by Winston (U16525)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Busby (U19985)
posted 1 minute ago
“ Interesting discussion though!”
Not really interesting though, is it?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think it is!
I had to have a good think about it before I came to a decision in my own mind on this one.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Thinking before posting? Not the JA way
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Noted!
posted on 24/7/20
comment by welshpoolfan (U7693)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Its also possible to win the league cup by being drawn solely against lower league teams.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
yes, that's the element of luck in any draw. but in the CWC you are 100% guaranteed to win it if you beat 2 (used to be 1) mediocre teams. flamengo would be lucky to avoid relegation from the PL.
and i'd love to know the last team to win the league cup "by being drawn solely against lower league teams."
posted on 24/7/20
Audi cup easily.
posted on 24/7/20
Definitely the club World cup, although it's not exactly taken off it does make sense. It's a bit hampered because of the gulf in quality between European football and other continents is so vast and therefore it tends to go without saying that a full strength and focused European champion team would walk it.
What's the point of the league cup though? It's great for giving young players a run around but above that what's the point when you have the FA Cup?
posted on 24/7/20
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 2 hours, 6 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 11 minutes ago
comment by There'sOnlyOneRed's (U1721)
posted 14 minutes ago
comment by Diafol Coch 77 (U2462)
posted 2 minutes ago
I think Jose will take the League Cup seriously. That's something I do like about him. He'll always try to win silverware. Hell he even claimed the Community Shield as part of a 'treble'.
As for the Club World Cup it's nice to win and it may get more prestigious in future. It only confirms you as best in the world though if you win your league and the Champions League the previous season. Then you can truly say you're the best in your country, continent and planet. 👍
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's like saying winning the World Cup only confirms you as the best in the world of you win your previous Nations League and continental championship, ie EURO's.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Two completely different ways of qualifying for those respective competitions. Also, only European teams (and Israel) can win the Euros...
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Only English teams can win the PL. Only European teams can win the CL. Not sure what your point is.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Sorry. Been out for a walk. I misread what you wrote re Euros but the point I was making that the Euros (or any continental Competition) has a different qualifying mechanism so is truly stand alone. In club football though you only qualify for the continental tournaments through domestic competition. They also happen every year rather than every four. So, to conclude, my first remark on this matter was correct!
posted on 24/7/20
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
When I was 10 and Liverpool had never won the League Cup I was made up when we won 4 in a row. Another 4 wins later several of which I have witnessed in person I’m a bit ‘Meh!’ The final straw was the EFL forcing Liverpool’s hand this season when we had two games in 24 hours. Watching us win a new trophy against one of the worlds most famous teams made me feel like I was 10 again.
posted on 24/7/20
comment by Mael - NOT Wahl (U22417)
posted 58 minutes ago
Since it seems people are missing the point, let me ask this question:
If you could win either
(A) CL and league cup
(B) CL and club World Cup
Which would you choose out of (A) or (B)?
I don’t understand why people are so furrrking thick and keep including the separate achievement of winning the CL into the case for winning the CWC when my question is literally about the two competitions of the league cup and club World Cup taken in ISOLATION, but I dunno, I guess some people have low iqs and can’t understand a simple question.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
your original question was which is more prestigious.
answer= cwc
this question= A but that means losing to some cheating south american team in the final.
so i'll take C and win the CL, CWC and the league cup.
posted on 24/7/20
As a United fan I can pretty much remember most things we’ve won since the turn of the century, who we played in the latter stages, who scored etc.
When we won the World club championship ship in 2009, I could not tell who we played or who scored.
Champions of the world is a nice title but in reality it’s a nothing trophy and ever entrant outside of the European entry is barely PL quality, most not even that.
posted on 24/7/20
*championship, the 2nd ship just sailed in out of nowhere
posted on 24/7/20
It doesn’t seem so long ago that Man U fans were telling us the League Cup was a Mickey Mouse trophy
posted on 24/7/20
comment by Ringo Fire (U4165)
posted 3 minutes ago
It doesn’t seem so long ago that Man U fans were telling us the League Cup was a Mickey Mouse trophy
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s Mickey Mouse compared to the PL and CL but still really enjoyable to win.
posted on 24/7/20
The thing with the World Club Championship is that to be in it you have to be European champions (normally). So to get there is an achievement. To win it is nice, but not a big deal. You've already proved yourself to be the best in Europe by winning the CL anyway.
The World Club Championship is just filler, like an add on in a computer game, with the main purpose being financial. That's the reason it will get compared to the Super Cup and Community Shield. As the actual achievement is winning something to be there in the first place
posted on 24/7/20
*and being the best in Europe already means you're best in the world. There's a reason the South American teams take the World Club Championship far, far more seriously than the Europeans do
posted on 25/7/20
comment by merrysupersteve (U1132)
posted 43 minutes ago
The thing with the World Club Championship is that to be in it you have to be European champions (normally). So to get there is an achievement. To win it is nice, but not a big deal. You've already proved yourself to be the best in Europe by winning the CL anyway.
The World Club Championship is just filler, like an add on in a computer game, with the main purpose being financial. That's the reason it will get compared to the Super Cup and Community Shield. As the actual achievement is winning something to be there in the first place
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It doesn't compare to the Super Cup or Community Shield. In both those examples the club's could've already met that season, established a champion and those really are nothing more than a little charity match. Unless there's a scenario where a club can qualify for the EL but not the CL?
The club World cup while easily forgettable brings together winners from each contintenal competition that otherwise couldn't meet.
posted on 25/7/20
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by merrysupersteve (U1132)
posted 43 minutes ago
The thing with the World Club Championship is that to be in it you have to be European champions (normally). So to get there is an achievement. To win it is nice, but not a big deal. You've already proved yourself to be the best in Europe by winning the CL anyway.
The World Club Championship is just filler, like an add on in a computer game, with the main purpose being financial. That's the reason it will get compared to the Super Cup and Community Shield. As the actual achievement is winning something to be there in the first place
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It doesn't compare to the Super Cup or Community Shield. In both those examples the club's could've already met that season, established a champion and those really are nothing more than a little charity match. Unless there's a scenario where a club can qualify for the EL but not the CL?
The club World cup while easily forgettable brings together winners from each contintenal competition that otherwise couldn't meet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And ones where the financial disparity is such, that meeting Middlesbrough in the league cup is a more level playing field. It's pointless as you've qualified for it by beating teams far better than you could possibly face and it's nothing more than an add on
posted on 25/7/20
comment by merrysupersteve (U1132)
posted 2 hours, 59 minutes ago
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by merrysupersteve (U1132)
posted 43 minutes ago
The thing with the World Club Championship is that to be in it you have to be European champions (normally). So to get there is an achievement. To win it is nice, but not a big deal. You've already proved yourself to be the best in Europe by winning the CL anyway.
The World Club Championship is just filler, like an add on in a computer game, with the main purpose being financial. That's the reason it will get compared to the Super Cup and Community Shield. As the actual achievement is winning something to be there in the first place
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It doesn't compare to the Super Cup or Community Shield. In both those examples the club's could've already met that season, established a champion and those really are nothing more than a little charity match. Unless there's a scenario where a club can qualify for the EL but not the CL?
The club World cup while easily forgettable brings together winners from each contintenal competition that otherwise couldn't meet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And ones where the financial disparity is such, that meeting Middlesbrough in the league cup is a more level playing field. It's pointless as you've qualified for it by beating teams far better than you could possibly face and it's nothing more than an add on
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You could argue that any league or cup isn't a fair playing field though. What's the point of having any competition in that case?
posted on 25/7/20
I’d opt to win the club World Cup every time..
As it means you’ve won two trophies to actually get there.
League cup anyone in the whole league can enter by default.
posted on 25/7/20
As it means you’ve won two trophies to actually get there.
-----------
Completely irrelevant to the question.
posted on 25/7/20
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 9 hours, 13 minutes ago
comment by merrysupersteve (U1132)
posted 2 hours, 59 minutes ago
comment by Scruttocks (U19684)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by merrysupersteve (U1132)
posted 43 minutes ago
The thing with the World Club Championship is that to be in it you have to be European champions (normally). So to get there is an achievement. To win it is nice, but not a big deal. You've already proved yourself to be the best in Europe by winning the CL anyway.
The World Club Championship is just filler, like an add on in a computer game, with the main purpose being financial. That's the reason it will get compared to the Super Cup and Community Shield. As the actual achievement is winning something to be there in the first place
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It doesn't compare to the Super Cup or Community Shield. In both those examples the club's could've already met that season, established a champion and those really are nothing more than a little charity match. Unless there's a scenario where a club can qualify for the EL but not the CL?
The club World cup while easily forgettable brings together winners from each contintenal competition that otherwise couldn't meet.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
And ones where the financial disparity is such, that meeting Middlesbrough in the league cup is a more level playing field. It's pointless as you've qualified for it by beating teams far better than you could possibly face and it's nothing more than an add on
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You could argue that any league or cup isn't a fair playing field though. What's the point of having any competition in that case?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think you're well aware that most competitions don't have the financial and talent disparity that is displayed in the World Club money-spinner
posted on 25/7/20
comment by Mael - NOT Wahl (U22417)
posted 2 hours, 10 minutes ago
As it means you’ve won two trophies to actually get there.
-----------
Completely irrelevant to the question.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Actually quite central to the ability to win the club World Cup. If you disagree then you’re an idiot.
posted on 25/7/20
Basically to win the world club cup means for European teams you have to win either the CL or the Europa plus the European Super cup.
Those European nights in two legged competitions are absolutely brilliant. Especially for the later rounds. Wouldn’t swap one of those for the league cup let alone any associated trophy.
Ask any Liverpool fan if they would swap the 4-0 v Barca for the league cup and they say fack off.
Page 8 of 10
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