Comment deleted by Site Moderator
comment by He's French, He's Flash... (U9335)
posted 44 seconds ago
comment by Greatteamswinit4times- A terrible enemy (U6008)
posted 10 seconds ago
comment by He's French, He's Flash... (U9335)
posted 15 seconds ago
comment by Greatteamswinit4times- A terrible enemy (U6008)
posted 47 seconds ago
comment by He's French, He's Flash... (U9335)
posted 1 minute ago
Wow, that race card is getting over-played on this thread. Entitlement Britain fully evident here.
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Yawn. Yes, entitlement Britain, pc gone made blah blah blah. All you hear is this from people of certain beliefs. If someone doesn't agree with a point of view then it's obviously entitlement Britain gone mad. Definitely.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Says the guy who is shocked by the prospect of a business owner having the freedom to employ whomever he/she wants.. What was it you said, "wow?"
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I did indeed say wow at the thought of someone thinking that the colour of a persons skin can be the reason why they aren't employed. I sure am crazy.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Such a narrow minded view you people are displaying on here. Freedom of choice is now racism? Get over yourselves, please! How can you not see the logic of allowing a business owner to work with whomever they choose in a business they have built themselves?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because jobs should be given out based on qualifications and experience, not cultural identity. Your view is simply discriminatory
We are talking about the freedom of a human being who has built a business to employ whoever they would prefer to work with. You are making this about race.
Your view is simply discriminatory
-
Common sense is now discriminatory? Baffling.
comment by Elvis (U7425)
How many white coaches are there that are qualified and applying for the roles alongside the black ones? If I have those figures then maybe I can see that the system is unfair, but for all I know, there might be 200,000. What is the figure please?
================
Bit of rough maths here Elvis but....
2769 qualified in England.
Minus MBE qualified makes 2298
552 jobs minus 19 held by MBE makes 533 jobs available.
So 23% of qualified white coaches hold roles within the football league and 4% held by qualified MBE coaches.
comment by He's French, He's Flash... (U9335)
posted 21 seconds ago
Your view is simply discriminatory
-
Common sense is now discriminatory? Baffling.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If you feel it is common sense to advocate for discrimination then yes, that is a baffling point of view
I have no problem with a black man not employing me because he'd prefer to work with another black man. I don't see why you have a problem with a white man having the same view.
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
"I am not advocating racism at all. I am advocating basic freedoms. I honestly cannot comprehend why someone would oppose the right of a black business owner to employ a black individual to work for him on the basis that he felt more comfortable working with someone who shared a similar heritage/background"
Depends entirely on context. The Indian restaurant is a good example, you get more of an authentic feeling being served and cooked for by Indian gentleman, so there is a distinct advantage to employing a certain ethnicity here. Same goes with Chinese, Caribbean or any other restaurants.
Personally, I'd much rather speak to somebody in the UK when dealing with my utility bills for example. I don't think that makes me racist, I just find them more efficient.
If however you are advertising for an admin role in an office, it should never matter what the person looks like or where he comes form, his ability to do the job, integrate into a team and wage demands should be the only things up for debate.
Besides, there is much more of a argument as to why there are no female coaches/ managers than any ethnicity.
comment by He's French, He's Flash... (U9335)
posted 1 minute ago
I have no problem with a black man not employing me because he'd prefer to work with another black man. I don't see why you have a problem with a white man having the same view.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because it's discrimination. Best candidate for the job. It's that simple but unfortunately when someone like you advocates for jobs being given out based on skin colour then there really isn't much of a discussion to be had. You're backward views aren't worth me wasting any moretime on.
comment by Robbing_Hoody - putting the bureaucracy into footballism since 1979 (U6374)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
How many white coaches are there that are qualified and applying for the roles alongside the black ones? If I have those figures then maybe I can see that the system is unfair, but for all I know, there might be 200,000. What is the figure please?
================
Bit of rough maths here Elvis but....
2769 qualified in England.
Minus MBE qualified makes 2298
552 jobs minus 19 held by MBE makes 533 jobs available.
So 23% of qualified white coaches hold roles within the football league and 4% held by qualified MBE coaches.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
the figures are very rough though... is that the total who got their coaching through the English FA only
Plenty get theirs through the SFA, IFA and WFA... MK Dons manager is an IFA graduate for example.
what about foreign coaches etc
The Arab/Persian restaurants around West London have a mixture of ethnic people waiting on tables, including white.
comment by He's French, He's Flash... (U9335)
posted 5 minutes ago
I have no problem with a black man not employing me because he'd prefer to work with another black man. I don't see why you have a problem with a white man having the same view.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You're going to need a bigger boat
comment by Shugs (U14253)
posted 26 seconds ago
comment by Robbing_Hoody - putting the bureaucracy into footballism since 1979 (U6374)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
How many white coaches are there that are qualified and applying for the roles alongside the black ones? If I have those figures then maybe I can see that the system is unfair, but for all I know, there might be 200,000. What is the figure please?
================
Bit of rough maths here Elvis but....
2769 qualified in England.
Minus MBE qualified makes 2298
552 jobs minus 19 held by MBE makes 533 jobs available.
So 23% of qualified white coaches hold roles within the football league and 4% held by qualified MBE coaches.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
the figures are very rough though... is that the total who got their coaching through the English FA only
Plenty get theirs through the SFA, IFA and WFA... MK Dons manager is an IFA graduate for example.
what about foreign coaches etc
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's a good point, many of these coaches will be from the continent. Surely if we are such a racist bunch the South American and European coaches wouldn't be in jobs either?
comment by Mata's Left Foot - Margot Robbie (U11781)
posted 1 minute ago
The Arab/Persian restaurants around West London have a mixture of ethnic people waiting on tables, including white.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So do most local pubs that serve pie and mash.
In fact, I'd say most of the waitresses at the restaurants I go to are Polish.
Oh God. Look it's clear to me that in the world of football black people are under represented in positions of power considering how many are in the game and I don't need a pie chart to tell me that.
White chairmen (not chairwomen I may add and the only one I can think of picked a black manager for Norwich) picking white coaches throughout Europe is obvious.
comment by Robbing_Hoody - putting the bureaucracy into footballism since 1979 (U6374)
posted 3 seconds ago
Oh God. Look it's clear to me that in the world of football black people are under represented in positions of power considering how many are in the game and I don't need a pie chart to tell me that.
White chairmen (not chairwomen I may add and the only one I can think of picked a black manager for Norwich) picking white coaches throughout Europe is obvious.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You could argue that in the AFCON tournaments their is a totally disproportionate amount of white managers of African national teams.
Would this be because Africa leads the way in welcoming all races to manage their national teams or that they believe that the white coaches are better at the job?
comment by Robbing_Hoody - putting the bureaucracy into footballism since 1979 (U6374)
posted 12 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
How many white coaches are there that are qualified and applying for the roles alongside the black ones? If I have those figures then maybe I can see that the system is unfair, but for all I know, there might be 200,000. What is the figure please?
================
Bit of rough maths here Elvis but....
2769 qualified in England.
Minus MBE qualified makes 2298
552 jobs minus 19 held by MBE makes 533 jobs available.
So 23% of qualified white coaches hold roles within the football league and 4% held by qualified MBE coaches.
------------------
But does that take into account he roles that are held by foreign coaches? There are plenty across the UK that aren't from the UK.
I am not disagreeing that there is a problem Robbing, I am just trying to educate myself as I go along.
I don't see how that alters the point though as the foreign coaches are still not black are they. I don't see how listing yet more black people, thsi time across the continent, not employed by the English game alters my point tbh.
This is pretty much how it is where I live.
MacDonalds, KFC and Burger King are about 75% operated by African Americans, the local Mexican is 90% Hispanic, Olive Garden is mixed race, the whites being mainly Italian American. The local Indian is 95% Indian, the Chinese is 100% Asian as is the Thai restaurant. The two Steak Houses are mixed race.
comment by Robbing_Hoody - putting the bureaucracy into footballism since 1979 (U6374)
posted 24 seconds ago
I don't see how that alters the point though as the foreign coaches are still not black are they. I don't see how listing yet more black people, thsi time across the continent, not employed by the English game alters my point tbh.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why would the committees of national sides in Africa pick white coaches over black coaches?
comment by Mata's Left Foot - Margot Robbie (U11781)
posted 5 minutes ago
In fact, I'd say most of the waitresses at the restaurants I go to are Polish.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The only place I see Polish people is washing my car, driving past the job centre on the way to work or my next door neighbours.
At least I think my next door neighbour is Polish, too scared to ask them.
When I lived in Wolverhampton, there was an Eastern European area, an Indian are, a Pakistani area, an English area. Then an area for those on job seekers which housed everybody (140 nationalities), even has it's own police station, a proper ghetto type of place.
It's not Brits who are racist, it's immigrants who chose not to integrate with society.
It's not Brits who are racist, it's immigrants who chose not to integrate with society.
====================
comment by Robbing_Hoody - putting the bureaucracy into footballism since 1979 (U6374)
posted 2 minutes ago
I don't see how that alters the point though as the foreign coaches are still not black are they. I don't see how listing yet more black people, thsi time across the continent, not employed by the English game alters my point tbh.
----------------------
Well are you know assuming that the other roles are all held by white UK coaches? If 50% of those jobs are actually held by foreign coaches, your figures could be way off. Just trying to get my head around it all.
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John Barnes
Page 9 of 15
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posted on 30/3/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 30/3/15
comment by He's French, He's Flash... (U9335)
posted 44 seconds ago
comment by Greatteamswinit4times- A terrible enemy (U6008)
posted 10 seconds ago
comment by He's French, He's Flash... (U9335)
posted 15 seconds ago
comment by Greatteamswinit4times- A terrible enemy (U6008)
posted 47 seconds ago
comment by He's French, He's Flash... (U9335)
posted 1 minute ago
Wow, that race card is getting over-played on this thread. Entitlement Britain fully evident here.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Yawn. Yes, entitlement Britain, pc gone made blah blah blah. All you hear is this from people of certain beliefs. If someone doesn't agree with a point of view then it's obviously entitlement Britain gone mad. Definitely.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Says the guy who is shocked by the prospect of a business owner having the freedom to employ whomever he/she wants.. What was it you said, "wow?"
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I did indeed say wow at the thought of someone thinking that the colour of a persons skin can be the reason why they aren't employed. I sure am crazy.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Such a narrow minded view you people are displaying on here. Freedom of choice is now racism? Get over yourselves, please! How can you not see the logic of allowing a business owner to work with whomever they choose in a business they have built themselves?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because jobs should be given out based on qualifications and experience, not cultural identity. Your view is simply discriminatory
posted on 30/3/15
We are talking about the freedom of a human being who has built a business to employ whoever they would prefer to work with. You are making this about race.
posted on 30/3/15
Your view is simply discriminatory
-
Common sense is now discriminatory? Baffling.
posted on 30/3/15
comment by Elvis (U7425)
How many white coaches are there that are qualified and applying for the roles alongside the black ones? If I have those figures then maybe I can see that the system is unfair, but for all I know, there might be 200,000. What is the figure please?
================
Bit of rough maths here Elvis but....
2769 qualified in England.
Minus MBE qualified makes 2298
552 jobs minus 19 held by MBE makes 533 jobs available.
So 23% of qualified white coaches hold roles within the football league and 4% held by qualified MBE coaches.
posted on 30/3/15
comment by He's French, He's Flash... (U9335)
posted 21 seconds ago
Your view is simply discriminatory
-
Common sense is now discriminatory? Baffling.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If you feel it is common sense to advocate for discrimination then yes, that is a baffling point of view
posted on 30/3/15
I have no problem with a black man not employing me because he'd prefer to work with another black man. I don't see why you have a problem with a white man having the same view.
posted on 30/3/15
Comment deleted by Site Moderator
posted on 30/3/15
"I am not advocating racism at all. I am advocating basic freedoms. I honestly cannot comprehend why someone would oppose the right of a black business owner to employ a black individual to work for him on the basis that he felt more comfortable working with someone who shared a similar heritage/background"
Depends entirely on context. The Indian restaurant is a good example, you get more of an authentic feeling being served and cooked for by Indian gentleman, so there is a distinct advantage to employing a certain ethnicity here. Same goes with Chinese, Caribbean or any other restaurants.
Personally, I'd much rather speak to somebody in the UK when dealing with my utility bills for example. I don't think that makes me racist, I just find them more efficient.
If however you are advertising for an admin role in an office, it should never matter what the person looks like or where he comes form, his ability to do the job, integrate into a team and wage demands should be the only things up for debate.
Besides, there is much more of a argument as to why there are no female coaches/ managers than any ethnicity.
posted on 30/3/15
comment by He's French, He's Flash... (U9335)
posted 1 minute ago
I have no problem with a black man not employing me because he'd prefer to work with another black man. I don't see why you have a problem with a white man having the same view.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Because it's discrimination. Best candidate for the job. It's that simple but unfortunately when someone like you advocates for jobs being given out based on skin colour then there really isn't much of a discussion to be had. You're backward views aren't worth me wasting any moretime on.
posted on 30/3/15
comment by Robbing_Hoody - putting the bureaucracy into footballism since 1979 (U6374)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
How many white coaches are there that are qualified and applying for the roles alongside the black ones? If I have those figures then maybe I can see that the system is unfair, but for all I know, there might be 200,000. What is the figure please?
================
Bit of rough maths here Elvis but....
2769 qualified in England.
Minus MBE qualified makes 2298
552 jobs minus 19 held by MBE makes 533 jobs available.
So 23% of qualified white coaches hold roles within the football league and 4% held by qualified MBE coaches.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
the figures are very rough though... is that the total who got their coaching through the English FA only
Plenty get theirs through the SFA, IFA and WFA... MK Dons manager is an IFA graduate for example.
what about foreign coaches etc
posted on 30/3/15
The Arab/Persian restaurants around West London have a mixture of ethnic people waiting on tables, including white.
posted on 30/3/15
comment by He's French, He's Flash... (U9335)
posted 5 minutes ago
I have no problem with a black man not employing me because he'd prefer to work with another black man. I don't see why you have a problem with a white man having the same view.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You're going to need a bigger boat
posted on 30/3/15
comment by Shugs (U14253)
posted 26 seconds ago
comment by Robbing_Hoody - putting the bureaucracy into footballism since 1979 (U6374)
posted 3 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
How many white coaches are there that are qualified and applying for the roles alongside the black ones? If I have those figures then maybe I can see that the system is unfair, but for all I know, there might be 200,000. What is the figure please?
================
Bit of rough maths here Elvis but....
2769 qualified in England.
Minus MBE qualified makes 2298
552 jobs minus 19 held by MBE makes 533 jobs available.
So 23% of qualified white coaches hold roles within the football league and 4% held by qualified MBE coaches.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
the figures are very rough though... is that the total who got their coaching through the English FA only
Plenty get theirs through the SFA, IFA and WFA... MK Dons manager is an IFA graduate for example.
what about foreign coaches etc
----------------------------------------------------------------------
That's a good point, many of these coaches will be from the continent. Surely if we are such a racist bunch the South American and European coaches wouldn't be in jobs either?
posted on 30/3/15
comment by Mata's Left Foot - Margot Robbie (U11781)
posted 1 minute ago
The Arab/Persian restaurants around West London have a mixture of ethnic people waiting on tables, including white.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
So do most local pubs that serve pie and mash.
posted on 30/3/15
In fact, I'd say most of the waitresses at the restaurants I go to are Polish.
posted on 30/3/15
Oh God. Look it's clear to me that in the world of football black people are under represented in positions of power considering how many are in the game and I don't need a pie chart to tell me that.
White chairmen (not chairwomen I may add and the only one I can think of picked a black manager for Norwich) picking white coaches throughout Europe is obvious.
posted on 30/3/15
comment by Robbing_Hoody - putting the bureaucracy into footballism since 1979 (U6374)
posted 3 seconds ago
Oh God. Look it's clear to me that in the world of football black people are under represented in positions of power considering how many are in the game and I don't need a pie chart to tell me that.
White chairmen (not chairwomen I may add and the only one I can think of picked a black manager for Norwich) picking white coaches throughout Europe is obvious.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
You could argue that in the AFCON tournaments their is a totally disproportionate amount of white managers of African national teams.
Would this be because Africa leads the way in welcoming all races to manage their national teams or that they believe that the white coaches are better at the job?
posted on 30/3/15
comment by Robbing_Hoody - putting the bureaucracy into footballism since 1979 (U6374)
posted 12 minutes ago
comment by Elvis (U7425)
How many white coaches are there that are qualified and applying for the roles alongside the black ones? If I have those figures then maybe I can see that the system is unfair, but for all I know, there might be 200,000. What is the figure please?
================
Bit of rough maths here Elvis but....
2769 qualified in England.
Minus MBE qualified makes 2298
552 jobs minus 19 held by MBE makes 533 jobs available.
So 23% of qualified white coaches hold roles within the football league and 4% held by qualified MBE coaches.
------------------
But does that take into account he roles that are held by foreign coaches? There are plenty across the UK that aren't from the UK.
I am not disagreeing that there is a problem Robbing, I am just trying to educate myself as I go along.
posted on 30/3/15
I don't see how that alters the point though as the foreign coaches are still not black are they. I don't see how listing yet more black people, thsi time across the continent, not employed by the English game alters my point tbh.
posted on 30/3/15
This is pretty much how it is where I live.
MacDonalds, KFC and Burger King are about 75% operated by African Americans, the local Mexican is 90% Hispanic, Olive Garden is mixed race, the whites being mainly Italian American. The local Indian is 95% Indian, the Chinese is 100% Asian as is the Thai restaurant. The two Steak Houses are mixed race.
posted on 30/3/15
comment by Robbing_Hoody - putting the bureaucracy into footballism since 1979 (U6374)
posted 24 seconds ago
I don't see how that alters the point though as the foreign coaches are still not black are they. I don't see how listing yet more black people, thsi time across the continent, not employed by the English game alters my point tbh.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Why would the committees of national sides in Africa pick white coaches over black coaches?
posted on 30/3/15
comment by Mata's Left Foot - Margot Robbie (U11781)
posted 5 minutes ago
In fact, I'd say most of the waitresses at the restaurants I go to are Polish.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The only place I see Polish people is washing my car, driving past the job centre on the way to work or my next door neighbours.
At least I think my next door neighbour is Polish, too scared to ask them.
When I lived in Wolverhampton, there was an Eastern European area, an Indian are, a Pakistani area, an English area. Then an area for those on job seekers which housed everybody (140 nationalities), even has it's own police station, a proper ghetto type of place.
It's not Brits who are racist, it's immigrants who chose not to integrate with society.
posted on 30/3/15
It's not Brits who are racist, it's immigrants who chose not to integrate with society.
====================
posted on 30/3/15
comment by Robbing_Hoody - putting the bureaucracy into footballism since 1979 (U6374)
posted 2 minutes ago
I don't see how that alters the point though as the foreign coaches are still not black are they. I don't see how listing yet more black people, thsi time across the continent, not employed by the English game alters my point tbh.
----------------------
Well are you know assuming that the other roles are all held by white UK coaches? If 50% of those jobs are actually held by foreign coaches, your figures could be way off. Just trying to get my head around it all.
Page 9 of 15
10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14