Comment deleted by Site Moderator

comment by Colemanballs-جيش الدفاع الإسرائيلي (U22246)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by Insert random username (U10647)
posted 13 minutes ago
https://www.theguardian.com/football/ng-interactive/2021/jun/08/david-squires-on-the-unlikely-marxist-takeover-of-english-football



A must read.
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That was about as funny as having piles
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Couldn't say, I'm not sure how funny your piles are.

comment by Just Shoot, now a Marxist (U10408)
posted 15 seconds ago
comment by welshpoolfan (U7693)
posted 27 minutes ago
comment by Just Shoot, now a Marxist (U10408)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by welshpoolfan (U7693)
posted 14 minutes ago
comment by Just Shoot, now a Marxist (U10408)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 1 second ago
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forget the paraphase, sorry.
what would you be keen to see from the players in regards to racism?
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TBH, players have done a lot to alter society and racism. We have come a long way from bananas and monkey gestures.

The next step, if it hasn't already happened. If a player is racially abused the whole team should leave the pitch. This will put an enormous amount of pressure on the racists as 30k+ fans will be looking to beat them as they lose their game
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Thats some good idea's that i think should be implemented alongside the kneeling imo but if people think taking a knee for 10 secs is divisive, what do you think will happen when players walk off the pitch every week for getting racially abused?...carnage imo!!
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I honestly think the pressure would be too high. It may happen for less than 5 games before the fans will stamp it out.

Personally, I find the kneeling hollow and virtue signalling BECAUSE it doesn't really do much and is a club/prem decision, not a player's. By all means kneel if you want in any sporting event, but the idiots shouldn't be tolerated for abusing those that don't.
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The PFA had conducted a survey of its members regarding taking the knee, and, they said, “The results were clear; players overwhelmingly support continuing this act of solidarity despite any adverse responses that may be received.”

You have just provided another example, despite evidence showing otherwise, of twisting the narrative to justify being against the gesture.

Players have said they are choosing to kneel and aren't being forced to (and those that don't want to aren't - see Zaha), and yet you have once again stated that this idea that it osnt their choice and they are being forced to.

It is an attempt to suggest we should oppose the gesture because we are forcing people to do it against their free will (which would be bad) but doesn't stand up to scrutiny.
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So even though we are divided on here and all other surveys, you believe the prem players are all United bar Zaha?

I guess I'm just sceptical
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I've simply provided the evidence that suggests that the majority are in favour. I have also given an example (Zaha) that shows players can refuse if they want and so aren't being forced.

Your claim has been made in spite of this evidence, without your own evidence to back it up. If that's the bar you set for declaring something as fact then that's an issue.
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Never asserted it was a fact. Just an assumption based on how it is highly unlikely to have so many people agree from one group that is divisive elsewhere.
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"Personally, I find the kneeling hollow and virtue signalling BECAUSE it doesn't really do much and is a club/prem decision, not a player's"

Your direct quote. How is anyone to know this is just an unevidenced assumption from the way you have written it?

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

comment by Just Shoot, now a Marxist (U10408)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by welshpoolfan (U7693)
posted 2 minutes ago
comment by Just Shoot, now a Marxist (U10408)
posted 15 seconds ago
comment by welshpoolfan (U7693)
posted 27 minutes ago
comment by Just Shoot, now a Marxist (U10408)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by welshpoolfan (U7693)
posted 14 minutes ago
comment by Just Shoot, now a Marxist (U10408)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 1 second ago
----------------------------------------------------------------------
forget the paraphase, sorry.
what would you be keen to see from the players in regards to racism?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
TBH, players have done a lot to alter society and racism. We have come a long way from bananas and monkey gestures.

The next step, if it hasn't already happened. If a player is racially abused the whole team should leave the pitch. This will put an enormous amount of pressure on the racists as 30k+ fans will be looking to beat them as they lose their game
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Thats some good idea's that i think should be implemented alongside the kneeling imo but if people think taking a knee for 10 secs is divisive, what do you think will happen when players walk off the pitch every week for getting racially abused?...carnage imo!!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I honestly think the pressure would be too high. It may happen for less than 5 games before the fans will stamp it out.

Personally, I find the kneeling hollow and virtue signalling BECAUSE it doesn't really do much and is a club/prem decision, not a player's. By all means kneel if you want in any sporting event, but the idiots shouldn't be tolerated for abusing those that don't.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

The PFA had conducted a survey of its members regarding taking the knee, and, they said, “The results were clear; players overwhelmingly support continuing this act of solidarity despite any adverse responses that may be received.”

You have just provided another example, despite evidence showing otherwise, of twisting the narrative to justify being against the gesture.

Players have said they are choosing to kneel and aren't being forced to (and those that don't want to aren't - see Zaha), and yet you have once again stated that this idea that it osnt their choice and they are being forced to.

It is an attempt to suggest we should oppose the gesture because we are forcing people to do it against their free will (which would be bad) but doesn't stand up to scrutiny.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So even though we are divided on here and all other surveys, you believe the prem players are all United bar Zaha?

I guess I'm just sceptical
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I've simply provided the evidence that suggests that the majority are in favour. I have also given an example (Zaha) that shows players can refuse if they want and so aren't being forced.

Your claim has been made in spite of this evidence, without your own evidence to back it up. If that's the bar you set for declaring something as fact then that's an issue.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Never asserted it was a fact. Just an assumption based on how it is highly unlikely to have so many people agree from one group that is divisive elsewhere.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

"Personally, I find the kneeling hollow and virtue signalling BECAUSE it doesn't really do much and is a club/prem decision, not a player's"

Your direct quote. How is anyone to know this is just an unevidenced assumption from the way you have written it?
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Well, you know now. 👍
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Indeed, but that doesn't change the fact that it is this exact tactic of declaring things that are false that helps to muddy the reality around groups like BLM to encourage people to oppose them. We should all be careful witb our words.

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

Hopefully they'll stop booing the others teams national anthem too.

comment by SirCastic (U8772)
posted 23 seconds ago
Hopefully they'll stop booing the others teams national anthem too.
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I really hope the players kneel during the national anthems.

comment by Just Shoot, now a Marxist (U10408)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 34 minutes ago
Orrrrrr...... perhaps cheating players that rarely display exemplary behaviour shouldn't be the moral peacocks?
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You sound smart enough from all the discussions we've had today, to understand that highlighting racism/discrimination isn't people being moral peacocks or moral teachers, it's something that we all experience, regardless of our job, pay, education, status etc..they just have a bigger platform to show it on.
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Of course, but they are paid entertainers entertaining. Just as I wouldn't like going to watch the Irishman but before the movie starts De Niro says f#ck Trump.
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Not the same at all, and no one is saying f*%k a particular person, they're saying f racism.

comment by Just Shoot, now a Marxist (U10408)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 34 minutes ago
Orrrrrr...... perhaps cheating players that rarely display exemplary behaviour shouldn't be the moral peacocks?
------------------------------------------------------------------------
You sound smart enough from all the discussions we've had today, to understand that highlighting racism/discrimination isn't people being moral peacocks or moral teachers, it's something that we all experience, regardless of our job, pay, education, status etc..they just have a bigger platform to show it on.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Of course, but they are paid entertainers entertaining. Just as I wouldn't like going to watch the Irishman but before the movie starts De Niro says f#ck Trump.
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So you don't watch any movies that might provide a commentary on a real life event or political position?

If the kneeling continues into next season(almost 100% this will be the case) with hopefully almost capacity crowds back,then it will be interesting.

The indication is that there will be a mixture of support and booing,which could lead to conflict in the stands between supporters of the same team.

If this happens will they continue with the kneeling knowing it could lead to violence in the stands between supporters of the same club that you cannot segregate.

What a potential dilemma it could be for all concerned.

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Comment deleted by Site Moderator

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

comment by Just Shoot, now a Marxist (U10408)
posted 28 seconds ago
comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Just Shoot, now a Marxist (U10408)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 34 minutes ago
Orrrrrr...... perhaps cheating players that rarely display exemplary behaviour shouldn't be the moral peacocks?
------------------------------------------------------------------------
You sound smart enough from all the discussions we've had today, to understand that highlighting racism/discrimination isn't people being moral peacocks or moral teachers, it's something that we all experience, regardless of our job, pay, education, status etc..they just have a bigger platform to show it on.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Of course, but they are paid entertainers entertaining. Just as I wouldn't like going to watch the Irishman but before the movie starts De Niro says f#ck Trump.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not the same at all, and no one is saying f*%k a particular person, they're saying f racism.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The point is, I paid to be entertained - not be given a social/political/ moral message prior to the main event.
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For some on here they'd sooner see their players take a knee than score a goal.

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

comment by Just Shoot, now a Marxist (U10408)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by welshpoolfan (U7693)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Just Shoot, now a Marxist (U10408)
posted 8 minutes ago
comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 34 minutes ago
Orrrrrr...... perhaps cheating players that rarely display exemplary behaviour shouldn't be the moral peacocks?
------------------------------------------------------------------------
You sound smart enough from all the discussions we've had today, to understand that highlighting racism/discrimination isn't people being moral peacocks or moral teachers, it's something that we all experience, regardless of our job, pay, education, status etc..they just have a bigger platform to show it on.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Of course, but they are paid entertainers entertaining. Just as I wouldn't like going to watch the Irishman but before the movie starts De Niro says f#ck Trump.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

So you don't watch any movies that might provide a commentary on a real life event or political position?
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Or course I do. But I make that choice on what to watch.
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No one is taking that choice away from you, you could turn away for 10 secs in a match, if it irks you so much.

comment by GTWI4T- some people deserve to get trolled (U6008)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Just Shoot, now a Marxist (U10408)
posted 10 seconds ago
comment by GTWI4T- some people deserve to get trolled (U6008)
posted 15 seconds ago
comment by Just Shoot, now a Marxist (U10408)
posted 17 seconds ago
comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Just Shoot, now a Marxist (U10408)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 34 minutes ago
Orrrrrr...... perhaps cheating players that rarely display exemplary behaviour shouldn't be the moral peacocks?
------------------------------------------------------------------------
You sound smart enough from all the discussions we've had today, to understand that highlighting racism/discrimination isn't people being moral peacocks or moral teachers, it's something that we all experience, regardless of our job, pay, education, status etc..they just have a bigger platform to show it on.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Of course, but they are paid entertainers entertaining. Just as I wouldn't like going to watch the Irishman but before the movie starts De Niro says f#ck Trump.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not the same at all, and no one is saying f*%k a particular person, they're saying f racism.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The point is, I paid to be entertained - not be given a social/political/ moral message prior to the main event.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Even if the moral message is standing up to racism?
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Yes. It's not that I don't think standing up to racism isn't important though.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Fair enough. Do you feel that those 10 seconds of solidarity in delivering a message impacts your enjoyment of a sporting event you have paid to watch?
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Do you believe those 10 seconds have changed racists into non racists?

comment by Colemanballs-جيش الدفاع الإسرائيلي (U22246)
posted 37 seconds ago
comment by GTWI4T- some people deserve to get trolled (U6008)
posted 1 minute ago
comment by Just Shoot, now a Marxist (U10408)
posted 10 seconds ago
comment by GTWI4T- some people deserve to get trolled (U6008)
posted 15 seconds ago
comment by Just Shoot, now a Marxist (U10408)
posted 17 seconds ago
comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Just Shoot, now a Marxist (U10408)
posted 4 minutes ago
comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 34 minutes ago
Orrrrrr...... perhaps cheating players that rarely display exemplary behaviour shouldn't be the moral peacocks?
------------------------------------------------------------------------
You sound smart enough from all the discussions we've had today, to understand that highlighting racism/discrimination isn't people being moral peacocks or moral teachers, it's something that we all experience, regardless of our job, pay, education, status etc..they just have a bigger platform to show it on.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Of course, but they are paid entertainers entertaining. Just as I wouldn't like going to watch the Irishman but before the movie starts De Niro says f#ck Trump.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Not the same at all, and no one is saying f*%k a particular person, they're saying f racism.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The point is, I paid to be entertained - not be given a social/political/ moral message prior to the main event.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Even if the moral message is standing up to racism?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes. It's not that I don't think standing up to racism isn't important though.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Fair enough. Do you feel that those 10 seconds of solidarity in delivering a message impacts your enjoyment of a sporting event you have paid to watch?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Do you believe those 10 seconds have changed racists into non racists?
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Nobody has ever claimed it did...

Comment deleted by Site Moderator

“Not really. As I said before, I'm not against kneeling. I just find it hollow that (I believe) it's expected from all players.”

Are you still hanging on to that one quote from one player saying it feels expected to him.

For some on here they'd sooner see their players take a knee than score a goal.
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If your saying i'd rather see that they don't get racially abused, more than scoring a goal then yes, your'e right.