comment by meltonblue (U10617)
posted 2 minutes ago
He’s got a point though. Given people have been explicitly told the motivation behind taking the knee, the only reason to boo it can be ignorance on their part. Rather than wanting to resolve that, they’re instead looking for others to accommodate their own ignorance either by stopping taking the knee or removing any BLM signage, looking at some comments on this thread.

It’s a bizarre argument really, essentially saying “I’m ignorant, so everyone else must change”
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm not sure it's ignorance, Melts. From what I'm gathering people seem to be justifying disliking the symbolism of taking the knee in all sorts of ways, and the one that plays most reasonable (or disingenuous, you decide) is that they don't think it's having any effect.

Quite why you'd boo something ineffectual if you agreed with what it's trying to achieve is beyond me. That seems overly hostile if you take their reasons at face value.

comment by Insert random username (U10647)
posted 18 seconds ago
comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by meltonblue (U10617)
posted 9 seconds ago
He’s got a point though. Given people have been explicitly told the motivation behind taking the knee, the only reason to boo it can be ignorance on their part. Rather than wanting to resolve that, they’re instead looking for others to accommodate their own ignorance either by stopping taking the knee or removing any BLM signage, looking at some comments on this thread.

It’s a bizarre argument really, essentially saying “I’m ignorant, so everyone else must change”
----------------------------------------------------------------------


So you've selected certain arguments and applied it to everybody that disagrees with taking the knee and called them ignorant.

The stupidity is astounding.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is an article about booing.

Do you condemn the booing?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't condemn any form of showing an opinion.

I don't agree necessarily agree with an opinion it but people have a right to demonstrate an opinion.

I don't agree with taking the knee because the people doing it could be doing so much more and choose not to.

comment by PawlBawron (U1055)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Insert random username (U10647)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by PawlBawron (U1055)
posted 32 minutes ago
comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 1 minute ago
I realise that I will be called a racist on here by people like you but I couldn't give a t0ss.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
People like me, wtf!
I haven't called ANYONE racist on this site, i'm just offering an opinion from the other side of the coin. If you feel that makes you racist, that your business but i didn't call you that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yer rite!

Putting you in capital letters when I quite rightly pointed out what many people associate the BLM movement with doesn't portray me as a racist at all.

The Colston statue was torn down in the name of the BLM and mob rule goes down very badly with many folk.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Perhaps you should do more research about the removal of the Colston statue

Bristolians have for decades sought to have the plaque changed to accurately reflect the history, there are a large number of black Bristolians with his surname, such was the naming convention for released slaves who used to walk past a statue that did nothing to acknowledge his part in history that caused them to be there and given his name instead of their own cultural family names.

The council repeatedly blocked it, and when the pressure turned in to loss of voters they decided they would change it, but watered down the message and tied the changing of it up in legislation for years.

The removal of Colston was not a flash in the pan reaction to Floyd, it was the culmination of over a decade of the establishment refusing to act on slavery and racism.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
My understanding is that 56% of Bristolians wanted it to remain?

However the way it was taken down has gone along way towards what you are hearing at games now and as more fans get in I think its going to get alot worse.

If as the players claim (and I believe them) its not political then lets lose the BLM logo at the grounds, Sky score box.....etc!
----------------------------------------------------------------------

You do realise that the players don't have any control of what is shown on sky right?

I've described several times, how people like to create non-existent links to justify being against the equal rights movements and you are here doing explicitly that.

For a chunk of last year we had 'I support the message but because there is violence involved in the protest I can't support the delivery'

Players make a peaceful protest.

'Boooooooooooooooooo'

comment by The Post Nearly Man Says Every Single One Of Us Loves Alex Ferguson (U1270)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by meltonblue (U10617)
posted 2 minutes ago
He’s got a point though. Given people have been explicitly told the motivation behind taking the knee, the only reason to boo it can be ignorance on their part. Rather than wanting to resolve that, they’re instead looking for others to accommodate their own ignorance either by stopping taking the knee or removing any BLM signage, looking at some comments on this thread.

It’s a bizarre argument really, essentially saying “I’m ignorant, so everyone else must change”
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm not sure it's ignorance, Melts. From what I'm gathering people seem to be justifying disliking the symbolism of taking the knee in all sorts of ways, and the one that plays most reasonable (or disingenuous, you decide) is that they don't think it's having any effect.

Quite why you'd boo something ineffectual if you agreed with what it's trying to achieve is beyond me. That seems overly hostile if you take their reasons at face value.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Exactly. Why boo it? Who do people think is being asked to try and have an effect by players taking a knee or even the movement as a whole?

comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 3 minutes ago

I don't agree with taking the knee because the people doing it could be doing so much more and choose not to.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So they're just booing the players for only taking the knee and not doing more? They see kneeling as a start but not going far enough?

I don't think they are, you know.

comment by The Post Nearly Man Says Every Single One Of Us Loves Alex Ferguson (U1270)
posted 53 seconds ago
comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 3 minutes ago

I don't agree with taking the knee because the people doing it could be doing so much more and choose not to.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So they're just booing the players for only taking the knee and not doing more? They see kneeling as a start but not going far enough?

I don't think they are, you know.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly. Just another poor attempt of ignorant people trying to excuse the fact they want to boo and dare i say it, are racist

comment by welshpoolfan (U7693)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by PawlBawron (U1055)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Insert random username (U10647)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by PawlBawron (U1055)
posted 32 minutes ago
comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 1 minute ago
I realise that I will be called a racist on here by people like you but I couldn't give a t0ss.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
People like me, wtf!
I haven't called ANYONE racist on this site, i'm just offering an opinion from the other side of the coin. If you feel that makes you racist, that your business but i didn't call you that.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yer rite!

Putting you in capital letters when I quite rightly pointed out what many people associate the BLM movement with doesn't portray me as a racist at all.

The Colston statue was torn down in the name of the BLM and mob rule goes down very badly with many folk.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Perhaps you should do more research about the removal of the Colston statue

Bristolians have for decades sought to have the plaque changed to accurately reflect the history, there are a large number of black Bristolians with his surname, such was the naming convention for released slaves who used to walk past a statue that did nothing to acknowledge his part in history that caused them to be there and given his name instead of their own cultural family names.

The council repeatedly blocked it, and when the pressure turned in to loss of voters they decided they would change it, but watered down the message and tied the changing of it up in legislation for years.

The removal of Colston was not a flash in the pan reaction to Floyd, it was the culmination of over a decade of the establishment refusing to act on slavery and racism.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
My understanding is that 56% of Bristolians wanted it to remain?

However the way it was taken down has gone along way towards what you are hearing at games now and as more fans get in I think its going to get alot worse.

If as the players claim (and I believe them) its not political then lets lose the BLM logo at the grounds, Sky score box.....etc!
----------------------------------------------------------------------

You do realise that the players don't have any control of what is shown on sky right?

I've described several times, how people like to create non-existent links to justify being against the equal rights movements and you are here doing explicitly that.

For a chunk of last year we had 'I support the message but because there is violence involved in the protest I can't support the delivery'

Players make a peaceful protest.

'Boooooooooooooooooo'
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Just like Rashford had no control over school dinners.

If the players speak up in wanting the BLM logo gone it goes. That would be such a wise move.

Again unlike others on here I'm offering a solution.

“I don't condemn any form of showing an opinion”

Did you really think that through and mean to type that?

The other thing I keep hearing is that they don't like the symbolism of taking the knee because it's linked to BLM.

Football has to take a symbolic stand of some sort, and I guarantee if they replaced it with something like the players huddling while they announced a 10 minute silence to highlight the fight against racism, that would get booed too.

comment by Anne is ruled out on medical grounds (U8366)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by The Post Nearly Man Says Every Single One Of Us Loves Alex Ferguson (U1270)
posted 53 seconds ago
comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 3 minutes ago

I don't agree with taking the knee because the people doing it could be doing so much more and choose not to.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So they're just booing the players for only taking the knee and not doing more? They see kneeling as a start but not going far enough?

I don't think they are, you know.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly. Just another poor attempt of ignorant people trying to excuse the fact they want to boo and dare i say it, are racist
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You are a facking moron, a prime example of why society is as facked as it is and I can't be bothered conversing with you any further.

comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 13 minutes ago
comment by Insert random username (U10647)
posted 18 seconds ago
comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by meltonblue (U10617)
posted 9 seconds ago
He’s got a point though. Given people have been explicitly told the motivation behind taking the knee, the only reason to boo it can be ignorance on their part. Rather than wanting to resolve that, they’re instead looking for others to accommodate their own ignorance either by stopping taking the knee or removing any BLM signage, looking at some comments on this thread.

It’s a bizarre argument really, essentially saying “I’m ignorant, so everyone else must change”
----------------------------------------------------------------------


So you've selected certain arguments and applied it to everybody that disagrees with taking the knee and called them ignorant.

The stupidity is astounding.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is an article about booing.

Do you condemn the booing?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't condemn any form of showing an opinion.

I don't agree necessarily agree with an opinion it but people have a right to demonstrate an opinion.

I don't agree with taking the knee because the people doing it could be doing so much more and choose not to.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Do people have the right to express their opinion that player X is a monkey?

comment by meltonblue (U10617)
posted 4 minutes ago
“I don't condemn any form of showing an opinion”

Did you really think that through and mean to type that?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Poorly worded to be fair.

Obviously there are limits but everybody I speak to feels the same way about taking the knee. It's pointless virtue signalling from people who have the power to do more and choose not to.

comment by Insert random username (U10647)
posted 43 seconds ago
comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 13 minutes ago
comment by Insert random username (U10647)
posted 18 seconds ago
comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by meltonblue (U10617)
posted 9 seconds ago
He’s got a point though. Given people have been explicitly told the motivation behind taking the knee, the only reason to boo it can be ignorance on their part. Rather than wanting to resolve that, they’re instead looking for others to accommodate their own ignorance either by stopping taking the knee or removing any BLM signage, looking at some comments on this thread.

It’s a bizarre argument really, essentially saying “I’m ignorant, so everyone else must change”
----------------------------------------------------------------------


So you've selected certain arguments and applied it to everybody that disagrees with taking the knee and called them ignorant.

The stupidity is astounding.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is an article about booing.

Do you condemn the booing?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't condemn any form of showing an opinion.

I don't agree necessarily agree with an opinion it but people have a right to demonstrate an opinion.

I don't agree with taking the knee because the people doing it could be doing so much more and choose not to.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Do people have the right to express their opinion that player X is a monkey?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Cancel culture, innit

comment by The Post Nearly Man Says Every Single One Of Us Loves Alex Ferguson (U1270)
posted 19 seconds ago
The other thing I keep hearing is that they don't like the symbolism of taking the knee because it's linked to BLM.

Football has to take a symbolic stand of some sort, and I guarantee if they replaced it with something like the players huddling while they announced a 10 minute silence to highlight the fight against racism, that would get booed too.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Remember that this was also started at the height of the pandemic, it was a suitable distanced stance to take

comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 1 hour, 17 minutes ago
comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 17 minutes ago
comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 13 seconds ago
I agree with you though, if there wasn't institutionalised racism it wouldn't constantly be a debate. And as a white person I absolutely do not have the ability to give an opinion on that as obviously I've not experienced it.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
thank you. it feels like people are trying to convince me that certain things 'don't exists' when i have seen, heard, read and felt it first hand, read about it in numerous books, seen various documentary's and films about it but people still deny it exists, it crazy.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Also AFC you are absolutely spot on in saying that Zaha should be treated differently to white footballers on this issue.

I hear your frustrations but I just get annoyed watching football players who could do so much more take a knee and think it makes a difference. Just feels to me that they don't really care enough to do something real but want to be seen to be caring
----------------------------------------------------------------------
To be honest mate, it wasn't me talking about the Zaha thing, it was someone else but i understand what they were trying to say.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yh it was me mate. And you get people saying unhelpful stuff like "well thats racist". Mind boggling

comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Anne is ruled out on medical grounds (U8366)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by The Post Nearly Man Says Every Single One Of Us Loves Alex Ferguson (U1270)
posted 53 seconds ago
comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 3 minutes ago

I don't agree with taking the knee because the people doing it could be doing so much more and choose not to.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So they're just booing the players for only taking the knee and not doing more? They see kneeling as a start but not going far enough?

I don't think they are, you know.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly. Just another poor attempt of ignorant people trying to excuse the fact they want to boo and dare i say it, are racist
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You are a facking moron, a prime example of why society is as facked as it is and I can't be bothered conversing with you any further.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s staggering how you’re automatically a racist if you don’t agree with taking a knee…..

comment by Insert random username (U10647)
posted 6 seconds ago
comment by The Post Nearly Man Says Every Single One Of Us Loves Alex Ferguson (U1270)
posted 19 seconds ago
The other thing I keep hearing is that they don't like the symbolism of taking the knee because it's linked to BLM.

Football has to take a symbolic stand of some sort, and I guarantee if they replaced it with something like the players huddling while they announced a 10 minute silence to highlight the fight against racism, that would get booed too.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Remember that this was also started at the height of the pandemic, it was a suitable distanced stance to take
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, point being the people that boo this would boo whatever the next thing was as well.

comment by Insert random username (U10647)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 13 minutes ago
comment by Insert random username (U10647)
posted 18 seconds ago
comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by meltonblue (U10617)
posted 9 seconds ago
He’s got a point though. Given people have been explicitly told the motivation behind taking the knee, the only reason to boo it can be ignorance on their part. Rather than wanting to resolve that, they’re instead looking for others to accommodate their own ignorance either by stopping taking the knee or removing any BLM signage, looking at some comments on this thread.

It’s a bizarre argument really, essentially saying “I’m ignorant, so everyone else must change”
----------------------------------------------------------------------


So you've selected certain arguments and applied it to everybody that disagrees with taking the knee and called them ignorant.

The stupidity is astounding.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is an article about booing.

Do you condemn the booing?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't condemn any form of showing an opinion.

I don't agree necessarily agree with an opinion it but people have a right to demonstrate an opinion.

I don't agree with taking the knee because the people doing it could be doing so much more and choose not to.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Do people have the right to express their opinion that player X is a monkey?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think anybody with 10 brain cells can work out that's not what Im referring to despite it being poorly worded.


What is the obsession on this forum of catching people out rather than actual discussion.

comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Anne is ruled out on medical grounds (U8366)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by The Post Nearly Man Says Every Single One Of Us Loves Alex Ferguson (U1270)
posted 53 seconds ago
comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 3 minutes ago

I don't agree with taking the knee because the people doing it could be doing so much more and choose not to.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So they're just booing the players for only taking the knee and not doing more? They see kneeling as a start but not going far enough?

I don't think they are, you know.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly. Just another poor attempt of ignorant people trying to excuse the fact they want to boo and dare i say it, are racist
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You are a facking moron, a prime example of why society is as facked as it is and I can't be bothered conversing with you any further.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Thats fine don't converse with me and stay ignorant. Although when you thought AFC said what I'd said you actually agreed with me. You're clearly a fool. You not agreeing with taking the knee is one thing, but not condemning booing shows you for what you are

comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by meltonblue (U10617)
posted 4 minutes ago
“I don't condemn any form of showing an opinion”

Did you really think that through and mean to type that?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Poorly worded to be fair.

Obviously there are limits but everybody I speak to feels the same way about taking the knee. It's pointless virtue signalling from people who have the power to do more and choose not to.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's people sharing a standpoint with racists, even if they arent.

I don't for one second believe you are racist but you are intelligent and should realise how problematic you saying

"Stop taking the knee, you should be doing more"

Is given the racists/racially prejudiced who are saying "Stop taking the knee"


This thread is literally about booing, but instead of just condemning the booing, you are arguing with those who DO condemn it because you think footballers should do more.

You don't do nothing until you do more, you do something and THEN do more.

comment by The scenes (U22442)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Anne is ruled out on medical grounds (U8366)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by The Post Nearly Man Says Every Single One Of Us Loves Alex Ferguson (U1270)
posted 53 seconds ago
comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 3 minutes ago

I don't agree with taking the knee because the people doing it could be doing so much more and choose not to.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So they're just booing the players for only taking the knee and not doing more? They see kneeling as a start but not going far enough?

I don't think they are, you know.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly. Just another poor attempt of ignorant people trying to excuse the fact they want to boo and dare i say it, are racist
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You are a facking moron, a prime example of why society is as facked as it is and I can't be bothered conversing with you any further.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It’s staggering how you’re automatically a racist if you don’t agree with taking a knee…..
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No1 has said that but go on

comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Insert random username (U10647)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 13 minutes ago
comment by Insert random username (U10647)
posted 18 seconds ago
comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by meltonblue (U10617)
posted 9 seconds ago
He’s got a point though. Given people have been explicitly told the motivation behind taking the knee, the only reason to boo it can be ignorance on their part. Rather than wanting to resolve that, they’re instead looking for others to accommodate their own ignorance either by stopping taking the knee or removing any BLM signage, looking at some comments on this thread.

It’s a bizarre argument really, essentially saying “I’m ignorant, so everyone else must change”
----------------------------------------------------------------------


So you've selected certain arguments and applied it to everybody that disagrees with taking the knee and called them ignorant.

The stupidity is astounding.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is an article about booing.

Do you condemn the booing?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't condemn any form of showing an opinion.

I don't agree necessarily agree with an opinion it but people have a right to demonstrate an opinion.

I don't agree with taking the knee because the people doing it could be doing so much more and choose not to.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Do people have the right to express their opinion that player X is a monkey?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think anybody with 10 brain cells can work out that's not what Im referring to despite it being poorly worded.


What is the obsession on this forum of catching people out rather than actual discussion.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Asking a question isn't seeking to catch you out, I'm seeking to further understand your points.

If anything you are the one refusing to understand others opinions on your stance, as my post above explains

comment by Insert random username (U10647)
posted 1 second ago
comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by meltonblue (U10617)
posted 4 minutes ago
“I don't condemn any form of showing an opinion”

Did you really think that through and mean to type that?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Poorly worded to be fair.

Obviously there are limits but everybody I speak to feels the same way about taking the knee. It's pointless virtue signalling from people who have the power to do more and choose not to.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
It's people sharing a standpoint with racists, even if they arent.

I don't for one second believe you are racist but you are intelligent and should realise how problematic you saying

"Stop taking the knee, you should be doing more"

Is given the racists/racially prejudiced who are saying "Stop taking the knee"


This thread is literally about booing, but instead of just condemning the booing, you are arguing with those who DO condemn it because you think footballers should do more.

You don't do nothing until you do more, you do something and THEN do more.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
But we've been doing this for a year now I think? And nobody is doing more.

Social media blackout was a good start and then that stopped for some reason.

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

comment by Just Shoot, now a Marxist (U10408)
posted 56 seconds ago
comment by Anne is ruled out on medical grounds (U8366)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 1 hour, 17 minutes ago
comment by Alisson Becker, Liverpool's Number 9 (U3979)
posted 17 minutes ago
comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 13 seconds ago
I agree with you though, if there wasn't institutionalised racism it wouldn't constantly be a debate. And as a white person I absolutely do not have the ability to give an opinion on that as obviously I've not experienced it.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
thank you. it feels like people are trying to convince me that certain things 'don't exists' when i have seen, heard, read and felt it first hand, read about it in numerous books, seen various documentary's and films about it but people still deny it exists, it crazy.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Also AFC you are absolutely spot on in saying that Zaha should be treated differently to white footballers on this issue.

I hear your frustrations but I just get annoyed watching football players who could do so much more take a knee and think it makes a difference. Just feels to me that they don't really care enough to do something real but want to be seen to be caring
----------------------------------------------------------------------
To be honest mate, it wasn't me talking about the Zaha thing, it was someone else but i understand what they were trying to say.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yh it was me mate. And you get people saying unhelpful stuff like "well thats racist". Mind boggling
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That was me. I'm still intrigued as to why people of different races should be treated differently on the issue.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because people of different races are highly likely to have different experiences of racism, how is it that hard to comprehend?